Pony Bottle, worth it?
- Thread starter Scubaru_Steve
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Hatul
Contributor
I'm surprised you'd make such a bad analogy. If your car runs out of gas it's a major inconvenience but you don't die (unless you're in south LA).
Furthermore there are many other potential failures where redundant air is lifesaving besides forgetting to look at SPG.
Adam
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My earliest reference to spare tires in this thread mentioned me driving thru Arizona backroads. I can't imagine much of a need for an extra 5 gallons of gas if I fill up everyday, which I did when I took the grandkids over the Mesas road of the Navajo and Hopi reservations almost all day once in March - but I'm wondering if I should have had two spare tires?
OP
Scubaru_Steve
Contributor
Wow this thread has gone a lot farther than I thought it would.
Here is what I was basically asking....
Is it wise to take with me a spare supply of air on dives being that I often dive in new locations with random partners and never know what mess I'll be into?
I'm an avid outdoorsman. I've been on week long hikes through the woods in the middle of no where, I've climbed rock faces and worked at a climbing tower, I've kayaked and white water rafted. And in every scenario there were multiple ways to safely get out of a situation.
I feel the same should apply for scuba diving. Sure a well planned dive "should" have no problems but its been overly explained through the 9 pages of this thread that the unexpected can be about anything. Sure on dives you have a dive buddy, but thats like saying if I'm on a walk with a friend he will instantly know what to do if I fell over with a heart attack. Not everyone is a well qualified diver and wouldn't freak out in any situation. And being that I haven't met enough divers yet to have regular dive buddies, there is even more a scare situation down there.
A pony bottle to me is a simple matter of mental security. A dive to below 60' should be 99% fine, but its that 1% that I want to cover. That one percent could be the bad air, tangled equipment, low tank pressure....
Here is what I was basically asking....
Is it wise to take with me a spare supply of air on dives being that I often dive in new locations with random partners and never know what mess I'll be into?
I'm an avid outdoorsman. I've been on week long hikes through the woods in the middle of no where, I've climbed rock faces and worked at a climbing tower, I've kayaked and white water rafted. And in every scenario there were multiple ways to safely get out of a situation.
I feel the same should apply for scuba diving. Sure a well planned dive "should" have no problems but its been overly explained through the 9 pages of this thread that the unexpected can be about anything. Sure on dives you have a dive buddy, but thats like saying if I'm on a walk with a friend he will instantly know what to do if I fell over with a heart attack. Not everyone is a well qualified diver and wouldn't freak out in any situation. And being that I haven't met enough divers yet to have regular dive buddies, there is even more a scare situation down there.
A pony bottle to me is a simple matter of mental security. A dive to below 60' should be 99% fine, but its that 1% that I want to cover. That one percent could be the bad air, tangled equipment, low tank pressure....
captain
Contributor
"A pony bottle to me is a simple matter of mental security." Yep, much more mental then real.
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Many of the old time divers learned scuba when the plan was that when you ran out of air, you ascended. Today they carry spgs, but some still object to redundant safety devices. Old ways die hard. Then lots of divers have been trained on their old ways and old ideas and use that to justify not bothering to have redundant air supplies, as it is more trouble and money. Imagine how many would take up diving if agencies and stores warned the prospective student that owning and diving a pony was a good idea?
Just avoid divers who think that redundant safety is unneeded. Haha, ask them how they make sure their tank air is safe? Firefighters won't use out out of date ideas on that and they don't go to extra atmospheres often.
Just avoid divers who think that redundant safety is unneeded. Haha, ask them how they make sure their tank air is safe? Firefighters won't use out out of date ideas on that and they don't go to extra atmospheres often.
modzs
Contributor
I've never dived a pony bottle and said, "Damn, I wish I didn't bring this with me", nor have I heard anyone say something similar.
I suggest that the OP just get a pony bottle and learn how to use it. The more you dive with it the less it become a piece of "extra" equipment.
I suggest that the OP just get a pony bottle and learn how to use it. The more you dive with it the less it become a piece of "extra" equipment.
bj139
Contributor
Quote Originally Posted by bj139
I bought a 19cuft pony when my first dive after my certification I watched the entire group swim off in the distance at 60ft. 60 ft is deep to a newbie who has only been to 40 ft. They waited and I swam like hell to catch them. Yesterday I dove at the site where the 15 year old drowned but was with a buddy I knew would not swim off. We were at 80ft and I knew where my RAS was every 30 seconds. I did not take the pony bottle. I consider the pony bottle to be a cheap form of life insurance; only I get to collect on the policy if I need it. If I dive with people I don't know or I dive deep, I take the pony. I guess 80ft is getting deep. Looking up, a CESA from 80ft seems an awful long way up.
Quote Originally Posted by DandyDon
Why didn't you take the pony? Wow.
My comment indicates some concern over my options on OOA. That brings up a related question. How many multiple redundancies are necessary? My buddy had a pony so between us we had 3 independent RAS. If I had my pony it would be 4. Maybe I should carry 2 pony bottles. You mentioned needing 2 spare tires on a desert trip. Maybe you should. Sorry if this sounds confrontational. I don't mean it as such. Because of this I can understand how some people consider a pony unnecessary. For me personally, I think I should just try to always carry the pony as you suggest. It could be inconvenient when taking pictures. The risk of entaglement is all the lanyards you are carrying; sling bottle, camera lanyard, light lanyard; where's my knife?
Do you think it can add to multiple task loading and lead to problems?
I bought a 19cuft pony when my first dive after my certification I watched the entire group swim off in the distance at 60ft. 60 ft is deep to a newbie who has only been to 40 ft. They waited and I swam like hell to catch them. Yesterday I dove at the site where the 15 year old drowned but was with a buddy I knew would not swim off. We were at 80ft and I knew where my RAS was every 30 seconds. I did not take the pony bottle. I consider the pony bottle to be a cheap form of life insurance; only I get to collect on the policy if I need it. If I dive with people I don't know or I dive deep, I take the pony. I guess 80ft is getting deep. Looking up, a CESA from 80ft seems an awful long way up.
Quote Originally Posted by DandyDon
Why didn't you take the pony? Wow.
My comment indicates some concern over my options on OOA. That brings up a related question. How many multiple redundancies are necessary? My buddy had a pony so between us we had 3 independent RAS. If I had my pony it would be 4. Maybe I should carry 2 pony bottles. You mentioned needing 2 spare tires on a desert trip. Maybe you should. Sorry if this sounds confrontational. I don't mean it as such. Because of this I can understand how some people consider a pony unnecessary. For me personally, I think I should just try to always carry the pony as you suggest. It could be inconvenient when taking pictures. The risk of entaglement is all the lanyards you are carrying; sling bottle, camera lanyard, light lanyard; where's my knife?
Do you think it can add to multiple task loading and lead to problems?
idive2
Contributor
My decision when to carry a pony is based on the dive I may be doing and not whether or not I have
a good buddy. At 120 feet you need to be able to take care of YOUR emergency with YOUR equipment. I hear
a lot of references of "my buddy has this and my buddy has that". If you are counting on what your buddy
has where does this leave you when by some chance you have an emergency and your buddy with
things you were counting on is either out of sight or out of reach ? Good buddies are great but don't
plan your dive on what gear they may be carrying. I would say the deeper you go the more important
understanding this is.
a good buddy. At 120 feet you need to be able to take care of YOUR emergency with YOUR equipment. I hear
a lot of references of "my buddy has this and my buddy has that". If you are counting on what your buddy
has where does this leave you when by some chance you have an emergency and your buddy with
things you were counting on is either out of sight or out of reach ? Good buddies are great but don't
plan your dive on what gear they may be carrying. I would say the deeper you go the more important
understanding this is.
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