Diver dies in Islamorada

[bsee65]

FOr those who wish we wouldn't analyze an accident to see if there are lesons to be learned, there is a place for you. Start a condolences thread in the appropriate forum and do your reading and posting there. That board is for the type of things you are hoping to see. This one is for trying to understand what may have gone wrong in an accident so that the rest of us can learn from it.

With regard to the number of crew, my reading is that the article leads you to believe there were at least two crew on deck at the time of the incident. With regard to the "instructor" in the water, the DM probably holds an instructor certification and was referred to as such in the article even though there may not have been any class in session. Normally, reporters like to tell us when someone has an accident during a class because it sounds more sensational, so I suspect that wouldn't have been left out.

A 42' boat? You would think there would be a line and a flotation ring handy on a boat that size. If she were conscious at the time of separation, a crew member could have tossed it to her and hauled her back in. If not, they could have grabbed it and jumped in after her.

You also have to wonder about the timeline. According to the second article, the group was at 10-15fsw when the victim thumbed the dive. Did the rest of the group hang there until the instructor returned, or did they descend without him? How long did it take her to get to the ladder before she was lost? How long did the crew wait before they called everyione in? How deep did they get and how long did it take them to get back up?

So, what are we learning so far? When a diver thumbs a dive at the start because of physical or mental discomfort, they should receive total care until returned to deck or shore. Once a diver starts removing gear to board, they are vulnerable. A dive boat with a single crew member left on board has to make a hard decision if there is a diver in trouble, but with more than one crew on board, someone should make an immediate and aggressive attempt at rescue. Some sort of life ring with a line as well as a boat hook ought to be handy on deck with crew that has drilled on their use.

When it comes down to it, we can't figure out what happened here until more facts come in. Maybe the victim wasn't rescuable. We don't know if anything could have been done differently to create a positive outcome. What we do know is that there are a number of things that should be done in such a situation whether or not they were done here.

 

[dumpsterDiver]

I have dove with Key Dives on several occasions and have dove the Eagle with them. Generally dive operators in the Keys do not put DMs in the water with the divers unless you pay extra, however, Key Dives is not one of these operations. They will put DMs in on all their dives, and the DMs are usually certified instructors. When diving the Eagle the DMs have been very cautious. The only disappointment I have had with Key Dives is when we were planning to dive the Eagle and the trip was moved to a shallow reef because there were inexperienced divers on the boat. Of course this was for the inexperienced divers safety.

As to why it would take so long to retrieve the distressed diver after she lost consiousness, that would be due to the time it took to recall the other divers from a 100' plus dive. Since the instructor returned to the group after assisting the distressed diver to the surface, the only one on the boat would have been the captain. The currents in that area are sometimes strong and it would not be advisable for the captain to jump in and leave no one on the boat. That could have turned it into an even greater tragedy.

Our thoughts and prayers go out to the diver and family.

A professional crew would have been fully prepared for this kind of incident. It is entirely foreseeable that a diver will make it close to the stern and then for what ever reason, become stressed and incapacitated and begin to float away.

If the captain decided that the SOP for this situation was NOT to untie from a fixed mooring and drift back with the diver in the current and wind and then engage the engine(s) to effect a pick up...


THEN...... the SOP should have been that the deck crew would be fully prepared at a moments notice to enter the water (preferably with fins and mask at least) and swim a tethered float ball (emergency floatation device) back to the drifting diver, to then grab onto the diver and have the capt and or other crew haul the rescuer and victim back up current and into the boat.

If the emergency were dealt with swiftly and efficeintly, the victim would not drift back more than maybe 200 feet and the recovery would be pretty fast.

We have to realize that the stern is a very dangerous place and it would be quite easy for a diver to fall while climbing a ladder, smack their head and loose conciousness or otherwise become disabled. This type of back deck emergency should have very specific SOP associated with it and I repeat is entirely foreseeable.

I would expect that the boat would also have a long trail line off the stern with a float at the end. If this was in place, the rescuerer could simply swim the rope laterally over to the victim (a relatively short distance unless the wind was in an adverse direction and very strong).

 

[Cave Diver]

Fins on wrist when climbing the ladder

Yep,thats the way I do it,but not many people do.

A diver without fins is pretty much helpless.

Ditto. I never pass fins up on a boat. They're either on my feet or on my wrists.

 

[Ayisha]

Here is the text from the link above, posted for longevity:

by Alicia E. Barrón

Posted on April 15, 2010 at 8:34 PM

Updated yesterday at 9:31 PM

SURPRISE – A Surprise woman died mysteriously on Thursday while diving off an island in the Florida Keys.

Her husband was diving with her and he spoke exclusively with 3TV’s Jared Dillingham about what happened in the moments before his wife drifted away.

Dominic Diodatos showed 3TV photographs of him and Aviva Diodatos diving in the Florida Keys last year. The couple was back on the same boat Thursday but this time something went terribly wrong.

Dom tells 3TV via phone, “She probably got down to 12, 13 feet when she started back up."

Nevertheless, Aviva never made it onto the boat and she let go of the dive line. Diodatos explains, “For whatever reason, she lost the line. She either let go or it got pulled out of her hand from a wake or something.”

As Aviva drifted away the captain brought Dominic and the other divers back to the boat. He explains, “They told me she was adrift and, you know, everybody was back onboard and we went to look for her at which point we did locate her but it was too late."

The Diodatos are long-time Arizona residents who love the water. They had returned to the Florida Keys this week for advanced open water dive training.

Dominic says his wife was in good health. “Last time she signaled me was the ok sign.” He adds, “She loved diving. This was her passion."

The coroner is conducting an autopsy and Dominic should have some answers by Friday.

It's not clear whether the couple had completed their Advanced O/W cert earlier this week or if the Eagle dive was part of that certification. I'm not sure what training agency they were using, but if the Eagle was part of the certification dives, the depth violates the 100 foot max hard bottom that some training agencies have for certification dives. We don't know though if this dive was a training dive or not, but within the first week of Advanced training and presumably with little advanced experience, the Eagle or any of the Keys wrecks can be too challenging, especially in the conditions reported.

 

[Ayisha]

If the captain decided that the SOP for this situation was NOT to untie from a fixed mooring and drift back with the diver in the current and wind and then engage the engine(s) to effect a pick up...

This sounds like a very workable plan in this situation given that the buddy was not with her; the instructor did not see her safely onto the boat; the crew did not hold onto her as she removed her gear; and the crew did not jump in after her to assist. After that sequence of events, the captain could have done as you said above without endangering other divers.

 

[Web Monkey]

When it comes down to it, we can't figure out what happened here until more facts come in. Maybe the victim wasn't rescuable. We don't know if anything could have been done differently to create a positive outcome. What we do know is that there are a number of things that should be done in such a situation whether or not they were done here.

What we've really learned is that if the diver followed training, which includes:

• Re-boarding with fins on her wrist
• A regulator in her mouth
• Her buddy nearby

she would not have been left drifting, wouldn't aspirate water (no idea if this happened, but a reg would prevent it) and would presumably have received immediate first aid.

The is Yet Another Fatality involving buddy separation.

Maybe first aid wouldn't have helped, but I'm pretty sure that floating for 15 minutes didn't do any good either.

Terry

 

[Ayisha]

Fins on wrist when climbing the ladder

Yep,thats the way I do it,but not many people do.

A diver without fins is pretty much helpless.

Ditto. I never pass fins up on a boat. They're either on my feet or on my wrists.

What we've really learned is that if the diver followed training, which includes:

• Re-boarding with fins on her wrist

For some women and some types of fins/fin straps, getting the fin straps over the wrists may be difficult to do.

I have spring straps and my very small feet don't extend past the foot pocket (XS), so neither do my spring straps. I cannot get my hand through my straps, so if I must, I put my fingers through the straps and hold onto the ladder too. My grip on a ladder is not as secure as it could be, especially in rough seas. A fins-on ladder is so much more preferred.

 

[dumpsterDiver]

by Alicia E. Barrón

Posted on April 15, 2010 at 8:34 PM

Updated yesterday at 9:31 PM

SURPRISE – A Surprise woman died mysteriously on Thursday while diving off an island in the Florida Keys.

Her husband was diving with her and he spoke exclusively with 3TV’s Jared Dillingham about what happened in the moments before his wife drifted away.

Dominic Diodatos showed 3TV photographs of him and Aviva Diodatos diving in the Florida Keys last year. The couple was back on the same boat Thursday but this time something went terribly wrong.

Dom tells 3TV via phone, “She probably got down to 12, 13 feet when she started back up."

Nevertheless, Aviva never made it onto the boat and she let go of the dive line. Diodatos explains, “For whatever reason, she lost the line. She either let go or it got pulled out of her hand from a wake or something.”

As Aviva drifted away the captain brought Dominic and the other divers back to the boat. He explains, “They told me she was adrift and, you know, everybody was back onboard and we went to look for her at which point we did locate her but it was too late."

The Diodatos are long-time Arizona residents who love the water. They had returned to the Florida Keys this week for advanced open water dive training.

Dominic says his wife was in good health. “Last time she signaled me was the ok sign.” He adds, “She loved diving. This was her passion."

The coroner is conducting an autopsy and Dominic should have some answers by Friday.



In this type of situation, where a diver appears to be ok, but is drifting back away from the boat and not actively swimming back and also fails to swim to or toward a tethered floation device (that should have already been deployed before anyone got in the water), then the deck crew should have been prepared to immediately enter the water and make sure the diver "makes it onto the line". Any diver that passively drifts off and is unwilling or incapable of getting onto the trail line, warrants a rescue. In rough conditions, the importance of a rescue is even more urgent. This is not rocket science.

 

[JonKranhouse]

I'm not sure I'd go so far as to say "someone let her down" but rather it quite possibly was an unfortunate set of circumstances in play, to say someone let her down is casting judgment with out all the facts.

I disagree. I believe this is a result of predictable systemic failures. Rather than speculating a he-said / she-said (i.e. the instructor says, "Ms. Diodato appeared OK when we arrived back at the swim-step and must have succumbed sometime later"), failure to rescue is failure to rescue. What’s the instructor’s rush? The divers below were, presumably, already certified (per report this was a training dive for the victim’s AOW certification). Why not wait a few minutes for Ms. Diodato to reboard? There are good medical reasons for doing so, particularly for someone over 50, even with a healthy heart. There may be critical gaps in information given by training agencies to dive professionals -- so I don’t put all blame on Ms. Diodato’s instructor.

“Go ahead, I’ll be fine” is an entirely predictable response to come from ANY student who causes disruption in a dive class. A student would naturally feel a little guilty for slowing things down for others. That’s human nature, and dive professionals should be trained to expect this “guilt” response, but to NOT believe “I’ll be fine.” Guilt under these circumstances could mask predictable and immediate risks.

YEARS AGO the diving medical community disseminated information not taught by dive training agencies to recreational dive professionals. Today, it’s common for some dive pros on ScubaBoard to blame a pre-existing cardiac condition, almost reflexively. Sometimes that may be true. But consider these comments from the UHMS’ 1997 Near Drowning Workshop.

page 32/38 of PDF (excerpts, emphases added):

Dr. Lundgren: ...in immersion, say, at the surface, head out, the redistribution of blood...is quite marked. We've measured with dye dilution technique up toward a liter of blood being forced into the chest. You have a profound distention of the heart and increase in preload-and distention of the heart is arrhythmogenic by itself [i.e. causes abnormal electrical heart rhythm]...with the diving response we have seen amazing levels of arrhythmia in these healthy people. One of our subjects had a period of 45 seconds without a single sinus peak.

Dr. Neuman: ...there is no pathologic evidence for a fresh myocardial infarction, microscopically...the problem is that in these people who die sudden arrhythmic deaths [which could be aggravated by the immersion phenomenon], there is no way of telling what has happened to them, and you can only look for sort of corollary evidence that they may have a risk factor for a sudden arrhythmic death... And so this is one of the epidemiologic problems that you have to face, that we simply are going to have to accept the fact that it may not be possible to tell.

Dr. Dueker: I think that is absolutely beyond doubt, and if some one has an arrhythmic death, which certainly can occur, without coronary calcifications, but even with coronary problems, the pathologist isn't going to be able to help [and call it a drowning]
​

In my opinion, THIS 70-PAGE PDF SHOULD BE MANDATORY READING FOR ALL DIVE PROFESSIONALS. Training agencies should require mastery of this knowledge by DMs. Doing so could save lives and IMPROVE OUTCOMES: Near Drowning Workshop.

page 8/14 of PDF (excerpts, emphases added):

It is paradoxical that drowning, which causes more than 80 times the number of deaths in recreational divers than either decompression sickness or contaminated air, does not rate more than a paragraph or two in some diving medical texts.​

Page 58 / 64 of PDF (excerpts, emphases added):

Mr. Huggins: ...at the [Catalina Island recompression chamber]... at least once or twice a year we get reports of a pulseless diver being...pulled out. They're pulseless, citizen CPR was done on them and by the time they get to us they're awake, talking, and so forth. ...everybody I've...been able to contact were ...certain that this diver had no pulse when they were being pulled out.

Dr. Brown: I want to reiterate that in the field or with a more naive examiner, pulses are easy to miss. If the victim is cold and vascularly constricted, pulses are very easy to miss. Second, many examiners don't adhere to American Heart Association guidelines by feeling at the carotid. That's the correct place to find a pulse, not anywhere else.

Dr. Dueker: Yes, I don't know whether they had a pulse or not. There's no way of knowing...

Mr. Huggins: My concern is people's overconfidence in citizen CPR being able to help a pulseless person, bring them back.

Mr. Graver: ...I teach CPR recertification [to]... EMTs and first responders... pulse checks are supposed to be for 5 to 10 seconds, which is forever when you think you're dealing with a dead person. Secondly, if that person is cold, the pulse check is supposed to be even longer. So I would really doubt that they're doing an adequate pulse check in the field.

Next, I rescued a person once that wasn't breathing and I established breathing and knew that he was breathing, but I couldn't find a pulse on him to save me, and we were in [a benign office environment]. ...that victims may have a pulse and citizens can't find it because the pulse isn't strong enough, the responders are cold themselves, or they probably don't check it long enough.

Dr. Hattori: ...I went through a residency in radiology in the 50s and we did direct carotid sticks for the cerebral arteriogram and I did maybe a dozen a week, and I still have a difficult time trying to find a carotid pulse to figure out where to stick the needle.​

This pivotal information underscores the need for AEDs, as drowning recovery after “citizen CPR” is poor despite what you may have read.

 

[East West]

Has anybody stated if she was sea sick while hanging on the latter . Being sea sick in the water can bring serious problems to anybody even experienced divers . Me and a tec diver went out to make a 150 foot wreck dive . He got sea sick on the way there and we rested till he felt better. He went first in the water and while making a back roll his argon or oxygen bottle smacked him in the head. It almost knocked him out and he could of drown . That incident may have been caused by sea sickness