Diver dies in Islamorada

[Mike Boswell]

Dr. Lundgren: ...in immersion, say, at the surface, head out, the redistribution of blood...is quite marked. We've measured with dye dilution technique up toward a liter of blood being forced into the chest. You have a profound distention of the heart and increase in preload-and distention of the heart is arrhythmogenic by itself [i.e. causes abnormal electrical heart rhythm]...with the diving response we have seen amazing levels of arrhythmia in these healthy people. One of our subjects had a period of 45 seconds without a single sinus peak.

Jon, this is interesting, but I'm not too sure what it means. Could you please elaborate, in non-medical language? Is there any way to prevent or manage this phenomenon?

 

[Mike Boswell]

Assuming one's BCD is functioning what swimming is required in these situations? If an initial effort to kick back to the boat fails due to current one needs only to bob above water with the assitance of a BCD until picked up. I will never agree to hand over fins again while attempting to board a boat having read this thread. That's why these discussions are valuable...

Lastly, if the diver was not utilizing paddle or blade fins no amount of effort would have you make headway against a material current if disconnected with the trail line...

Good swimming skill isn't just about moving through the water. Good swimmers are comfortable in the water, are calm and aware of their surroundings, are experienced in dealing with problems, and have developed the alertness, experience, strength and fitness needed to survive.

On the surface, good swimmers are much less likely to panic, forget to inflate their BCD, forget to ditch their weights, gulp water, fail to grab onto a current line or a rescue float, or get banged on the head by a boarding ladder.

Good swimmers can swim faster against a current, can keep their head above water in choppy seas, and have the presence of mind to ditch gear if necessary to swim to a boat.

 

[Scubakevdm]

I think that it is a good idea to wrist fins for the egress, but i'm not sure that in this case it might have made alot of difference. We have a diver that aborted the dive very early, so we can maybe assume that her tank was almost full. She was floating, albeit away from the boat. Drifting on the surface, even on a rough day isn't too perilous, especially with a full tank. But there are still critical details that don't appear. Was her reg in, or out? Was she trying to swim against the current, back to the boat, or was she incapacitated?

 

[dumpsterDiver]

I think that it is a good idea to wrist fins for the egress, but i'm not sure that in this case it might have made alot of difference. We have a diver that aborted the dive very early, so we can maybe assume that her tank was almost full. She was floating, albeit away from the boat. Drifting on the surface, even on a rough day isn't too perilous, especially with a full tank. But there are still critical details that don't appear. Was her reg in, or out? Was she trying to swim against the current, back to the boat, or was she incapacitated?

If she made it to only 12-13 ft depth, it is possible her tank was off and she made it that deep by breathing only the air from the pressurized regulator. My only true underwater rescue was associated with a women who made it to 60 feet with her tank OFF.

 

[High & Dry]

A professional crew would have been fully prepared for this kind of incident. It is entirely foreseeable that a diver will make it close to the stern and then for what ever reason, become stressed and incapacitated and begin to float away.

If the captain decided that the SOP for this situation was NOT to untie from a fixed mooring and drift back with the diver in the current and wind and then engage the engine(s) to effect a pick up...


THEN...... the SOP should have been that the deck crew would be fully prepared at a moments notice to enter the water (preferably with fins and mask at least) and swim a tethered float ball (emergency floatation device) back to the drifting diver, to then grab onto the diver and have the capt and or other crew haul the rescuer and victim back up current and into the boat.


If the emergency were dealt with swiftly and efficeintly, the victim would not drift back more than maybe 200 feet and the recovery would be pretty fast.

We have to realize that the stern is a very dangerous place and it would be quite easy for a diver to fall while climbing a ladder, smack their head and loose conciousness or otherwise become disabled. This type of back deck emergency should have very specific SOP associated with it and I repeat is entirely foreseeable.

I would expect that the boat would also have a long trail line off the stern with a float at the end. If this was in place, the rescuerer could simply swim the rope laterally over to the victim (a relatively short distance unless the wind was in an adverse direction and very strong).

Thanks for all the "SOP" BS. Apparently you did not read my post very closely and you have not dove this operation. As with many dive boats the "deck crew" when divers are in the water is the captain only. Have you ever tried to lift an unconscious person on dry land by yourself? It would be next to impossible for one person to lift that same person from the water into a pitching boat by themselves. The captain attempting a solo rescue would just put more people in danger.

The "SOP" for most dive boats I've been on is that when there is an emergency recall the divers in the water first. Starting engines over divers in the water is very dangerous and disconnecting from the moorings with one person on the boat would also be risky. Then say the captain did get get to the unconscious diver by himself, again he's not going to be able to get the diver back in the boat. I suppose he could tie a rope to the diver and tow her back to the mooring ball, just as the other divers are surfacing unawares and chop them up with the prop. Wow! good plan.

 

[Ayisha]

Have you ever tried to lift an unconscious person on dry land by yourself? It would be next to impossible for one person to lift that same person from the water into a pitching boat by themselves. The captain attempting a solo rescue would just put more people in danger.

So are you saying that you know for a fact that:
1. The captain was alone on the boat?
2. The woman was unconscious right at the boat?

 

[Jax]

Yo, Peace, peeps . . .

Let's not start getting aggressive and putting words in each others mouths. This is a delicate subject and one should check their passions at the door.

The only things we know are what were in the news reports, and most of us conclude news reports are riddled with inaccuracies.

 

[Web Monkey]

Disclaimer . . . no expert here with my 80ish dives, but would like to put a thought forward to those who question that her husband-buddy didn't accompany her.

I have a standing agreement with my husband-buddy that if I start a dive, and find it isn't going to 'work' for me (never mind the reasons), he goes on with the group if I thumb the dive.

That's a bad move.

You can't count on anybody that you didn't bring with you, and don't personally know is a capable diver and who is responsible only for you and themselves.

A little Googling will turn up any number of threads here where the buddies split up because one wanted to go somewhere/do something and the other didn't, or one wanted to end the dive early or continue it longer.

If you and your husband go diving and one of you doesn't want to continue, you should both return to the boat. There's always the next dive.

If he likes diving more/deeper/longer/whatever than you do, he can find more buddies to dive with in addition to you, but if you hit the water together, you should exit together. Anything else is just a crap-shoot.

Generally it work out OK, except when it doesn't, then it's really bad.

Terry

 

[Mike Boswell]

That's a bad move. ....If he likes diving more/deeper/longer/whatever than you do, he can find more buddies to dive with in addition to you, but if you hit the water together, you should exit together. Anything else is just a crap-shoot. Generally it work out OK, except when it doesn't, then it's really bad.

Terry

Terry, I absolutely agree 100%.

However, based on the two news articles (and some other stuff) I have read, it seems that this was a PADI AOW training dive led by an instructor. If true, then if one diver thumbed a dive the buddy would also miss it, and not be certified. Also, if it was a class, it seems improbable to me that there was no rescue diver aboard the boat for just such an emergency. So my questions are:

Do the normal stay-with-your-buddy rules apply during a PADI AOW class?
Wouldn't there have been at least one additional DM (i.e., an alternate buddy) assisting the group?
Does PADI specify how many instructors and/or DMs need to be in the water and aboard the boat?

 

[Ayisha]

If the rules haven't changed, I believe the instructor can have a group of 8 by him/herself in AOW. Once there's a ninth student, they have to have a DM assisting. Without a DM though, it makes it complicated if the group is split up for any reason, like in this case. It makes it even more difficult for a professional to be within arms reach of all students.

If the Eagle site was a PADI AOW course dive, the 100 foot hard bottom max rule for the course was violated.