Lionfish/DM's don't care!

[Hank49]

What I am disagreeing with is stating that the lion fish were introduced into the Caribbean by human as a fact, when we don't know how they got there. Until then, it's an opinion, nothing more.

It is pretty much agreed upon by ichthyologists that an oceanaruim in the Bahamas was the mode of introduction. It was pumping in and releasing unfiltered seawater back into the sea. They had lionfish in their tanks. Given that the Bahamas is the most heavily infested area in the Atlantic/Caribbean, this makes a lot of sense. Somewhat of a smoking gun.

 

[amascuba]

It is pretty much agreed upon by ichthyologists that an oceanaruim in the Bahamas was the mode of introduction. It was pumping in and releasing unfiltered seawater back into the sea. They had lionfish in their tanks. Given that the Bahamas is the most heavily infested area in the Atlantic/Caribbean, this makes a lot of sense. Somewhat of a smoking gun.

DAN had a really good article on this recently. According to that article, the first Lionfish populations were found off Florida in the mid-1990s. There was speculation that they might be descended from Lionfish released from aquariums prior to Hurricane Andrew in 1992.

They were first sighted in North Carolina in 2000.

They were first sighted in the Caribbean in 2004.

By 2007 they were "all over" the Northern Caribbean.

It's the first time that I have heard of an oceanarium in the Bahamas being the responsible for the release of lion fish. It doesn't explain why they were first spotted in North Carolina, particularly since the Bahama's is probably more of a touristy diving destination than North Carolina and you would think somebody would have noticed them there. Conflicting information is less of a smoking gun. It just means that there are a lot of theories.

Regardless of how they have gotten there, you guys are trying to pick the wrong part of my perspective apart. Again, how they got there are opinions, nothing is fact.

The part of my argument that I expected people to pick apart was what we should be doing to eliminate the population of lion fish in the Caribbean. My opinion is that we should allow nature to resolve the issue on her own. Yes, I'm aware that may take millions of years, but on the other hand, trying to control nature, in the past, has proven disastrous on our part.

 

[driftin' by]

So much for putting me on ignore, eh?

I know... I slipped because feeding trolls is so much fun.

Cenozoic, Mesozoic, Paleozoic, Proterozoic, and Archean. I count five.

It did change. Proterozoic and Archean are eons. Each are subdivided into more distinctive eras.

If I'm not mistaken, the first fish walked on land during the Devonian period and from there land bearing mammal life began. That's a seemingly impossible feat that was overcome.

Evolution is indeed a seemingly impossible thing, that few can fathom. Yet it doesn't happen in one's lifetime like the Lionfish migrating 11,000 miles to the Caribbean.

Why is it that a fish migrating across the globe seemingly impossible? If you actually read what I wrote, you will see that I acknowledge that there are other possibilities for the presence of the lion fish being in the Caribbean.

No, I read the garbage you wrote... how else would I be able to argue your lack of knowledge as it pertains to the Geologic Time Scale? You did say there are other possibilities... good on ya' mate! But to think they are within the same realm of possibility as a Lionfish finding it's own way here in the last 40 years is kinda silly, don't you think?

Okay, it's official... you are now ignored this time as I'm all out of feed.

 

[amascuba]

I heard sea level may be rising because of human activity. I hope we all have our bailing buckets ready so we can do our part to solve that problem too.

As for the speed at which evolution happens, the adaptation of Biston betularia through predation and natural selection didn't take more than a couple of decades.


Actually, it's a hypothesis based on and supported by evidence. That may not constitute fact, but FWIW, it's not an opinion.

Temperature isn't rising because our activities. Temperature rises and falls over time because of natural processes. The gaseous contents of the oceans and atmosphere are responsible for that. What we ARE most likely doing is increasing the rate at which the temperature rises due to carbon emissions. Even if we didn't emit any carbon emissions, the earths temperature would still rise.

 

[geokr]

So much for putting me on ignore, eh?

If I'm not mistaken, the first fish walked on land during the Devonian period and from there land bearing mammal life began.

Couldn't be....the Devonian period marked the end of punk rock and Motown and the ascendance of grunge and hip hop. Fish were already dancing by then. (I know it's true because I Googled it)

 

[K_girl]

Not to speak for K_girl but you missed the boat... Aside from you misquoting the number of eras there has been, which was probably the first result you got when you Google'd it, we're talking about evolution in terms that nonmigratory species don't relocate themselves halfway around the Earth. This fact being the most significant one the led Darwin his theory.

I talked about evolution in two contexts, first I talked about the impossibility that the lionfish developed naturally on its own in the Atlantic/Carribean as an exact duplicate of the species in the Indo-Pacific. Secondly, I talked about evolution creating a predator to handle the lionfish in the Atlantic/Carribean. I think you are trying to say that I only talked about the second context. Not true. There is more than one point to be made.

I agree with peterbj7 - the most important thing is - what are we going to do about it?

 

[MSilvia]

Temperature isn't rising because our activities.

I didn't claim it was fact, but even if I did (which would be no more or less true than claiming it is false), it has absolutely nothing to do with my point.

 

[mike_s]

perhaps we should provide the locals in Cozumel with some tasty Lionfish Recipes?

 

[Rhone Man]

Predators may yet emerge for Lionfish. The eco-system is still adapting.

It seems that Groupers eat them, but sadly for them, the Bahamas so badly over-fished their grouper population that this isn't helping them much.

It may be why we have never seen any here in the BVI - we still have a healthy grouper population here.

 

[K_girl]

What I am disagreeing with is stating that the lion fish were introduced into the Caribbean by human as a fact, when we don't know how they got there. Until then, it's an opinion, nothing more.

It is the opinion of the NOAA research facility that DNA shows that all these lionfish came from the same six or seven fish. That effectively shows that the presence of lionfish have only been in the area only a relatively short time and they have classified the lionfish in this area as an invasive, non-indingenous species. All based on science. You still do not have science on your side to show otherwise.