Flag line getting fouled on fins - rope float idea

[johndiver999]

What are you trying to accomplish here? Not getting run over by a boat? That float is a boat attractant! Legal flag compliance is not possible. Shoot a bag at the end while listening carefully

Are you listening? Are you really advising this guy to jump off a boat, scooter in a strong current (easily over 3 kts some days) for 30-50 minutes and then send a marker buoy up from some random location and simply hope and expect for the dive boat to have an idea where he is? This is very poor practice and is illegal in Florida.

The proper way to do it (in the local area) while scootering in strong currents, is to tow a float (NOT necessarily a dive flag) and have the boat follow the float. The boat displays the dive flag and theoretically stays close so that the diver is complying with the regulations of diving in proximity to a dive flag. So compliance IS possible and I've done it thousands of times. If you are diving with a competent boat captain, they will do everything they can to protect the float from idiot/inattentive boaters.

I've seen quite a few close calls and even one memorable fatality from a diver run over by a boat; so I have little patience for the advice you seem to be offering to somebody who is simply trying to figure this out.

 

[rjack321]

Are you listening? Are you really advising this guy to jump off a boat, scooter in a strong current (easily over 3 kts some days) for 30-50 minutes and then send a marker buoy up from some random location and simply hope and expect for the dive boat to have an idea where he is? This is very poor practice and is illegal in Florida.

The proper way to do it (in the local area) while scootering in strong currents, is to tow a float (NOT necessarily a dive flag) and have the boat follow the float. The boat displays the dive flag and theoretically stays close so that the diver is complying with the regulations of diving in proximity to a dive flag. So compliance IS possible and I've done it thousands of times. If you are diving with a competent boat captain, they will do everything they can to protect the float from idiot/inattentive boaters.

I've seen quite a few close calls and even one memorable fatality from a diver run over by a boat; so I have little patience for the advice you seem to be offering to somebody who is simply trying to figure this out.

Shrugs not sure what thread you're in but the OP said NOTHING about a boat trying to follow them while scootering or even any current at all.

Predominantly on DPV dives (but sometimes also under normal circumstances) the flag line will become tangled with my fins. I usually clip off the reel to an attachment point on the bottom of my back plate and wing. The tangling occurs because as you move quickly through the water, the line streams behind young based on the attachment point, it is in line with the fins.

So there is a rope float concept (see image), where a secondary rope is attached to the neck of the tank, a float is attached to the other end of this rope, and another attachment point is placed by the float. The idea is that you clip off the reel to the attachment point by the float. This elevates the reel, and keeps it away from your body.

This works really well. Until it doesn’t.

Yesterday we were diving in about 100 feet of water and the float was compressed by the pressure and was no longer able to float the reel.

I know that I am not the only one that has used this rope/float concept. The question that I would have is: what float has been successfully used that does not compress under the pressure of depth.

 

[Jollymon32]

I use something similar, but instead of rope, I use a section of hose and run a very strong cord through it. You can use a 7 foot section of fuel line, or old pneumatic hose/line, the stiffness of the hose greatly decreases the tangling potential. You can even use clear vinyl tubing from home depot - the idea is to use something that remains pretty stiff, even when not under tension, but stiffer hose is better. Obviously the internal cord is taking all the tension, not the hose which remains fixed between knots of the internal cord.

I use a small bullet float if I am using a reel that I want to float. The float compresses at depth, but seems to retain sufficient buoyancy. If it turns out to be too large of a float, just hack saw of a portion of the rear until you have something that works at depth.

I think clipping a line to your tank valve is a very poor idea. If when a boat snags it, you are going to have a problem. I typically clip the float line to the front of the scooter and the scooter is clipped to me with a bolt snap. Scooters can be rigged different ways, but deliberately attaching line behind your neck is not a viable option.

Fitec Float, FI-509W

Bullet Nose Float, FI-509, 5-3/8 x 11-3/8 in White. Fitec floats are impregnated with ultra-violet inhibitors to reduce sun damage. The specially formulated PVC foam is tough and highly resistant to oil, grease, fuel, salt, mildew and other harsh elements found in the marine environment.

www.go2marine.com

Thanks for the info and link!

Yes, you do have a point. I have seen these lines to be encapsulated by a stiff hose. I now understand why that is.

Attaching it off to the scooter is an interesting thought. Where do you clip it off on the scooter? I have a feeling if you clip it to the front, it would create an upward force And tilt the nose of the scooter up.

Attaching it to the neck of the tank was an interesting sensation as you can feel the pull of the rope, reel, 150 feet of line that was out, and flag in the 5 foot swells. I understand the concern with attaching it there, however, all the people that I’ve seen that have this type of rigging, attach it to the neck of the tank.

I’m going to re-rig it with the concept of casing it in a much stiffer material, and then test it being attached to the attachment point at the bottom of my back plate and wing. Obviously the stiffer material will keep it from entangling with the fins.

Thanks for the on point input

 

[Jollymon32]

What are you trying to accomplish here? Not getting run over by a boat? That float is a boat attractant! Legal flag compliance is not possible. Shoot a bag at the end while listening carefully

In South Florida, when diving from a charter boat, flags are used to easily show where the divers are making their retrieval easier as all dives are drift dives.

When diving from shore, flags are required by law. In addition to the safety issue, on beach dives, my float torpedo not only has a flag but a GPS receiver so that I can map the dives afterward.

But in reality, this post was not about safety, was not about what was trying to be accomplished, or what is considered flag carrying best practices or not. It really was a question of rigging, and a float that compresses underwater.

 

[happy-diver]

My captain basically knows where the crowd will end up 3 knot drifting to, also following the bubbles
Then when I shoot my bag all that is left is to come and get me

That is what smarts is for

Although it is not possible for me to fathom the crowding, when our population is one tenth of yours

Lucky you

 

[boulderjohn]

My captain basically knows where the crowd will end up 3 knot drifting to, also following the bubbles
Then when I shoot my bag all that is left is to come and get me

Are you talking about the boat following the bubbles of one team?

In Florida, a boat might drop 5 different teams, each of which will then progress at its own rate. When I have surfaced from such a dive, I typically see the boat in the distance picking up another team. A boat picking up a team of surfaced divers cannot follow your bubbles or the bubbles of any of the other teams.

 

[Jollymon32]

My captain basically knows where the crowd will end up 3 knot drifting to, also following the bubbles
Then when I shoot my bag all that is left is to come and get me

That is what smarts is for

Although it is not possible for me to fathom the crowding, when our population is one tenth of yours

Lucky you

Sure, but I specifically mentioned, and the forum is, "DPV Diving". Let's see your smart captain find you in 5 foot swells not having a clue which way you went....oh that's right, he was following your bubbles.....

 

[tursiops]

then test it being attached to the attachment point at the bottom of my back plate and wing.

This is likely no better than to the neck of the tank if it entangles with a passing boat. Do not attach it anywhere that you cannot release instantly. Why endanger yourself?

 

[tursiops]

It really was a question of rigging, and a float that compresses underwater.

LOL. And you want to ignore issues of safety?

 

[Still Kicking]

Sure, but I specifically mentioned, and the forum is, "DPV Diving". Let's see your smart captain find you in 5 foot swells not having a clue which way you went....oh that's right, he was following your bubbles.....

The diver should pick a direction and follow it as much as possible. Then the boat has an idea which way to head. Both parties share the responsibility.