Info Info on Compressor that can fill 100 tanks per day for Dive Resort with 4 HP whips : Cascade HP Bottles-Location Bahamas

[iain/hsm]

I do not agree with the one big compressor approach. Try to find 2 - each in the 15-20 cfm range.

I also don't recommend trying to be too creative with cheap oils or packing filters. Get something from a supplier that has liability insurance. You cack one tourist with bad air, and you will be forever paying for it. Even in the Bahamas. Test your air regularly.

EP had several Worthington 15cfm compressors a while back, they work well. Check govdeals.com you may find something there.

I guess you missed the OP's 100 tanks a day part and Tbone's suggestion of running 3 to 4 hours a day.
Hence 40 CFM to kick off.

Next to define bad air. I don't disagree with you but maybe I should have explained it better that with an Industrial oil free breathing air unit you can remove all the filters cartridges and all the chemicals and just run the condensate out the auto dumps for the condensate to drain and for a laugh fill an aluminium cylinder without any filtration and go diving. It proves a valid point albeit the water vapour content is higher than the latest (BS12021) standards require

Further if not convinced the auto condensate tower contains pure distilled water nothing more nothing else once you drain it into a cup and let the dissolved gas clear to a pure clear distilled water you can pour it on your plants, or down any drain or on the beach and you can drink it. It's simply pure distilled water.

Now also agreed you cannot do that with the oil lubricated Coltri or the Bauer and as for the ex Gov deal on the 40 year old Worthington's good luck getting spares or a manual or a parts list.

 

[Wookie]

EP had several Worthington 15cfm compressors a while back, they work well. Check govdeals.com you may find something there.

We (the Navy) spend about $750k each to have the Ingersoll Rand inline compressors factory rebuilt and upgraded. They are on every Tico cruiser, flight 1 Arleigh Burkes, every fleet oiler, and others.

We scrap about 10 a year.

They come up for sale at DRMO often.

 

[iain/hsm]

I also don't recommend trying to be too creative with cheap oils or packing filters. Get something from a supplier that has liability insurance. You cack one tourist with bad air, and you will be forever paying for it. Even in the Bahamas. Test your air regularly.

Packing filters and liability details we could discuss in detail later. But cheap oil. Why not?

Just to take your oil position alone as an example of the design detail required for a customer to make an informed choice. On the one side:
1. Standard automotive oil you get at your local car spares outlets anywhere in the world for $30 a gallon
2. With an oil change at 5000 to 6000 hours running you do yourself.... What's not to like?

However the devil is in the detail but an industrial compressor designed for divers breathing air/gas and well above your recreational scuba standards at a similar cost. You just need to consider all the design details before making a dismissal recommendation IMHO.
But regarding just the oil aspects allone.

1. An $15 automotive oil filter again from the same car spares shop if you prefer (detailed in orange)
2. A standard industrial oil pump gearotor type (Behind the grey shaft cover) shown in last photo below
3. An industrial stainless steel oil pressure gauge with the correct 50psi oil pressure showing at the 12 o'clock position for easy visual reference of high or low oil pressure against the mid point
4. All 316 Stainless tube and fittings (other options available for eg platforms offshore sea water splash)
5. A low oil pressure switch 2nd photo upper left to shut down in the event of low oil pressure
6. An industrial oil pressure regulator is also fitted but not shown as its behind the 4th stage dump valve
7. A clear distance is fixed that is greater than the compressor stroke separating the lower oily end from the oil free clean gas upper end showing also the gearotor pump internals together with the distance piece. Note also no special tools needed just standard industrial nuts and bolts you could even do with a crescent wrench if you were pushed.

Together with additional options such as crankcase oil heaters and low oil level alarms note the two (2) stainless steel 316 blank plugs each side of the oil pump or even a visual oil level window option.


Now I hope you can now agree with me in what's not to like as far as cheap oil is concerned (provided you have it in the right compressor.)
But if you or anyone else does this fine detailed assessment on each and every aspect of your purchase decision very quickly it will be apparent to all what's not to like.

In addition other options say using the same 4 stage block but using a slightly smaller piston set and increasing the RPM from 500 to say 925RPM. This would still be way slower than the fast short life of 1420 RPM on the Bauer and Coltri units suggested earlier and would allow a slightly smaller motor of say a 25BHP 230/460/3/60 on a 256T frame.

 

[iain/hsm]

We (the Navy) spend about $750k each to have the Ingersoll Rand inline compressors factory rebuilt and upgraded.
We scrap about 10 a year.

Must be the expensive American tax payer oil they use.

I get $75 an hour so by that reckoning they would allow me 5 years a pump to service
Either that or its your new presidents compressor parts import tariff I guess.

If I was in America I could afford sugar in my tea. Got any jobs ROFL.............

 

[BoltSnap]

the Navy

 

[iain/hsm]

[MEDIA deleted

There are things men don't bend the knee for......... or anything else for that matter.
Others may disagree. Feel free. Choose wisely.

 

[ofg-1]

I guess you missed the OP's 100 tanks a day part and Tbone's suggestion of running 3 to 4 hours a day.
Hence 40 CFM to kick off.

No, I did not miss the 100 tank a day detail, nor Tbones suggestion.

Its obvious that you are either building a compressor, or retrofitting a block to be oil free, or trying to sell your product or service.. In fact, it looks good, and I hope it hits the market. Putting the word "industrial" in front of "air compressor" does not mean it has any branding, any dealer support, any service centers or parts availability in the Caribbean.

Right now, the only hp oil less compressor made in the US that I know of is Arctic. The 2500 is probably closest to what the op would want. There may be others, I admit I past my prime a few squares back.

In my sordid youth I worked in a resort setting. 100 tanks a day is probably an aspirational goal. It means you have 2 - 2 tank trips a day with 25 divers on each trip or some combination thereof. You may not get that every day, although with the cruise lines, you never know.

Without regard for how many hours you want to run a compressor per day, if your only compressor takes a dump on you when you have 50 divers booked over the next couple of weeks, you have a problem. You will be buying whatever is on the shelf in Miami or Nassau. If you are going to provide nitrox, you have other problems. If every tank you own comes due for hydro or VIP the same month, you have another problem.

To the op, best of luck to you, it is not easy running a dive operation anywhere. @iain/hsm
best of luck on your product or service.

 

[Max Offshore]

To compare an industrial rated breathing air /gas compressor with a 24/7 duty cycle at say a 5000 psi discharge pressure and filling a bank at say 40 SCFM flow continuous duty requires around a 30 BHP 22Kw Motor. And all you need to supply on site is the required amperage. Voltage Phase and Hz as follows
Motor 230/3/60 Draws 56 Amps
Motor 460/3/60 Draws 28 Amps
Motor 380/3/50 Draws 34 Amps
Now you could reduce that with say a 25BHP 18.5 Kw motor and use a EEF 3 high efficiency type together with a soft start.

Industrial 4 Stage compressor Block Oil Free nitrox 50%
Air cooled 500 RPM
Filter Life Expectancy (BS12021) 200 Hours Repack $15
Oil change at 5000 to 6000 hours * Standard Automotive $30 per 5L Multigrade car mineral oil
Siemans Soft Start with Phase Protection
All User Service Self Service Parts. The crankcase is the only lubricated part using a gearoter 50 psi oil pump and the oil is separated from the compressor upper cylinders by an oil seal assembly for each of the 4 stages and by a distance piece that separates the lower oily end from the upper oil free end. For gas above 50% and for pure oxygen compression or pure helium gas packings are used


By comparison of the two suggested previous for the Bauer and the Coltri Heavy Duty 750 suggested
Air Cooled 1420 RPM
Filter Life Expectancy (BS12021) 38 Hours $320.32
Oil change 1000 hours * Synthetic Diester $179.50 per 5L
DOL Direct on line with no phase protection

Thanks for your detailed engineering and knowledge beyond my beliefs. When I get the green light to install and ship the compressor over to the Bahamas I may call on you before signing the final purchase agreements. The power supply is there and an engineer has a 480V Panel with Step Down Transformer back up gen set with switch gear. He also set up a resort dive shop in the Caymans but the owner sorta let maintenance slip but has a very high customer rating and 1000s of satisfied return divers. I'm just happy to start the Dive Shop and small resort and cant wait for Day 1 when all the Legal Paperwork, Visas, Business Group approved and signed of on by the BNT Tourism and Government. Takes about 16 weeks not matter the money or project timelines. Much Easier than doing business in Thailand--grey market .

 

[iain/hsm]

Putting the word "industrial" in front of "air compressor" does not mean it has any branding, any dealer support, any service centers or parts availability in the Caribbean.

Ok Good points made. So to answer in each section you need to know about before buying a compressor for this heavy duty and commercial applications: 1. OIL Considerations

The set of photos I posted were regarding specifically to the oil lubricating parts of an industrial gas compressor system that we were discussing. So with that in mind two brands are clearly shown in the photo although unintentionally but no matter.

The first "Brand" name was on the oil filter it was from a company called FRAL its an American Industrial Product established in 1932. Hard to say if you can get them off the shelf in Miami or Nassau but It's a $20 part and pretty easy to replace yourself with a rubber strap wrench every 5000 hours. Heck you could do it every year and still no sweat over the cost.

FRAM (brand) - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Trusted Since 1934 | FRAM | Search by Vehicle | FRAM

The FRAM® legacy goes back decades and we’re always working to deliver leading filtration technology and innovations. We provide a full set of oil, air, and cabin filters.

www.fram.com

But if the client prefers say another brand or say one more readily available in the local area
Then another industrial alternative I would recommended would be from a company called WIX
Another American company.

WIX - Home

www.wixfilters.com

Both brands are readily available Worldwide and used world wide especially in racing engines drag car and the high end performance engine market. They also do large Industrial filters for the Farm tractors Marine engines Offshore the military and the like.

The second brand shown accidentally in the photo is on the low oil pressure switch
This is from a company called Barksdale again another American brand.

Home | barksdale

www.barksdale.com

These guys make a wide range of high quality industrial pressure switches and another American brand

The final components you can see in the photos are the 316 stainless steel tube fittings. Hard to make out the brand but on that quarter street elbow fitting It's Swagelok yet another American brand a 2 billion dollar industrial supplier to the gas and Petroleum industries of industrial high pressure products

Swagelok - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

High-Quality Fluid System Solutions & Components

Swagelok is a privately held manufacturer of fluid system solutions including components, assemblies, and services trusted in critical industries worldwide

www.swagelok.com

IMHO its worth spending an hour of your time going over these web sites just to get a background of what I was talking about with the term Industrial compressors and get a background get a feel for the stuff. No flash no sale pitch no bull just a quite professionalism shining out through the haze of recreational toy town pumps you guys have been fed from the get go since you joined your first PADI try dive course.

I trust the answers to your valid question have been satisfied so far and that we understand and can continue using the word industrial in its correct context and for its correct application and that we as a group continue with valid questioning about a suitable compressor for the OP's consideration and that any seed of doubt can be answered in a correct and valid manner that an Industrial properly designed industrial compressor from valid engineering practice and principle position is worth a detailed consideration.

Either that or I was darn lucky that all the parts in that first batch of photos were American

 

[iain/hsm]

In my sordid youth I worked in a resort setting. 100 tanks a day is probably an aspirational goal. It means you have 2 - 2 tank trips a day with 25 divers on each trip or some combination thereof. You may not get that every day, although with the cruise lines, you never know.

Good points again. But another consideration I was conscious of and this is as good a time as any to bring up is that a number of dive shacks are located right on the beach in the sand and not all of these great locations for a dive shack on the beach have the required industrial power available to them.

I would suggest that the best of these are very laid back with the requisite beach girls swim tans and cool drinks in the shade.

The very last thing they want is some gas king firing up 22Kw of power and start "a fillin" for the next 4 hours

It kills the vibe.

So maybe ship all the filling junk far enough away in an industrial complex area together with the beach towel and laundry stuff and get the cylinders trucked in as required early in the morning. In addition a number of dive shacks will use the same "Filler" for the whole area. Saves cost saves valuable dive staff time and the filler gets to level out the peaks and troughs of supply and demand for the season together with the hydro's inspections etc.

The last thing I would want on holiday is a compressor running.

I did a job on a Yacht in the South of France Hercules Port Monaco can't say who but everyone around on the other yacht in the next berth were showing off there golden tans with no tan lines. (it was France they do the tanning thing a little different ) and I was the ubiquitous white man fiddling about at the aft deck with wires and stuff. In the early evening they had a party next door and I had just started running the compressor.

One of my clients yacht crew staff came down to speak to me and I apologised for the noice. No problem she said they think you're the owner and they have invited you over to join them.

Somewhat confused I asked "How come they think I'm the owner"

You're the only man on deck here without a tan she replied. of course they think you're the owner.