Zebulon Pike Table Rock Lake

[nagel]

I've looked and I haven't been able to find any video of the General and really no pics of her under the water either. This is a first. It wasn't until a few years ago that we found the Zebulon Pike parked in a marina. Prior to that there was there was a lot of speculation. Great job dwellerbottom.

I don't want to be a Nanny here, but please understand that Nemrod has many years of diving this wreck and a tremendous amount of experience diving. Penetrating this wreck is serious business because it can silt up very quickly and it is basically falling apart. There are sharp edges and items that can fall on you or to a point that could block your exit. I personally will not penetrate this wreck, but that is everybody's individual decision. Make sure you have the proper skills, experience, and tools if you are going the penetrate this wreck. I don't want anybody to have the impression that this is a safe penetratable wreck....nobody has maintained the wreck for this. (Okay, off my soap box)

Snagel

 

[dwellerbottom]

I agree with nagel, that last picture is of the staircase going down into the belly of this beast.
I am going to try to get a better picture or video showing the staircase in more light as this was my first timing using this camera. I stuck my head in and looked down the staircase but I wouldn't venture inside, it is dark and as nagel said lots of things to get tangled in or maybe even fall on top of you.
It is a very cool dive though, we took my AOW instructor on this dive once & he said it is the coolest dive he has been on in any of the midwest lakes around here.

 

[Nemrod]

I clearly stated to use "extreme caution" and warned of possible blockage and sharp metal and severe silting. I do not know the experience level of every diver here. He could be an experienced diver with training or a rank beginner. Obviously a beginner diver has no place inside a wreck that silts easily at 80ish feet in a cold dark lake. I have told people on here before that they should consider that just because I (as in myself, N) can do something is not an indication they can or even should, it only means that something is possible.

Make no mistake and it is not a brag, I am a very capable diver with wide experience in many varied conditions with more training than I usually admit to, formal or not. Again I am not recommending to go inside, I am only saying that it is possible to transit the interior. A penetration into a wreck or cave or any overhead environment is not a place to be without proper training and even at that a guide to show you. To this day, I freely admit, I will hire or engage a guide or diver knowledgeable in an area when I hear that whisper in the back of my very hard head, "Hey, watch out there bubba, that could be a step too far, even for you."

This wreck, as I understand, is an actual accidental sinking. It was not sanitized for diving as are many intentional "wrecks" and therefore there may not be a convenient out if needed.

Also, yes, I applaud the photos, I failed to take a camera on my dives there but since I was either watching a buddy or was solo, my hands were full. The water conditions seemed excellent a few weeks ago when I was there, I could have kicked myself for not even bringing my camera. I think this thread has scored several firsts, pictures of the "General" above and below the water. Side scan of General:

This dive begs for a fisheye lens powerful dual strobes, dang it. Also some of the new camera have the panorama stitch function, that could be the ticket.

OK Dweller, your next mission if you are willing to undertake it (and geeezzzzzz, if you have the training to accomplish it---warning!!!! DEEP, DARK, COLD, potentially DANGEROUS), is to photo the bridge and bell at Kimberling:

Scan of Oasis area showing mystery object I have yet to locate despite numerous dives:

The scans are mine from my boat, the Boston Whaler Outrage Nemrod .

N

 

[nagel]

Hey Nemrod,

Thanks for clearing things up a little. I wasn't trying to butt in, but I know of your experience and just wanted to make sure others understood the possible dangers with this wreck.

Since you brought it up, what is your take on how the General got to its resting place? I've heard it broke loose during a storm and drifted across the lake and sunk where it is. I've also heard the COE took control of the General and sunk it intentionally to create a fish habitat and to get rid of an eye sore. Any of these stories true and/or is there another story?

Snagel

 

[Nemrod]

Hey Nemrod,

Thanks for clearing things up a little. I wasn't trying to butt in, but I know of your experience and just wanted to make sure others understood the possible dangers with this wreck.

Since you brought it up, what is your take on how the General got to its resting place? I've heard it broke loose during a storm and drifted across the lake and sunk where it is. I've also heard the COE took control of the General and sunk it intentionally to create a fish habitat and to get rid of an eye sore. Any of these stories true and/or is there another story?

Snagel

I was not fussing, I should have made it more clear that penetration in the wreck is definitely an overhead environment, not a quick swim through as you often find on intentional wrecks that were cut for divers for that purpose.

You know, it is amazing that I ask around now for several years, surprising to find that many do not know there is even a wreck there much less how it got there or what it is. The best story I have pieced together and may not be correct, is that the "General" broke loose in a storm and drifted down the lake landing against the bank near it's current resting place. It was thought to be ugly and the authorities contacted the owner, who was apparently low on funds, to remove it. A half hearted attempt (read as low budget) was made to refloat the General and tow it but they did not get far before it sank yet again, and there it remains.

I doubt the Corp or other authorities wanted the General there given their penchant for sterility. I mean, now they built that complex at the dam and do not want divers there.

N

 

[dwellerbottom]

Well the bridge is around the limits of my training, I have yet to dive it.
I think I will need a buddy for this dive as I think it may be more than my wife would feel comfy with.
I was supposed to dive it last year with a buddy & then the floods came so we canceled.
Now he has a new baby that has really cut into his diving, so it is on my list of dives I want to do but don't really want to dive it my first time without someone who has dived it before.
I would love to get some video of it.

---------- Post Merged at 01:44 PM ---------- Previous Post was at 12:50 PM ----------

[h=2]Zebulon M. Pike[/h]

• In 1814, Zebulon M. Pike was the first navigator to reach St. Louis, the northernmost port on the Mississippi River. The boat named after him, a stern wheeler, was built in Cincinnati, Ohio. The Zebulon M. Pike was the first paddle-wheeler designed exclusively for passenger travel. Owned by the U.S. Mail Co., she was the first to contract to carry the U.S. mail.
  
  

Read more: Historic Paddle Boats of the Mississippi River | eHow.com http://www.ehow.com/info_8341821_historic-paddle-boats-mississippi-river.html#ixzz29OXNPgOz​

 

[nagel]

I too would like to dive the bridge at some point, but like you would prefer to do it with somebody that has dove it and in the right conditions. It's on my list, but haven't done that one either.

Interestingly, that you posted the blurb on the Zebulon Pike Paddle Boat. I've seen that before and I'm thinking there is some wonder. Could there be two Zebulon Pike boats - one a paddle boat and one the blue excursion boat that is now at the Bass Pro Marina? Should I dare say that maybe what we are calling the General - could it actually be the original Zebulon Pike Paddle Boat that was once on the Mississippi?

Just saying!

Snagel

 

[Nemrod]

Well, that is fanciful thinking but I am afraid that is just not possible. Besides, the "redneck" construction technology found on the "General" is far to advanced for a paddle wheeler of the 1800s. .

When I was a baby, I distinctly recall riding a small paddle wheeler, realizing of course in retrospect it was probably powered by a diesel tractor engine, on Bayou Bartholomew, however, my mother looks at me odd whenever I bring it up. It is not in Table Rock Lake either, .

N

 

[Avonthediver]

Has anyone ever really looked at the foundation of the general? I'm just asking not trying to be a smart ass or anything lol! I have seen a great many barge type boat above and below our lake's

I read the other night that the "General" was like a ticket booth for the "Zebulon" and inside is their a counter or the like?

 

[Nemrod]

Has anyone ever really looked at the foundation of the general? I'm just asking not trying to be a smart ass or anything lol! I have seen a great many barge type boat above and below our lake's

I read the other night that the "General" was like a ticket booth for the "Zebulon" and inside is their a counter or the like?

It is not on barrels or such as that. It has a shallow steel hull, like a river barge. There is an area, that I thought looked like a bar with a sitting area but it could have been a ticket area. The smoke stack is fake of course. As seen in the photo posted earlier, it acted as an access and loading, unloading facility to the Zebulon Pike motor cruiser. If you swim into the opening I described there is an odd vacant area and some twisted shaft looking pieces of steel. I was told by a local they were drive shafts, frankly, I doubt it.

Why is it so hard to answer all of this, well, apparently people in the Show Me state are also the Forget Everything state and with the relatively low viz and moderate depth and at least in my case, usually solo, it is really hard to get a full look at the thing. I have not explored the starboard side hardly at all, especially from the midships forward. I have been in and through and all along the stern area and bow area and up and across the top deck. The Indian Point area, just generally does not have the best viz it seems.

The current Branson Belle is the largest boat of it's type on an inland lake. It was built at it's current dockage and was launched into the lake on a ramp lubricated by bananas, for real. Several years ago, a sudden storm came up and blew the Belle onto rocks where it and it's passengers remained over night. It is actually driven by the twin paddle wheels which are diesel driven.

TR lake can have some rough water if the winds blow just right and hard enough. I have seen some dang big waves out there, in a storm. Nothing like the Gulf or to get grey hair over but eye opening big nonetheless. It is kind of funny, I can be twenty miles out in the Gulf and be in 60 to 80 feet of water, I can drop 200 feet of anchor rode in TR and it will hang dead weight and I can nearly touch shore!

N