Yet another "Try your gear after service" thread

[waynel]

Bull hockey on this get your gear sevice annually! Some instructor on this site said he services his gear when it's broken and not before. I've had to abort a dive, more than once, because I followed the suggestion "have your reg and BC inspected annually". O-ring not seated, didn't property reassemble, etc. Do the proper after dive maintenance. If it aint' broke don't fix it.

 

[ArcticDiver]

Bull hockey on this get your gear sevice annually! Some instructor on this site said he services his gear when it's broken and not before. I've had to abort a dive, more than once, because I followed the suggestion "have your reg and BC inspected annually". O-ring not seated, didn't property reassemble, etc. Do the proper after dive maintenance. If it aint' broke don't fix it.

With that emotional of a response I doubt anything that anyone says will change your mind. But, you should consider three things in deciding how often to service and then test regulators.
1. What is the manufacturer's service schedule?
2. What kind of environment you are diving in. Some conditions are harder on regulators than others.
3. How perfect the tech who services your regulators is.
4. Recognize that some thngs can be a problem but cannot be seen until the regulator is opened up.

If there was a way to monitor regulator performance, something like oil analysis in fleet vehicles, then I'd whole heartedly endorse the run till it shows a problem procedure. But there isn't.

I already posted the rest for your consideration. But, it is your money and your life so the decision is yours.

 

[redacted]

With that emotional of a response I doubt anything that anyone says will change your mind. But, you should consider three things in deciding how often to service and then test regulators.
1. What is the manufacturer's service schedule?
2. What kind of environment you are diving in. Some conditions are harder on regulators than others.
3. How perfect the tech who services your regulators is.
4. Recognize that some thngs can be a problem but cannot be seen until the regulator is opened up.

If there was a way to monitor regulator performance, something like oil analysis in fleet vehicles, then I'd whole heartedly endorse the run till it shows a problem procedure. But there isn't.

I already posted the rest for your consideration. But, it is your money and your life so the decision is yours.

Actually, regulator performance is quite easy to effectively moniter. And with good care and frequent inspection, there is no reason you can not increase the service interval quite a bit.

By good care, I mean things like a good long SOAK after use in an adverse environment. Then dry, relieve pressure on the 2nd stage seats, and store in a clean, climate controlled environment.

Inspect your regs often - at least quaterly and before each trip. Check by hand and eye to insure all connections are tight and components look to be in good shape. Do a vacuum test to make sure seals are water tight. Purge it and breath it. Check the IP and cracking pressure. Do a leak test. Some (or all) of these tests can be done every dive. These test will often give you early warning of an impending problem before it has a chance to get serious.

If you are willing to make minor adjustments to your own gear, you should learn to do minor adjustments to IP and cracking pressure. Unfortunately, some shops will perform an unnecessary full service when minor adjustment is all that is needed.

For most divers, the most dangerous dive they ever do with their regulator is the dive immediately after service. While it is thankfully in infrequent event, servicing a regulator that is showing no signs of problems can produce more problems than it avoids. Catestrophic failures of regulators is an extremely infrequent event, but is often associated with service errors. Most regulator failures take the form of minor leaks - water leaking in to where it should not be or gas leaking out. They are usually quite manageable for a short time and are a clear sign that service is needed.

Your money. Your life. Unfortunately, unnecessary service takes your money and could increase the risk of problems.

I do my own servicing. My regs go at least 3 to 5 years between service with perhaps a little tweeking of cracking pressure. A need for service is usually signaled by a small leak or instaility of the IP.

 

[deepblueme]

I have been saving this one till a good time to use it...

When I did a tour of an o-ring biz ( a place where they are made) part of it was talking about how long dynamic and static lifetimes were and they said a moving o-ring should be replaced at least once a year more often with heavy use..
Even with proper lube an o-ring will take a seat (deform from use and lack of use also).

Also when I did a zip-tie clinic ( yes a clinic on the different types of zip-ties) we were told that the needed to be replaced every year or more often if exposed to the sun.

I am not saying you have to pay big bucks at an LDS but you need to do the work when the parts makers say it needs to be done not just the reg mfg's.

A reccomended service program is not just a way for mfg's to make big bucks, most of them give you the parts free, it is a way for them to cover their A## in the event of a malfunction and your loved one decide to be good americans and sue.

Shops tell you to have it done for 2 reasons.
#1 see above
#2 they are in biz to keep the doors open and the olny way that happens is if you spend money.

About the after service test
Take the time to put it on a tank in the shop breath on it turn off the air breath it down, pull back the hose covers and try to twist them off.

It's your gear.
I'm done here.

 

[redacted]

I wonder how long it would take for a dynamic scuba o-ring to see a years worth of use? I would guess that each of my 4 regs sees about a days worth (~24 hours) every year. Maybe that is why mine (and apparently many other divers who stretch the mfgr recommendations) are lasting so much longer.

But if you fail to take good care of your regs, especially aroud SW, you will have a hard time making it a year between service. If salt and corrosion build up on a sealing surface of a dynamic o-ring, it will get cut up pretty quickly.

Are you using the UV resistant zip ties? I know even the UV resistant ones the cable guy uses on the outside of my house really take a beating and get brittle from the sun in just a couple years. But the zip ties on my regulators don't see anywhere near that much sun exposure.

 

[deepblueme]

You seem to be a pretty knowlageable diver Awap.

When I am giving advice/opinions I try to be as broad as possiable to cover that lucky guy that lives in S.FL as well as the person I trained living in Missouri.

 

[redacted]

I just think everybody should understand the facts and their options without undue coersion. Folks who want to maintain their warranty and don't want to learn too much about their gear are probably better off finding a good tech and following mfgr recommendations. But I agree with you. Part of the reason for service frequency is #2 above - and that is a shame.

 

[ArcticDiver]

Actually, regulator performance is quite easy to effectively moniter. And with good care and frequent inspection, there is no reason you can not increase the service interval quite a bit.

By good care, I mean things like a good long SOAK after use in an adverse environment. Then dry, relieve pressure on the 2nd stage seats, and store in a clean, climate controlled environment.

Inspect your regs often - at least quaterly and before each trip. Check by hand and eye to insure all connections are tight and components look to be in good shape. Do a vacuum test to make sure seals are water tight. Purge it and breath it. Check the IP and cracking pressure. Do a leak test. Some (or all) of these tests can be done every dive. These test will often give you early warning of an impending problem before it has a chance to get serious.

If you are willing to make minor adjustments to your own gear, you should learn to do minor adjustments to IP and cracking pressure. Unfortunately, some shops will perform an unnecessary full service when minor adjustment is all that is needed.

For most divers, the most dangerous dive they ever do with their regulator is the dive immediately after service. While it is thankfully in infrequent event, servicing a regulator that is showing no signs of problems can produce more problems than it avoids. Catestrophic failures of regulators is an extremely infrequent event, but is often associated with service errors. Most regulator failures take the form of minor leaks - water leaking in to where it should not be or gas leaking out. They are usually quite manageable for a short time and are a clear sign that service is needed.

Your money. Your life. Unfortunately, unnecessary service takes your money and could increase the risk of problems.

I do my own servicing. My regs go at least 3 to 5 years between service with perhaps a little tweeking of cracking pressure. A need for service is usually signaled by a small leak or instaility of the IP.

You took off on a tack that tells me you didn't read my original post. I have never said it is a life safety issue to have your regs serviced frequently. I have said it is an economic and convenience issue.

If the diver does proper predive and initial water entry checks it is extremely rare to have a regulator failure during a dive. In fact, many people who dive hundreds of dives per year tell me they have never even heard of a regulator failure at depth if the proper pre-dive and initial water entry checks are done.

You comment that you do your own servicing. That puts you in a category of people who not only have the proper tools but enjoy the DYI thing. I doubt most divers fit in that category; or that it makes sense for them.

As for the economic impact on a LDS; most of the shops I know send their regulator work out to a facility that does only regulator work. So, sure they make a buck or two, but it sure isn't a very big cost center. LDS' may, in many cases, be inept business people but I'm far from believing they are the kind of conniving cheats you strongly imply.