Write your own standards - Rec Deep Diver, 130' max

[in_cavediver]

Great formation and syllabus.

However, do you think there is a market for this?

For Dives (4) over minimun 2 days and class room portion, it must be at least $400~$500 per student.

Just my thoughts....

One more item to mention - Instructor student ratio - 4:1 max with a DM otherwise 2:1

To be honest, I don't know if there is a market. This to me, with a few additions added by many here (such as CO2 retention that I forgot to add) is really what a deep diver course should cover. Cost, $250-$350 seems about right and plan for a weekend or two.

I just feel that if you want to take a class to learn a skill, you should be at least somewhat compentent to do it safely at the end without supervision. Deep diving isn't rocket science but it does take a bit more discipline and skills to do safely.

And yes, I agree wholeheartedly with the mentor method. To work well though, you need a good mentor. If you don't have one available, formal training is the next best bet.

On cards, well my wife is Padi OW, IANTD advanced nitrox, NACD full cave and finishing IANTD tec nitrox program. We figure after a couple years, we'll do full trimix together (i'm only normoxic). Then, and only then, she'll do the AOW class.

 

[plot]

I'm just waiting for one of the old timers who got trained back before the great flood and the war to end all wars chimes in with something like:

Gotta run 2 miles in under 12 minutes, have first aid, CPR, pass a physical, have had a college level physics class (and passed with a B average), and you must have 20 hours logged in front of a tv watching the discovery channel. Also you must have a gym membership and go at least twice a week, and dietitions must sign off on your diet to make sure it's healthy...

and that's just for starters before they even let you near the pool...


You guys gotta be reasonable if you expect the sport to grow.

 

[ianr33]

The standards you mentioned don't sound very different to an Advanced Nitrox course,minus 10 minutes of deco.

 

[in_cavediver]

You guys gotta be reasonable if you expect the sport to grow.

To be honest, I don't particulary care if deeper diving grows. There is plenty for the 'underwater tourist' type of diver to see and enjoy above 80-100 feet.

Also note, I mean no disrespect to the purely vacation divers with the 'underwater tourist' comment. Each person needs to do a honest self evaluation of thier skills, desires and motivations for diving. Not everyone wants to take diving to the same level and we need to be honest in admitting this. We can tailor dive classes to those vacation divers which would maximize their enjoyment and give them a good honest representation of where they are dive skill wise.

 

[Hoosier]

Like I said, I totally agree with your concept and path of the class.

However, the diving agencies became another business entities no matter what they are arguing. If there is no huge demands, we can't expect the market.

As you know, at the university, we used to ask the doctoral students to hand in an elective course idea for the colleage kid every semesters. Depending on their major fields, there are a lot of good concepts and syllabi for the elective classes, but it doesn't mean that there are market for the class (you know that school is also business). We have seen so many good oriented class died due to a lack of enrollment every semesters.

What I understand is that your concept class is another speciality class, not one of core classes to replace AOW. So, that is my point.

In addition, if there is any overlap with their agency's tech classes, it will be another factor to see. Agency and students mgiht think that they had better take an entry level tech class rather than a high $$$ speciality rec. class.

In addition, we are talking about a rec. class that everyone can easily accept, not a nazzi class with a certain philosophy here.

Again... Just my 2 bars..

P.S. My GF is pursuing an exact same path (except Rescue) as your wife has done.

 

[pickens_46929]

Is there a market for it? What's described is basically 5thD-x's Rec 2 class, or GUE's Rec Triox (with a few differences, like the fact that neither discusses pony bottles, and Rec Triox talks about helium). But the skills and lecture materials are very similar.

There is a market for this class, albeit a small one. I've taken both, and both are given fairly regularly in a number of places.

Yep, I gotta say everything I've heard about in the opening post, GUE has covered. And yes the fees are steep as is the fact that you don't get the card just because you did the dives.

Haven't taken any GUE courses but it looks like it's in my future. Just wish I had found it sooner rather than later.

 

[pickens_46929]

I think there is a market. You may want to break it up though like a Class to 100' then another one that reineforces the first class and goes to 130'. They could be different in the gasses used etc....

So PSA (Hal Watts - 40 Fathoms) has just that... Extended Range / Narcosis Management courses, each level based upon depth... progressing every 30 ft. or so. Don't want to debate air vs. trimix here. Just pointing out there are agencies that do this kind of thing, they just don't have the marketing and quantity of students that PADI does.

If I remember correctly a friend of mine in Charlotte is certified through SSI and they offer something like this as well.

 

[ianr33]

Ultimately I dont think it matters much if the course is Rec Deep,Advanced Nitrox,Rec2 or just mentoring from an experienced buddy. What does matter is that divers doing 100-130 foot dives have some training beyond a 61 foot AOW dive.

Many of these dives seem to fall into a grey area. While strictly "recreational" they really need a "technical" approach to be safe,especially in cold water,low viz etc.

 

[Hoosier]

Many of these dives seem to fall into a grey area. While strictly "recreational" they really need a "technical" approach to be safe,especially in cold water,low viz etc.

It is also good point if we look at the market trend. The tech market is gettting more popular than ever. In fact, we have seen PADI, NAUI, and SSI built their own tech classes (with comprehensive entry class) already. The tech area isn't a totally different animal anymore...

 

[diver 85]

You need a minimum logbook of dives.......Nine

Whoa....now that's advanced, I mean experienced, I mean the shop is making money off a meaningless letter, A(from AOW)........