Why the dislike of air integrated computers?

[phoenix31tt]

Then with that logic, neither should the failure of a transmitter.

If the transmitter quits or the hose blows, there is no emergency.

Not an ooa emergency no... An emergency in that you don't know your remaining air... Air is still there though [emoji6]


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[dmoore19]

If the HP hose blew, neither would your SPG be worthwhile. With a blown hose, the air won't be there for long.

Not an ooa emergency no... An emergency in that you don't know your remaining air... Air is still there though [emoji6]


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[phoenix31tt]

If the HP hose blew, neither would your SPG be worthwhile. With a blown hose, the air won't be there for long.

Maybe I have it wrong... But I always understood an hp hose to have a little pin hole so that if it blows a little air is escaping not a lot... I.e. Not a catastrophic loss...

I never really checked it out myself... I had an spg blow on me once, on land, loud bang but no sudden rush of air... Switched it out and had just about the same amount of air in my tank


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[doctormike]

Maybe I have it wrong... But I always understood an hp hose to have a little pin hole so that if it blows a little air is escaping not a lot... I.e. Not a catastrophic loss...

You have it right. Time to empty a full AL80 at 99 FSW:

HP hose failure: 22 minutes
LP hose failure: 81 seconds

Life Ending Seconds • ADVANCED DIVER MAGAZINE • By Curt Bowen

 

[dmoore19]

But that is not the point. The point is that if the transmitter fails or the hp hose fails it is not an emergency but it is time to surface at a safe and reasonable rate.

In either event you do not know how much air you have.

Not an ooa emergency no... An emergency in that you don't know your remaining air... Air is still there though

Maybe I have it wrong. If you have a HP hose failure, then because of that failure you surface. If you have a transmitter that fails then you surface. Neither is an emergency. Neither is a catastrophe.

All things considered it means that neither has an advantage and failure of either a transmitter or a hp hose makes no difference.

Please correct me if I am wrong.

Maybe I have it wrong... But I always understood an hp hose to have a little pin hole so that if it blows a little air is escaping not a lot... I.e. Not a catastrophic loss...

I never really checked it out myself... I had an spg blow on me once, on land, loud bang but no sudden rush of air... Switched it out and had just about the same amount of air in my tank


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[phoenix31tt]

Maybe I have it wrong. If you have a HP hose failure, then because of that failure you surface. If you have a transmitter that fails then you surface. Neither is an emergency. Neither is a catastrophe.

All things considered it means that neither has an advantage and failure of either a transmitter or a hp hose makes no difference.

Please correct me if I am wrong.

My original point was simply to state that if we start counting the hose (and the spool, and the needle) as a failure point on a spg system then we can start counting a whole number of other failure points in a Hoseless AI system... That's all... Nothing more...

I didn't get into the likelihood of a transmitter vs hose failure or anything... Those things have been discussed and rediscussed in this thread lol...



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[dmoore19]

So has the likelihood of failure.

In my experience I have never personally experienced a failure of either, nor have I seen it happen on the trips I have been on. If I were to have my choice of a hp hose blowing or a transmitter failure I would choose the transmitter failure though neither constitutes an emergency. The end result is the same, the dive ends and you return to the surface.

My original point was simply to state that if we start counting the hose (and the spool, and the needle) as a failure point on a spg system then we can start counting a whole number of other failure points in a Hoseless AI system... That's all... Nothing more...

I didn't get into the likelihood of a transmitter vs hose failure or anything... Those things have been discussed and rediscussed in this thread lol...



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[phoenix31tt]

So has the likelihood of failure.

In my experience I have never personally experienced a failure of either, nor have I seen it happen on the trips I have been on. If I were to have my choice of a hp hose blowing or a transmitter failure I would choose the transmitter failure though neither constitutes an emergency. The end result is the same, the dive ends and you return to the surface.

OK then... I just said I wasn't discussing anything about likelihood of failure since it has been discussed over and over... And over.. And over... But I see you aren't understanding what I was saying... No worries


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[dmoore19]

No worries here either.

Overall I view the whole thing as being a personal choice. Wireless AI or SPG and no AI. Makes no difference IMO. The whole failure point argument is overblown for a recreational diver such as myself. Both have their advantages and disadvantages to the person making the choice. You may not like the idea of relying on a transmitter, I don't like a hose with 3000 psi that close to my head. Personal choice.

 

[stuartv]

Maybe I have it wrong. If you have a HP hose failure, then because of that failure you surface. If you have a transmitter that fails then you surface. Neither is an emergency. Neither is a catastrophe.

All things considered it means that neither has an advantage and failure of either a transmitter or a hp hose makes no difference.

Please correct me if I am wrong.

Well... I'd say you're wrong only in that I think pretty much any rational diver would end the dive if a HP hose blows. But, that is not necessarily the case for a dead AI transmitter.

Example: I know my own RMV and performance with my HP120 tanks and I have experience with dive profiles where I know that I am going to hit my NDL before my tank drops below 1000 psi. If I were diving a profile like that, if I got in the water and noticed that my AI was no longer telling me my tank pressure - but I know (from a pre-dive check) that my tank is full, I might very well proceed with the dive without "knowing" my tank pressure during the dive (and likely planning to give myself some extra margin on my NDL - i.e. get out well before it goes to 0).

So, to me, hoseless AI actually offers an advantage. It's not a "makes no difference" situation.