Why is SSI so unresponsive to diver wants?

[OMyMyOHellYes]

I just use the Shearwater cloud. I have pretty close to zero interest in logging dives. There was a point in my primary OW training causing an argument when the shop insisted that I MUST have a logbook (that they conveniently would sell me). I said "Fine. For the course, I'll keep a log." My logbook was a 4x6 index card with date, location, depth, the dog/pony tricks demonstrated, and the instructor's name (no counter signature). But I let the Shearwater do it just to reach the next level in my progression... Two, perhaps three, more milestones (maybe): Sidemount doubles, DM and Deco/Tec 50.

The only thing in the book that was really noteworthy and recorded included RTB, AKR, Overheat Reef #14:

"EARTHQUAKE DIVE - magnitude 4.8 earthquake 64 miles NE of Roatan during dive. Odd higher pitched sounds followed by long, low groaning sounds lasted for several seconds. Unsettling to hear. No indication of source until later in the day during surface conversations with resort staff and other visitors.

USGS reference: us7000hjqr
16.8998N 85.7549W
Depth 10 km
22-06-23 20:37:41 GMT"

I think maybe I should request an "Earthquake Diver" Specialty card from PADI.

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

Serious question. I wonder what percentage of divers use the PADI/SSI/Whatever app versus a paper one or just using their dive computer. Of course in the latter, you can't fill out information, but who really goes back and reviews what they wrote? I'm sure some do, but I'd wager that's a very small percentage.

If a boat wants to see my dive log, I just hand them my Shearwater.

 

[Allen-1]

Serious question. I wonder what percentage of divers use the PADI/SSI/Whatever app versus a paper one or just using their dive computer. Of course in the latter, you can't fill out information, but who really goes back and reviews what they wrote? I'm sure some do, but I'd wager that's a very small percentage.

If a boat wants to see my dive log, I just hand them my Shearwater.

Unless I've misunderstood you, the downside to your approach is that you have a potential single point of failure, (your dive computer), which can result in the loss of your log file(s). It doesn't even have to be hardware/software failure of the DC itself - it could be lost, stolen or stepped on by a unicorn.

I'm on my third DC, and since my logs are in sub-subface, (ipad, iphone and cloud), I'm pretty sure I won't lose them.

 

[wetb4igetinthewater]

Unless I've misunderstood you, the downside to your approach is that you have a potential single point of failure, (your dive computer), which can result in the loss of your log file(s). It doesn't even have to be hardware/software failure of the DC itself - it could be lost, stolen or stepped on by a unicorn.

I'm on my third DC, and since my logs are in sub-subface, (ipad, iphone and cloud), I'm pretty sure I won't lose them.

I cannot speak for every dive computer manufacturer, but I'd imagine all/most have logging software of some sort. I do recommend diving with two dive computers for the sake of redudancy for a trip.

I'm not too concerned about the issue you brought up, as while I said I'd just toss someone my dive computer to see the log, no one, not even when taking tech/instructor courses has actually ever asked to look at my logs. Dive charters just ask when was my last dive.

 

[Belzelbub]

Serious question. I wonder what percentage of divers use the PADI/SSI/Whatever app versus a paper one or just using their dive computer. Of course in the latter, you can't fill out information, but who really goes back and reviews what they wrote? I'm sure some do, but I'd wager that's a very small percentage.

Quite true. This was always my issue with the paper logs in particular. I found them useless. For the occasional diver that only dives on vacation, it might be doable, but when the dive count grows, the ability to reference the information is a lot harder.

For me, what I find useful is the weighting with different types of gear. I rarely dive with AL tanks or in freshwater. When one of those does come up, I can search in my electronic log and find what I used most frequently. That at least gets me in the ballpark. Then, at the end, I can add a note if that was too much weight, too little, etc.

 

[Wants2divemore]

no one, not even when taking tech/instructor courses has actually ever asked to look at my logs.

Last December I was asked by a dive op in Key West, FL to see my log book while still in the shop before heading to the boat to dive the Vandenberg. Even though I had dove the Vandenberg the year before with another dive shop, I had never dove with the shop and they wanted to make sure I had enough experience. I handed him my phone with my logbook app open, he scrolled through my dive list and said "I see you dove some North Carolina wrecks. Cool, I've always wanted to dive there but haven't made it there." When then chatted briefly about NC diving and that was that. Many other ops have asked how many dives I have but that's the only time I've ever been asked to show my log book.

 

[Etmar]

Serious question. I wonder what percentage of divers use the PADI/SSI/Whatever app versus a paper one or just using their dive computer. Of course in the latter, you can't fill out information, but who really goes back and reviews what they wrote? I'm sure some do, but I'd wager that's a very small percentage.

If a boat wants to see my dive log, I just hand them my Shearwater.

I don't know how many do that, but I do. I check facts from previous dives, for example:
- checking used weights with different configurations (SM, single tank, CCR) and drysuits/undersuits/wetsuit
- rarely dived divesites to check possible routes and dive profiles when planning new dives or helping other divers to dive there
- gas management in different depths and water temperatures

I use Subsurface. It is also possible to plan dives with it.

 

[scubadada]

This was an interesting thread for me. I had no idea that Mares/SSI were going to such lengths to retain their divers and sell Mares equipment. I should not be surprised.

 

[brsnow]

This was an interesting thread for me. I had no idea that Mares/SSI were going to such lengths to retain their divers and sell Mares equipment. I should not be surprised.

I have never been in a SSI shop that sold mares equipment.

 

[TravisD]

I've never seen any pressure for SSI shops to sell or otherwise push Mares stuff. My former shop was Huish stuff (Zeagle/Atomic/etc) and the current one is Scubapro.

SSI seems to have two main reasons for having the log - first, is to drive divers into their shop to get their dives 'validated' - which is completely in-line with the whole SSI business plan of 'supporting' the retail dive shop (SSI instructors/pros are not independent, like PADI and other agency pros are/can-be).

The second reason for the log is that we are encouraged to have students use it to log their training/cert dives - it takes the place of the hard-copy log books, with the benefit that SSI HQ can, if the dives are logged there, use them to investigate any "QA" issues - if a student reports something that could be a standards violation, they will look to see if what's logged is within standards - depth/time/# of dives/etc. The whole 'QA" program is a big piece of the whole risk management process, that drives things like being able to get insurance coverage, so I'm not saying this as a bad thing by any means.

All that said - I agree that the lack of import from other computers (coughShearwatercough) or even a reasonable CSV import makes it a non-starter for me. I'm sticking with MacDive since i'm firmly in the Apple ecosystem.