Why is a Jacket BC better than a BP/W?

[Eric Sedletzky]

I bet if the major jacket BC manufacturers were still including them in today's jacket BCs, their marketing teams would come up with some more inviting term than "crotch strap".

"Verticle stabilization strap".

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Yes, and I have even said so myself. You really could have saved yourself the effort of typing that up.

... then perhaps you should educate yourself a bit on the topic before making sweeping statements like the ones you've been making.

I don't personally care what anyone chooses for equipment. It really only matters that it fits you properly, that it's appropriate to the type of diving that you're doing, and that it's properly functional. Beyond that, it's purely a matter of personal preference.

I do, however, dislike seeing people making misleading or ignorant claims about the perceived benefits or shortcomings of equipment when it's pretty clear they don't know what they're talking about. That doesn't really make the discussion beneficial to anyone. It sounds too much like some of the things you hear from dive shop owners trying to sell you something ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[redacted]

I bet if the major jacket BC manufacturers were still including them in today's jacket BCs, their marketing teams would come up with some more inviting term than "crotch strap."

"Verticle stabilization strap".

Or find a way to add a pocket and a battery and call it....

 

[dfx]

... then perhaps you should educate yourself a bit on the topic before making sweeping statements like the ones you've been making.

Seriously, what the hell? Here I am, for the umpteenth time clearly explaining that I'm talking about a particular (albeit common) case, yet I'm accused of "making sweeping statements" and being uneducated. I have no words left.

 

[flots am]

That SS backplate 6 pounds you remove from your weights. Remove the SS backplate and add 6 pounds to your weights. What are you winning?

• Flexibility in my back
• The elimination of a manifold, and isolation valve and two non-standard tank valves
• The ability to get in the water with nothing more than mask, fins and snorkel, which is a definite advantage for anybody with balance problems, arthritis or replacement joints.
• The ability to switch out tanks for whatever I want without needing to bolt them together or purchase bands or a new manifold.
• The ability to remove individual tanks to hand to to the boat, or clip off to a line while waiting to re-board.

 

[mrdre]

• Flexibility in my back
• The elimination of a manifold, and isolation valve and two non-standard tank valves
• The ability to get in the water with nothing more than mask, fins and snorkel, which is a definite advantage for anybody with balance problems, arthritis or replacement joints.
• The ability to switch out tanks for whatever I want without needing to bolt them together or purchase bands or a new manifold.
• The ability to remove individual tanks to hand yo to the boat, or clip off to a line while waiting to re-board.

You are talking about side mount or that "Z-mount", right? I don't think anybody argues against that.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Seriously, what the hell? Here I am, for the umpteenth time clearly explaining that I'm talking about a particular (albeit common) case, yet I'm accused of "making sweeping statements" and being uneducated. I have no words left.

Hmmmmm ...

If you don't need the versatility offered by a BP/W setup, then there's nothing you gain by increasing the complexity of your gear.

I hate weight belts. The jacket BCD takes care of that, your BP/W doesn't.

It doesn't change the fact that if you want or need lead with a BP/W, you're either stuck with the belt or have to add separate weight integration, while with a jacket BCD it's already sorted out for you.

Well you see, these are the kind of responses that you get from BP/W advocates when confronted with the common issues with that setup. You can do this and you can do that, there's this solution and there's that option, this particular one here doesn't have that problem and if you add this part over there then that lets you do that. Yeah, sure. Or you can get a jacket BCD which already does everything you want and you wouldn't have these shortcomings to begin with.

None of those statements are true in all cases. Yet you made no attempt to qualify your comments, and stated them as though they were definitively and always true. They are not.

Normally I value your posts quite highly, but... come on, really? "If you want to get rid of the weight belt," how is that a generalization? I don't know how many times I've posted that now. If you don't like WI and/or prefer a belt, then please use it. If you're OK with diving only with non-ditchable weight, please go for it. But many of us need or want ditchable weight, hate the belt and want WI. Jacket BCDs have that problem solved. Obviously you'd get one with WI if you're part of that group, derp. BP/W doesn't have that problem solved, only other stuff you add on to it solves it.

Shows a lack of understanding of what a BP/W is ... by its nature it's a component system. Would be simpler to just say that if you don't want to put effort into choosing a rig that's suited specifically to you, then get one that has everything built in so you don't have to think about it. If on the other hand you want a system that allows you to pick and choose features, then a component system like a BP/W would be a better approach. And for what it's worth, BP/W isn't the only system that allows you to pick and choose features ... it's just the one most used.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Hawkwood]

...
Shows a lack of understanding of what a BP/W is ... by its nature it's a component system. Would be simpler to just say that if you don't want to put effort into choosing a rig that's suited specifically to you, then get one that has everything built in so you don't have to think about it. If on the other hand you want a system that allows you to pick and choose features, then a component system like a BP/W would be a better approach. And for what it's worth, BP/W isn't the only system that allows you to pick and choose features ... it's just the one most used.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

Thank you. That is a nice, simple description/explanation that I can use.

Bill

 

[EFX]

... by its nature it's a component system. Would be simpler to just say that if you don't want to put effort into choosing a rig that's suited specifically to you, then get one that has everything built in so you don't have to think about it.

I like what you said about the BP/W being a component system. You can even add the exact same components that are part of a BCD. I started diving with double AL80's and one of the problems I had to solve was how much weight and where to distribute it. Unfortunately, I need a lot of weight so A SS BP was a no brainer. I needed another 20 lbs. I also needed it, or most of it, to be ditchable. I finally settled on two ScubaPro integrated weight pockets exactly like the ones that come with the Scubapro Nighthawk (which I also dive with and like a lot). These simply slide on the harness waist straps and held in place with D rings (yeah, I know -- non-DIR = stroketastic).

One issue, probably a minor one, for those that like BCD's is that not being a component system you have to live with features you don't need.

 

[flots am]

You are talking about side mount or that "Z-mount", right? I don't think anybody argues against that.

Side mount. That z-mount thing with all the hoses is just bizarre and I can't believe the UTD people promote it.

---------- Post added August 26th, 2014 at 05:02 PM ----------

Never heard of aluminium backplates? They weigh next to nothing..

Still not "bendy" like I am. Even if it weighs nothing, it still doesn't get me anything.