Why I don't use a computer (anymore.)

[CAMPER]

I was not able to get a perfect score on all my certification tests like you guys. I would be quite nervous about relying on my own calculations, I guess I'm old enough now to realize how many mistakes I do make. The computer will not make those math errors and as long as you dive with reasonable conservatism my guess is you'll be safe.

Ed B

 

[pipedope]

Using a computer is not a bad thing.
Blindly following the computer with no cross check is a bad thing.

Everywhere in diving we strive for at least dual redundancy, try to do the same on tables/computer.

Example, even with a computer you should plan your dive. Know where your are going and for how long and run a table solution. Now while diving you can use the computer and know if the tables and computer are coming up with wildly different answers. If so, take the more conservative one, or abort the dive and recheck everything.

Even manual calculations can be backed up. When I run my tables and my buddy runs her (his) tables we better come up with the same answers or one of us, maybe both are making a mistake.

How do I know if my computer is failing if I have nothing to compare it to?

michael

 

[Lost Yooper]

Originally posted by DivingDoc


Last month, my husband and son and myself went to Coz for 2 days. On the first day, we went only on a beach buoyancy check and a couple of afternoon shallow dives (50 and 40 feet respectively). On the second day we did a two tanker -- first dive 80 feet, second dive 50 feet. Did safety stops of 5 minutes at 15 feet on both dives.

That evening and the next day, my husband and I both felt quite achy -- not in the joints, mind you, but in the muscles -- and fatigued. Don't think it was mild deco illness as trouble was in the muscles, not the joints, and there were no neurological symptoms. I suppose we could just have been holding all our muscles tight because of the anxiety of diving when we hadn't for 3 years.

Any thoughts on how we could change our dives to reduce or eliminate this problem?

Are you guys phyisically fit and used to swimming? It just sounds like sore muscles related to exertion during the day of diving (including dealing with your equipment pre/post dive) to me. The best remedy is to swim a couple times a week with fins on and staying physically fit.

Take care.

Mike

 

[g2]

I use a computer as a back-up to my brain, not a substitute.

First, let's draw a distinction between recreational and decompression diving, i.e., any dive requiring an obligatory deco stop. For me, the difference is in the level of planning. If I were to plan a dive with the potential for mandatory decompression stops, the profile would be clearly defined beforehand (in my case using DCEIM tables) and I would stick to it. In the event that the profile deviated from the plan -- and even if it didn't -- I'd still like a computer with me to add another layer of safety, just in case I figured the deco stops wrong. Between the planned stop times and what the computer says, I would choose the most conservative.

The vast majority of my dives, however, are the relaxed recreational kind, virtually unplanned by comparison. Depending on the objective, I prefer to structure these dives as one long, slow ascent: I feel that's the safest way to dive in most circumstances (arguments pro or con?). This is where tables, even multi-level ones, bite the dust: they're just not designed for this type of diving. A computer overcomes this deficiency, but I recognize that the computer may not be perfect at it either, so I dive conservatively with a good understanding of its limitations. And in all cases, I take my bio-programmable common sense alarm unit that will supercede the computer if I detect anything wrong: my brain.

Originally posted by Uncle Pug
1. Dive computers Rot your brain....

If you mean to say that many people rely too heavily on them, then I agree. Otherwise I'll speak for myself. You seem like a smart guy, Uncle, do they rot YOUR brain? If you use dive planning software, you too are using a dive computer...

Cheers, g2

PS - BTW, a couple years ago I took the Emergency Dive Accident Management course out at USC/Catalina's Wrigley Marine Science Center. Talk about an eye opener! The course included some excellent presentations on the history of dive tables, computers and decompression models. Highly recommended.

 

[Newhampster]

Lotsa hype in here.
Could do a disservice to lotsa folks.

Doing deep deco with very gradual ascent is good. A computer doesn't stop you from doing that. How this is a reason to avoid a computer is beyond me.

Lots of folks dis computers because they're too conservative. That's their problem, not mine. I run a Cobra and a Stinger and don't want something less conservative. Heck, on a four or five dive day, they seem too liberal! Try using the tables and planning out 5 dives, starting with one at 85 feet and so forth.

Average rec diver is helped by a computer -- assuming they don't have their head buried up their wet suit.

So let's not get carried away telling folks to avoid computers. That's bad advice. Just as bad as bein' stupid and failing to apply a lot of the diving knowledge that's been accumulated over the last 50 years.

I hear you about the value of more advanced methods, but keep it in context. Depends on the diver and the context they're working in.