why hate safety devices?
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Dr Wu
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If you require a "beep" to tell you you are beyond your "reserve gas pressure" you might want to consider the reason you think that sort of margin is worthwhile on the sort of diving you do.
It is not.
A "beep" is a failure in this case.
It is not.
A "beep" is a failure in this case.
I have no problem with someone who uses audible or visual warnings as a confirmation for what they already know.
The problem is when people become complacent and use the warnings as the signal that it's time to take action. IMO, if you hear the warning, that time has already passed.
The problem is when people become complacent and use the warnings as the signal that it's time to take action. IMO, if you hear the warning, that time has already passed.
I'd much rather be proactive. If you understand the parameters of the dive before you begin, you won't be in the position of having your computer beep a warning at you that you didn't expect to hear -- when you are not in a position to respond well to the warning. And if you know the warning is coming, how necessary is it?
I spent an hour or so in the pool with students last night. The water was full of beeping, because the students don't have the greatest buoyancy control AND swim with their hands, and the computers are constantly whining about ascent rates. By the end of class, I think most of the students are conditioned to ignore all the beeps, because they don't know what they mean, and they aren't relevant.
I spent an hour or so in the pool with students last night. The water was full of beeping, because the students don't have the greatest buoyancy control AND swim with their hands, and the computers are constantly whining about ascent rates. By the end of class, I think most of the students are conditioned to ignore all the beeps, because they don't know what they mean, and they aren't relevant.
theduckguru
Contributor
Anti-lock brakes are an expensive safety feature on a car. If you fail to maintain proper assured/cleared distance when you drive, anti-lock brakes don't provide much added safety. If you do maintain proper assured/cleared distance, you don't need anti-lock brakes.
Plan your dive and monitor your air and you dont need an integrated computer with an alarm either.
Plan your dive and monitor your air and you dont need an integrated computer with an alarm either.
DevonDiver
N/A
I think there are several issues:
1) People disagree with AI on the basis of streamlining/configuration, rather than technology. Especially where AI is hose routed and leads to a 'brick console'.
2) Occurance of failure in digitial vs analogue devices, including wireless links.
3) Recognition of psychological issues, such as dependancy and reliance on 'automated' awareness.
I don't disagree with AI in principal. However, I do feel that issue 3 is important consideration when I give advice to divers.
1) People disagree with AI on the basis of streamlining/configuration, rather than technology. Especially where AI is hose routed and leads to a 'brick console'.
2) Occurance of failure in digitial vs analogue devices, including wireless links.
3) Recognition of psychological issues, such as dependancy and reliance on 'automated' awareness.
I don't disagree with AI in principal. However, I do feel that issue 3 is important consideration when I give advice to divers.
I'm not a pilot either, but I have to wonder if we can just take at face value the argument that flying IS so much different from scuba? Has it been established that pilots are generally quick to adopt varying new devices touted as making flying safer/easier, or do they tend to prefer more traditional/conservative means of maximizing safety, for instance by emphasizing diligence in monitoring conditions and equipment, and keeping important skills practiced? I know there are a few pilots on this board, perhaps they can shed some light on the typical attitude towards new inventions in that community.
Damselfish
Contributor
I love dive computers, they're very helpful for the diving I do (though I've never bothered with any alarm type features and have little interest in AI computers - or at least not enough to want to pay for it.) For some people they're less useful. And some people, including lots on this board, have trouble putting themselves in other people's shoes and recognizing what's useless to one person is perfect for another. It's like there is no situation but their own.
But one thing that makes scuba different than flying, or lots of other things - water (particularly salt water) and electronics don't mix well. It's an environment hostile to technology in general. Some people feel too much or unneccesary reliance on it is a bad thing for that reason.
Another difference is how well trained people are, and how seriously they take what they're doing. I doubt anyone would argue having an altitude warning on a plane is a bad thing. At the same time, I'm thinking it's a pretty rare pilot that regularly coasts along paying no attention to altitude until the alarm goes off. In diving, it seems there are more people who will actually do the equivalent given the means. And some folks feel making it easier for people to understand less about what they are doing, or pay attention less, is less safe and a bad thing. Beats me.
But one thing that makes scuba different than flying, or lots of other things - water (particularly salt water) and electronics don't mix well. It's an environment hostile to technology in general. Some people feel too much or unneccesary reliance on it is a bad thing for that reason.
Another difference is how well trained people are, and how seriously they take what they're doing. I doubt anyone would argue having an altitude warning on a plane is a bad thing. At the same time, I'm thinking it's a pretty rare pilot that regularly coasts along paying no attention to altitude until the alarm goes off. In diving, it seems there are more people who will actually do the equivalent given the means. And some folks feel making it easier for people to understand less about what they are doing, or pay attention less, is less safe and a bad thing. Beats me.
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