Why are primary lights so expensive?

[cool_hardware52]

If you want to see ridiculous prices look at outboard motors! I can buy a pretty nice car for what one costs.
Can lights are a bargain compared.

Outboards aren't cheap, but they are a highly engineered, complex combination of power plant, transmission and final drive. 4Stoke and emissions controls have added to the cost also. The fact remains that it is a competitive market with a number of players all selling similar performance at similar prices.

Tobin

 

[cool_hardware52]

yes, the majority of cells sold are unprotected, but it only is a good idea with IMR/INR cells

Internal protection circuits are far from the best alternative. IMO internal protection is a band aid solution to poor pack design.

Popular with DIY pack assemblers for simple reason that some protection is thought to be better than none.......


Tobin

 

[runsongas]

No matter how you design a LiCo battery, it will always be less intrinsically safe than an IMR/INR cell. IMR/INR is going to replace ICR for the majority of uses in the next few years.

 

[lucca brassi]

Ya I was struck by the ridiculous cost of a Supercar, I mean after all they have 4 tires and an engine just like a Toyota Corolla. Wow the margins on those must be Huuuuge.

Tobin with all respect , you don't have the slightest insight into what is happening in the background of the automotive industry. To development of a seemingly insignificant parts of the car work sometimes requires years of development and an unbeatable cost. The contracting authority is constantly changing design and lowers the cost of the final product, disregarding the price of raw materials . This I can say this for sure from first hand.

 

[lucca brassi]

High cost for canister diving lamps are different :

1. ) construction was type of experimentation GO / NO GO nothing serious design

2.) not optimized production ( derin costs , they made canisters from ''single rod'' because they don't know how to mould delrin and other thermoplastic ) , so waste was huge.
H made that with latest '' granat'' style canisters

3) market is small / distributors prices

4) at start HID bulbs and ballast were exsotic - they still are and small quantity of producers rises prices
and dictate market

5) leds , optics , drivers are relatively cheap , but , producers started instead of optics beam construction and design , they work with combination of different parts trys and learning errors
( typical is tilly tec ;-)) ) Very few lights have behind idea of true construction of new light for me is that idea behind DiveXtras but have some mistakes and it was not (?) successful.

6) after all that years there is still no correct test procedure that could evaluate and right score diving lamp and as feedback give back right price on market.

7) I don't know for USA but in Europe if you want to sell something and get CE certification you need to pay some serious test procedures which costs. ( oh.. I remember in USA is all OK till someone hurts and that one most prove that , he hurts from specific product ( and if he die ?) ...( that is trade problem between Europe and USA btw right now)

and many , many other things

But high quality light is still expensive . I build several lights and I come with price without charging my work on 1/2 price of lamp in shop. That mean top materials and good construction )
I can simply conclude that other half go for work costs , maintenance of machines or place of production , saving some money , R&D....
I still remember MB SUB close workshop , with such wonderful ideas they have and good construction and production 8 it was my frst most wanted light at start of my light and diving career )

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Mostly Chinese don't know what they do. They produce something .... in huge quantities and cheep
in other words they pollute world. And of course they copy and they copy a lot ! They copy so much that they copy also errors ( sometime huge ) from originals.
They are capable to made good light but i don't know do they have interests to do something like that?

 

[Bennno]

Mostly Chinese don't know what they do. They produce something .... in huge quantities and cheep
in other words they pollute world. And of course they copy and they copy a lot ! They copy so much that they copy also errors ( sometime huge ) from originals.
They are capable to made good light but i don't know do they have interests to do something like that?

Well, it's not just the Chinese. Lots of stuff is being copied by 'newer' companies in eastern Europe. I don't wanna name names, but some companies over there don't do anything but copy stuff other people have come up with.

 

[Caveeagle]

Well, it's not just the Chinese. Lots of stuff is being copied by 'newer' companies in eastern Europe. I don't wanna name names, but some companies over there don't do anything but copy stuff other people have come up with.

Well sure... If nobody is going to stop the Chinese from stealing designs and content, then why wouldn't you expect others to do it too.

 

[Bennno]

Well sure... If nobody is going to stop the Chinese from stealing designs and content, then why wouldn't you expect others to do it too.

Nobody wants to stop them... people want cheap stuff and most people are not willing to spend extra for stuff that's made by workers making a living wage.

 

[Caveeagle]

Nobody wants to stop them... people want cheap stuff and most people are not willing to spend extra for stuff that's made by workers making a living wage.

I suppose that's true. My other hobby is RC aircraft (planes and quads). Spektrum is one of the leading suppliers of radio equipment. From what I can tell, all their Tx/Rx components are made in China. In the last few years you can find several suppliers of 'Clone' parts and 'Compatible' parts. Some are hard to differentiate from the originals, but some are unique designs that are quite different, but function as well (or better) than originals. I the 30+ years if flying RC models, I have had only 1 radio failure that resulted in a pretty bad crash. It was from a locally purchased Spektrum branded radio Rx that turned out to be from a known defect.

Know, consider that Rx(receiver) costs around $70 usd, when you can easily find a clone/compatible Rx(receiver) for well under $20 online. I currently own and use both. ..Have equal confidence in both. You can make the 'living wage' argument all you want, but the reality is most people will typically choose $20 over $70 if the items prove to be comparable.

Does this apply to dive lighting? Somewhat. I have tried a couple cheap Chinese backup lights and both flooded within 10 dives. I know there are folks on here that have had good success with some versions. I currently own 3 primary lights, (DR, and AUL) and 6 backups (Dr and Hollis). I suspect the backup lights are re-branded off-shore makes of some sort, but they are at least backed by a US based company.

 

[kelemvor]

Here's some reading for you. Gigafactory 1 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The gigafactory is estimated to cost 5 billion. Panasonic pitched in 1.6 billion, nevada pitched in 1.25 billion in incentives. Most of which are tax breaks spread over a 20 year period. Tesla paid the rest of the 2.1 billion. I'm not sure how nevada giving Tesla 62 million a year in tax breaks for a $2.1 billion investment equates to "Tesla scored". Although obviously the tax breaks weren't enough to keep the second gigafactory (to be constructed in Japan) in Nevada.

Also, if you read about large enterprise at all you will find that nearly all (or maybe all) states give big tax breaks like this to large corporations for moving (or keeping) operations to a particular state. I know Florida does this sort of thing all the time, especially with Tricky Ricky in charge. I don't particularly like the idea but it's not some bizarre back room dealing, it's standard and well publicized practice in most or all states in America.

Tesla was planning the factory and considering other locations before Nevada gave them a deal sweet enough to clinch the state as Tesla's destination. If you're upset about the tax breaks, you should point your ire towards the great state of Nevada. It was Nevada that decided it was in Nevada's best interest to outbid Texas, California, Arizona and New Mexico on tax breaks for that particular factory.