Why are jacket style BCD's the most common??

[dogbone]

You may have to expand on what you are asking. There are plenty of hybrid BCDs that are back inflate and combine the ease of a jacket style fitting with a back inflate wing. Such as the zeagle ranger, scubapro seahawk 2 and cressi patrol pictured below. I would not say that this style of BCD offers the level of customization that you are asking about though.

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there are also a wide array of harnesses that can be fitted to a Backplate and wing. These are most often referred to as deluxe harnesses, some examples below. But among technical divers, especially cave divers the use of these kinds of harnesses are largely discouraged in favor of simple Hogarthian harnesses.

Scuba Dive Harnesses - Find harnesses and dive wings as well as lift bladders and more

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asking less about back inflate wings, and if there's more wrap around wings that keep you upright at the surface....has anyone seen any of those for BP&W?

 

[loosenit2]

There is a LDS in Plano (Dallas burb) that uses BP/W's exclusively for new divers going through basic OW. (Scuba Adventures). The students do not have to buy them for the course either. The LDS provides them with a BP/W. It is a Big Blue H shop so that is what they teach with.
Brilliant way to entice a new diver to buy 1.) a BP/W and 2.) Halcyon products.

Disclaimer: I have a Halcyon BP/W and I love it!

Out of curiousity do they use a hogarthian harness with them or a “deluxe” harness that have multiple adjustment points? Seems like using a “deluxe” harness that has more adjustment points might be a way to bridge the gap, offering LDSs the ability to use BP/Ws and still offering the sizing and adjustment options they need.

 

[Nemrod]

I've been wondering why jacket style is by far the most common. I understand that dive shops carry them more sell more of them etc. Shops carry them because they are the common/popular.

What I'm trying to understand is why are the jackets the most common, how did they become the most common

They are more popular because jacket style or integrated BCs are the bread and butter high profit margin product (along with snorkels) for the LDS. LDS stock them and force feed them and truthfully most LDS have no real knowledge of modular concept wings or back plates. But to some extent I see the same kind of "think" fixation with the wing/BP in that most such users of them dive single tanks yet they use a clunky metal plate that was designed originally to support a twin set.

As well, jackets are promoted at least at some level, if only subconscious or inference, that they are SAFE and this causes all sorts of warm and fuzzy feelings that the words "safe" and "secure" usually generate. They are promoted as life vests. And since, as a swimmer, when I observe most other divers, I would class most of them as non swimmers. So why would they not want a life jacket? Even though a BC is not a life jacket, is not designed to be a life jacket, is not certified or CGA as a life jacket and only a horse collar will reliably (possibly) float an unconscious diver face up. And despite all the blather about wing/BP systems, they absolutely will not float an unconscious or incapacitated diver face up. Nor will most jacket style BCs but what they will do that a wing/BP cannot, is lift the head and chest higher from the water as long as the diver is conscious enough to provide stability or input to augment the position.

I was trained originally, no BC, none, nada, zip, zero. So I have only been a reluctant user of any type BC. I have never owned a BC jacket and have only used one in total for a couple of dives at most. I have either used none, a horse collar type or a wing. The most ideal BC on the surface is the horse collar, the most ideal BC underwater is the wing, everything else fits somewhere in between the two end points. The wing/BP facilitates good trim and horizontal positioning in the water. Some of the back inflate systems do so nearly as well. And have the same deficits, like face planting the diver on the surface.

As discussed repeatedly in other threads, most divers today are travel divers and these travel divers, the bulk of them, are getting older and grayer by the day. And us older divers like simple things that work and are not heavy so that our resort porters and DMs do not have to break a sweat toting them around for us. Clunky, heavy, metal plates with big, heavy D-rings and metal buckles and all that with weight belts just are not the idea such a diver has in mind to tote around the airport and between customs. And who would want that cold, ugly sheetmetal plate with thumbscrews poking out the bottom up against their easily bruised skin or tearing a hole in their new rash guard, not me! At least once to the resort I can have a tropical drink and have somebody else rig and carry the contraption for me . I am gonna have to tip them anyways so I might as well get some work out of them for it.

N

 

[O-ring]

As others have said, one big selling point is weight integration. A lot of people need/like to dive with a lot of weight and hate weight belts. Most bp/wings don't have a slick way for a diver to carry 52 lbs of ditchable weight.

 

[lowwall]

As others have said, one big selling point is weight integration. A lot of people need/like to dive with a lot of weight and hate weight belts. Most bp/wings don't have a slick way for a diver to carry 52 lbs of ditchable weight.

Argh. In my OW training, they put me in a jacket and gave me 16 pounds of lead with a 3mm suit. All the better to keep me on my knees I guess.

I now dive with a standard steel BP. The 4 pounds of lead I need with this setup and a 3mm are in little trim pouches on the waist band.

 

[O-ring]

Argh. In my OW training, they put me in a jacket and gave me 16 pounds of lead with a 3mm suit. All the better to keep me on my knees I guess.

I now dive a 3mm with a standard steel BP. The 4 pounds of lead I actually need are in little trim pouches on the waist band.

Yep, can't have you moving around while trying to learn skills.

 

[loosenit2]

As others have said, one big selling point is weight integration. A lot of people need/like to dive with a lot of weight and hate weight belts. Most bp/wings don't have a slick way for a diver to carry 52 lbs of ditchable weight.

??? There are plenty of ditchable weight pockets for Backplate and Wings, they simply slide over the 2” webbing on the waist. Can also add trim weight pockets to the tank bands.

 

[O-ring]

??? There are plenty of ditchable weight pockets for Backplate and Wings, they simply slide over the 2” webbing on the waist. Can also add trim weight pockets to the tank bands.

That's good to know. I haven't looked at any of the systems closely since Halcyon released the ACBs and that was years ago.

 

[Catito]

Why can we not just acknowledge that shops use jacket style BCD’s for training and rental fleets because they are more easily adjusted? Yes BPWs are entirely more adjustable but it requires more effort to do so. Put on a jacket style BCD, pull a couple of tabs, tighten a strap or two and wallah, it fits. Getting a proper fit with a BP/W, with a Hogartharian harness takes a lot more time to get right. Will it serve you better in the long run, probably, but that does not mean that a BP/W will meet training and rental needs as well.

Yes, simple...Voila!

 

[Ayisha]

...At least once to the resort I can have a tropical drink and have somebody else rig and carry the contraption for me . I am gonna have to tip them anyways so I might as well get some work out of them for it. N

So that was all tongue in cheek and you do travel with a backplate.

I met you at Portage Quarry in 2006 and I think you were diving "vintage" gear. I am petite but now much older and I have no problem lugging my scuba gear including bp, plus my suitcase.