What would you have done?

[MyDiveLog]

I did a boat dive last weekend with my regular buddy. A third diver, who was less experienced, asked if she could join us. Since the trip was organized by our dive club and I'm an officer of the club, I felt compelled to allow her to join us.

The first dive of the day turned out to be fairly advanced ... probably more advanced than the skills of the newer diver. We splashed in and descended on the anchor line. Visibility was about 15' ... lots of particulate in the water .. and a medium current was running. I led, with the new diver in the middle, and my normal buddy at the rear. We found the pinnacle, which began at 75'. We dove the pinnacle, reacing a depth of 95', until the newer diver reached 1200# (our agreed turn point). My computer was at the top end of the green Nitrogen loading zone, so I would have turned the dive at that point any way.

I led the group back towards the boat, ascending to about 30 feet before doing so. The poor vis meant there wasn't really any visual reference (couldn't see bottom, couldn't see any reef, etc.). The newer diver began having bouyancy problems, ultimately swimming upside down to stay at 30' and losing the battle. Her BC wasn't fully vented, so I swam to her and began venting but, by the time I got the BC vented, she was at the surface. My computer wasn't in the "yellow" Nitrogen loading zone and we surfaced about 15 feet frm the boat. Rather than have her descend and do a safety stop, which would have required a surface swim to the anchor, we exited. My regular buddy stayed down at 15' for 3 minutes, then surfaced.


Everyone was ok, but clearly we 'skirted the limits' by skipping the safety stop and surfacing too fast. My questions:
1) Should I have ended the dive when I suspected it was beyond the limits of the new diver?
2) Should I have surfaced with her, knowing that she was close to the boat, or should I have stayed down for a safety stop?
3) Should I have made her swim to the anshor line, descend, and do a safety stop?

 

[kraken]

Everyone was ok, but clearly we 'skirted the limits' by skipping the safety stop and surfacing too fast. My questions:
1) Should I have ended the dive when I suspected it was beyond the limits of the new diver?
2) Should I have surfaced with her, knowing that she was close to the boat, or should I have stayed down for a safety stop?
3) Should I have made her swim to the anshor line, descend, and do a safety stop?

Here is what I think, but being there you are a better judge.

1) From the story it seems like she was ok until the end, you also don't specify exactly how new she is, just out of open water.. etc. Personally, assuming she was trained to 95' I would have taken her, watched her closely, and evaluated as the dive went along. If she was ok during the rest of the dive, I don't think you did anything wrong. She is an adult and has to take some of hte responsibility for a) agreeing to the dive and b) losing bouancy. The only suggestion I think you already know is react faster to her problem, but of course that is easy to say sitting here at home and not in the water.

2) I think you did right by going up with her, you could not have known what type of events would have taken place on the surface, what happened if she panic'd. Since you were in the green theory says you can go to the surface and probably not get bent while int he green. Not saying that is good, only that is how I understand the theory. If you were in the yellow or deco you would have to make a judgement call, and generally means you look after your own safety first.

3) Since I assume you were in california and therefore close to a chamber don't go back down. If she (or you) suffer a type II hit you're in deep doo-doo. On the boat they can get you O2 and off to the chamber. O2 does amazing things to help someone suffering from DCI/DCS, I've seen it first hand.

As a leader in the club it might be a good idea for you to A) suggest she take a bouancy class and/or B) arrange a club bouancy event. Just an idea.

Final idea, promise, consider taking a rescue class or DM class if you have not already done so, you learn a ton about dealing with new divers. Just be prepared for the steep insurance costs.

dave

 

[theskull]

1) Should I have ended the dive when I suspected it was beyond the limits of the new diver?
2) Should I have surfaced with her, knowing that she was close to the boat, or should I have stayed down for a safety stop?
3) Should I have made her swim to the anshor line, descend, and do a safety stop?

1. In hindsight, yes, but hindsight is SO easy. Depends on how strong your suspicions were. Ultimately, she was responsible for her ownself and could have called the dive any time. I see no fault here.
2. Absolutely, you should have surfaced with her. This assumes you can do so without reasonable risk to yourself, which it sounds like was the case. Once someone starts screwing up, you must stay with them if possible. What if she was unable to manage her own buoyancy at the surface as well?!
3. No. Never descend for an omitted safety stop. For omitted deco, maybe--just maybe. But not for a safety stop that is not required.

My most dominant thought, especially knowing she was a less skilled diver, is could you have returned to the anchor line and ascended on the line? I much prefer having a reference and hand-hold when ascending from a deep dive with a diver of unknown ability.

Good job, though. All safe.

theskull

 

[ShakaZulu]

What these guys said ^^^^^^. For an open water safety stop with a new diver, you could have shot a bag and let her use that as a reference. It's also a good idea to focus on a new diver in these type of situations. Face-to-face ascend, just to make her feel more confident. If I dive in groups of three, I let each diver dive with me as if the other guy is not there. That way you maintain buddy responsibility.

 

[Tollie]

I think you have some good answers to your questions… you did the right thing bring her along and keeping her between yourself and your regular buddy; absolutely given your own “green” status you did the right thing by coming up with her… no telling if she had a gear malfunction or was at the beginning point of panic.; no you should not have brought her back down for a recommended not required safety stop.

The only small point I might raise is that you three should have ascended when one team member was up. I think it was unwise for your buddy to stay down essentially solo in such a situation… of course given that he was able to ascend with out a deco obligation.

Actually with the dive planned as it was why should any of your team had a mandatory deco stop?

 

[MyDiveLog]

Thanks for your comments. I'll respond to a couple of things...

To Tollie: you're right. None of us had a MANDATORY deco stop but I always do one just as a safety precaution, no matter what the dive computer says. Given the conditions (had to swim against a fair current), it was an even better idea.


To Shaka: Shooting a bag sounds like a smart idea, except that I don't own one and have never done this. Do you carry a bag on every dive for a situation like this?

To TheSkull: Hindsight is definately 20/20, and my suspicans weren't that strong to begin with .... they sort of increased as the dive unfolded. I was headed for the anchor line to ascend, but we ended up stopping short due to the incident. In all candor, my navigation skills are pretty darn good, but I'm not sure I could have found it easily in such poor vis. I didn't want to return at depth, which would have made it easier to find the anchor line given the poor vis, due to the nitrogen loading. Definately doing this site on Nitrox next time!

To Kraken: Great comments ... as a new instructor I've taken all the rescue classes, etc., but I still appreciate hearing other's perspectives.

 

[cortez]

My most dominant thought, especially knowing she was a less skilled diver, is could you have returned to the anchor line and ascended on the line? I much prefer having a reference and hand-hold when ascending from a deep dive with a diver of unknown ability.

I agree with everything that theskull said, but I tend to prefer some sort of reference regardless of how well I know my buddy and/or his or her ability. References tend to calm everyone down - remember relaxation/rest is important to offgassing. Plus they are an added element of safety - no better way to stop an uncontrolled ascent than to grab hold of something.

I prefer referenced ascents whenever I cannot clearly see the surface - ie. I look up and see that its getting lighter, but cannot ascertain details or relatively how far I am from the surface. Bad explanation, so my apologies. Think of it this way, in the Carribean I just hanging at 15' feet is awesome - no need for a line. In the local diving holes, I'll go for a referenced ascent or descent if at all possible.

I've found over the last year, make that 6 - 9 months, that shooting a bag is a great skill to have and a lift bag/SMB a wonderful accessory for any type of diving. Nothing nicer than a custom made ascent line

 

[ScubaTwo]

I've found over the last year, make that 6 - 9 months, that shooting a bag is a great skill to have and a lift bag/SMB a wonderful accessory for any type of diving. Nothing nicer than a custom made ascent line

Would the lift bag be considered a crutch? I ask because I am a new diver. This summer I got to do ocean boat dives for the first time. Because I was soooo excited (happily) I was using my air faster then my more experienced group. We all decided that at a certain point I would signal ok and up and my buddy and I would accend while the other 4 continued. This didnt always leave me at the accent line. In my OW training the instructor used a line for visual reference but didnt let us hold onto it unless we absolutely had too. Im still so much more comfy with a line. I guess what Im asking is, is it frowned upon? Sorry to babble off the main topic but this sounds like something I could use. Thank you for any information you might be able to give me.

 

[cortez]

I don't think it is a crutch, its a tool used to execute a dive with precision and safety. I think anything that can add value to a dive is useful and should therefore be considered thoughtfully.

I know a few "macho" divers who think of me as a wuss for preferring a reference line - that's fine, its their opinion. I know that the lines make descents and ascents easier for everyone.

I would say that they should only be viewed as a crutch if you find yourself without the proper bouyancy control to perform a safety stop and end up hanging on the thing. If that is the case, work on fine tuning your bouyancy to solve that problem.

If you do decide to get a spool and SMB keep a few things in mind:

1.) Make sure you are comfortable with the inflation technique. Seek out the knowledge about how to use them.

2.) Practice deploying - "shooting" - one in controlled environments before attempting to a deployment from 100 feet in your local quarry.

3.) They are useful for a reference. They are not useful in stopping a runaway ascent and shouldn't be viewed as the primary means of pulling yourself to the surface.

 

[DiveGolfSki]

I did a boat dive last weekend with my regular buddy. A third diver, who was less experienced, asked if she could join us. Since the trip was organized by our dive club and I'm an officer of the club, I felt compelled to allow her to join us.

The first dive of the day turned out to be fairly advanced ... probably more advanced than the skills of the newer diver. We splashed in and descended on the anchor line. Visibility was about 15' ... lots of particulate in the water .. and a medium current was running. I led, with the new diver in the middle, and my normal buddy at the rear. We found the pinnacle, which began at 75'. We dove the pinnacle, reacing a depth of 95', until the newer diver reached 1200# (our agreed turn point). My computer was at the top end of the green Nitrogen loading zone, so I would have turned the dive at that point any way.

I led the group back towards the boat, ascending to about 30 feet before doing so. The poor vis meant there wasn't really any visual reference (couldn't see bottom, couldn't see any reef, etc.). The newer diver began having bouyancy problems, ultimately swimming upside down to stay at 30' and losing the battle. Her BC wasn't fully vented, so I swam to her and began venting but, by the time I got the BC vented, she was at the surface. My computer wasn't in the "yellow" Nitrogen loading zone and we surfaced about 15 feet frm the boat. Rather than have her descend and do a safety stop, which would have required a surface swim to the anchor, we exited. My regular buddy stayed down at 15' for 3 minutes, then surfaced.


Everyone was ok, but clearly we 'skirted the limits' by skipping the safety stop and surfacing too fast. My questions:
1) Should I have ended the dive when I suspected it was beyond the limits of the new diver?
2) Should I have surfaced with her, knowing that she was close to the boat, or should I have stayed down for a safety stop?
3) Should I have made her swim to the anshor line, descend, and do a safety stop?

You seem to have reacted well to a potentially dangerous situation. However, here are my thoughts:

1. I always feel that proper dive planning prevents any surprises. I'm not sure how a dive goes from one level to "becoming fairly advanced". You have to plan a dive accordingly. If you intended to go to 75' then 95', then I'd would say that's an advanced dive. If so, you should have asked an unfamiliar diver about her skills and abilities. It's the least you should do as "an officer of your dive club". Of course, she may or may not tell you the truth but, at least you'll have a chance to assess her skills prior to the dive.
2. Had she not given you a true picture of skills, you and your buddy did monitor the situation by keeping a close eye on her anyway.
3. My answers to questions 2 & 3 depends on whether or not it was a deco stop or safety stop. I agree with others that you don't have to do go back down to do a safety stop. I'm not sure how close you were to pushing the tables. What algorithm does your computer use (RGBM, Haldane, etc.)?

All these is an exercise in Monday morning quarterbacking. You a very good job given the situation you were in. Just be thankful, you didn't have any deco requirements and your surfacing wasn't rapid (I hope....).