What do the numbers on scuba tanks mean?

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@KWS

OSHA and DOT are governmental agencies. In setting up the CFR, DOT and PHMSA adopted the standard proposed by the CGA. The CGA standard is the actual law in 49 CFR Subpart C 180, not PSI/PCI. PSI/PCI trains to a standard that is compliant with CGA then adds their scuba oriented spin on it. If you also read the CFR, you will see that yearly visual is NOT required. The visual requirement is before hydrostatic testing.

PSI/PCI has always pushed for yearly visual as part of their training and has tried to bamboozle everyone to thinking that legally you have to be a PSI/PCI inspector and do a yearly visual in order to be compliant with the CFR when that is not the case. With that said, the yearly visual is not a bad idea due to how poorly some tanks are treated.

Also, who are you saying is "stealing" PSI/PCI's work? Everybody involved is basing it off the CGA standard anyways since that is the actual requirement per the CFR.

I agree with you fully. PSI is not about that,,,,, it is about what are the legal binding standards. Yes the CGA is incorporated in the CFR's that makes them have force of law. other agencies proceedures etc is not in the CFR's too many refuse to accept that. I dont like the idea of 23.5 requires O2 service cleaning. it is contrary to other sources but it is what is in the CFR's and that is what counts in a court. You are right about the vis and its relationship to hydro's. that is not seen in reality however. no sticker no fill even if a hydro was done a week before. There is a lot of ignorance out there but ,,,,, and there is always a but. it is their shop, and if they will not fill without a sticker then you have to buy one or go else where.

the theft of materials was with course creation and updating. The agency name is moot , they have been to court if I remember right. the situation is what is Important. other agencies let PSI do the reasearch and they made their courses from one of their people taking a PSI course. duplicating PSIs material instead of doing the research themselves. They were mad because the feds limited inspection of certain tanks to be done ONLY by a trained PSI inspector who was trained with the most up to date and thorough information available. that got a lot of panties wet in other agencies. That started the pissing contest with PSI. claims that the feds favored PSI occured and was foundless because PSI was the only one that did the work and could prove their processes and methods were 100% in compliance with the cfr's. Yes they added a few things to the precess like supporting the 23.5 because of the possibility of PP blending instead of using actual standards such as not exceeding 40% O2. PP blending is basicly using pure O2 and since bn PCI's view blending is blending , all methods of blending should be limited to 23.5% for O2 clean. It is not logical for continuous blending systems when used. I also do not like the idea that when an agency thinks things should change the makers make it happen. PSI should be (poor wording) enforcing law not making law.

lastly in the field teh issue of

Everybody involved is basing it off the CGA standard anyways since that is the actual requirement per the CFR.

There is a reason why it is that way. the impact of PSI made that happen. still you do not see the compliance in the field because to comply it is expensive to do right. especially when it comes to nitrox and O2 systems. The most highly failed standard is tank fillers are greatly untrained. Ask them sometimes what training they have had. and where they went to get their hazmat training and handling at. They will say they did not get any training. all they got was the boss saying hook things up this way and fill the tank. very common in mom and pop shops where the owners non employee 14yo does VIS STICKER """""""REPLACEMENTS""""""""AND AIR FILLS.
 
@KWS

OSHA and DOT are governmental agencies. In setting up the CFR, DOT and PHMSA adopted the standard proposed by the CGA. The CGA standard is the actual law in 49 CFR Subpart C 180, not PSI/PCI. PSI/PCI trains to a standard that is compliant with CGA then adds their scuba oriented spin on it. If you also read the CFR, you will see that yearly visual is NOT required. The visual requirement is before hydrostatic testing.

PSI/PCI has always pushed for yearly visual as part of their training and has tried to bamboozle everyone to thinking that legally you have to be a PSI/PCI inspector and do a yearly visual in order to be compliant with the CFR when that is not the case. With that said, the yearly visual is not a bad idea due to how poorly some tanks are treated.

Also, who are you saying is "stealing" PSI/PCI's work? Everybody involved is basing it off the CGA standard anyways since that is the actual requirement per the CFR.


I believe the CFR's say an anual inspection will be done in accordance with xxxxx You do not have to be a PSI inspector to be legit to do an inspection and I have never heard that from any PSI staff or material at any time. What they will say is that PSI inspectors are the only ones that have the training and proceedures that 100% comply with cfr's and whose inspection documentation will stand up in court if challenged. I also remember something about that PSI is the only one that requires the inspector ID on the vis sticker. Then there is the thing about how bogus others vis stickers are inregards to inspection being done in accordance with scuba industry standards. which do not exist. Its all part of the documentation that combined with the rest has convinced the feds that PSI is most qualified self policed group to be the sole contact for inspection of some vessels.
 
where in the CFR? I don't see it
And I don't think you find it.
Anyway, the really critical stuff in the CFR just references the CGA regulations, which you have to pay through the nose to get. Obscene. The law is telling me I must conform to it, but won't tell me what it is.
 
most scuba shops don't have to deal with the portions covered by the CFR though as they neither manufacture cylinders nor are they RIN facilities performing hydrostatic testing.
 
That makes some sense ... except for where does 3442 come from? I always wondered that. Seems so random.
As I understand it, it is a number someone came up with so that a yolk reg could be safely used with a converter insert on a 3500 tank and 200 bar style valve. 3442 tanks are actually 3500 psi tanks brought down to be more versatile. I remember when 3442’s first came out and they were all the rage because there was finally a legit high pressure alternative to needing DIN regs for anything over 3000.
Before that 3000 was the highest you could get for yolk (usually aluminum tanks) or LP steels. 3500 meant needing DIN regs.
Also as I understand it and was told, that the O-ring used in 3442 tanks for yolk need to be of a higher duro than just regular valve O-rings to prevent against extrusion and blow out.
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/peregrine/

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