Wetsuit configuration for Northern California diving

[Ricky B]

It's my understanding that the water temperature in Monterey Bay ranges from 50º to 60º F. What would be the pros and cons of different wetsuit configurations for that kind of cold water diving?

First off, I recognize that many divers won't dive around here wet. But I am not ready for a dry suit yet, and my question is not what is the best exposure suit. It's a request for help in configuring a wetsuit.

Full 7mm wetsuit vs. Farmer John

For example, the NeoSport 2pc John & Jacket Wetsuit Combo is 7mm, which gives 14 mm over the core. Obviously going to be warmer than a single-piece suit. Is it possible that it would be too warm in Monterey Bay?

On the other hand, one could put a vest over a single-piece suit to add additional warmth if need be.

I assume that the Farmer John is easier to get into and out of than a single-piece suit, but is that assumption correct?

Is one going to be easier to get warm with in the surface interval? For example, I imagine that one could take off the jacket of the Farmer John, peel down the straps off the chest, and cover up the core with something warm and dry. With a single-piece suit, peeling the suit down to the waist might be more awkward in terms of sitting.

The Farmer John, having more neoprene, would presumably require more weight. But is the additional neoprene enough to create a significant disadvantage?

While 14 mm is less flexible than 7 mm, I don't see the torso needing to flex that much in diving.

On the other hand, there are the 7/5 mm suits, with only 5 mm in the arms and legs that would offer more flexibility, and if more insulation is needed, it could be over the core with a vest?

Any other advantage or disadvantages to one or the other?

Hooded vs. Separate Hood

I assume that a hooded suit or vest will be somewhat more effective at keeping water from penetrating. On the other hand, there might be a separate hood that would be preferable, say, because it's thicker/thinner, has a vent, or whatever.

Thoughts?

Thanks in advance.

 

[Peter_C]

Best way to save money on a wetsuit is to buy a drysuit...with an Otter Bay hood. You also got the water temps wrong as they are 43-55 degrees. The best diving days typically have 48 degree water. Not fun in a wetsuit.

If you really want a wetsuit plan on buying a nice thick custom suit that will cost about as much as a drysuit.

 

[Keith.M]

I have used both farmer john and full.

The biggest problem I had with the F.J. was the no stretch in the torso! I felt so restricted in my breathing.

I do fine with a good hood. You just need to make sure it has a long enough skirt to not come out during the dive.

A hooded vest would be a decent addition when the temps get down there. I have yet to see anything above 57, but have also seen 48.

 

[Vegan Shark]

I started diving in Monterey in a farmer john. For shallow dives on an al80 tank I was comfortable. Just didn't like feeling like the Michelin man with all that bulk, and the buoyancy shifts were a little annoying, so I switched to a cheap 7mm. Cheap suits don't use high quality neoprene, and compress like crazy at depth, so at 60 ft I froze my ass off, and promptly ordered a hooded vest when I got home.

I even tried a 7mm farmer john jacket over my 7mm full-suit out of curiosity. Will never do it again, but hey I was super warm even at 100 ft

Then I started diving a steel 130 instead of an al80, and the longer bottom times meant more heat loss. So I upgraded to a high quality semi-dry, with a 5mm short-john underneath it. That keeps me comfortable up to about 2 hours underwater.

If you're doing the usual shallow sites like Breakwater on an al80, and not doing too many dives per day, then you can be comfortable in a farmer john for sure. If you want to be the warmest you can be without a drysuit, then buy a hooded semi-dry, with a 5mm short-john underneath. Hooded suits are not only warmer, they're way more convenient and easy to put on by yourself.

Only you know your cold tolerance, though. One of Bamboo Reef's instructors dives in a 7mm without hood or gloves and doesn't complain of the cold. I personally would be miserable in that setup.

---------- Post added March 6th, 2014 at 01:40 AM ----------

Best way to save money on a wetsuit is to buy a drysuit...

You said this when I first joined the forum, and I thought, "Pssh, no way, who needs an overpriced, complex drysuit!" but now that I am going to doubles I wish I had listened.

7mm: $230
Hooded vest: $80
Semi-dry: $400
Short john: $160
Total: $870, about the same as an entry-level drysuit.

Then again sometimes we don't know what we want to do with diving. If someone has no intentions of ever going down the tech route, and just dives irregularly, a wetsuit is probably the better choice.

 

[Peter_C]

My first drysuit was $400 and lasted me a couple of hundred of dives, and came with undergarments for that matter. Cost is relative since my first semi dry wetsuit cost the same, and got me through a whopping 20 dives before being mostly retired. We typically start our dives in the 60 foot range though. I have not dove with anyone yet, that enjoys diving in 48 degree water in a wetsuit.

 

[Vegan Shark]

$400 with undergarments? If only I could talk shops down that low

The drysuit I'm going to end up with is $900. Not too bad, but undergarments really add to that. Santi and Fourth Element's warmest undergarments are $500+, and that's without the $200+ base layer...

 

[fnfalman]

Talk with a custom wetsuit maker and see if they can make a single-piece that has double the neoprene on the chest and back area.

I dive my conventionally styled 1-pc 7mm wetsuit down to 48-F before. Yeah, it's chilly but entirely workable. Beats fighting the drysuit by a mile. If I were to do deco diving, I'd consider a drysuit, but for good old fashion rec diving, I prefer the simplicity of the wetsuit.

 

[Keith.M]

I would seriously doubt that $400 drysuit is from a shop. Lots of suits available on the used marker. Even suits that have never been in the water.

I recently picked up a DUI TLS that has not been wet. It's a stock XL which I needed for my chest, but it is long in both the arms and legs.

I am trying to decide if I will try and alter it temporarily and dive it. Or if I might just turn around and sell it, get into a new cheaper suit that fits better in arms and legs.

I think I may cuff the arms and legs, tape the fold inside with duct tape and dive it. If I end up liking it, have it professionally altered, if I don't, I can remove the tape and resell it.

---------- Post added March 5th, 2014 at 11:18 PM ----------

48 is the lowest I have been in with my wetsuit. It was OK, but I was cold.

 

[scubadada]

I only dive cold water a couple of times a year, maybe a dozen or 15 dives total. I dive a full 7mm with a hooded vest, good gloves and booties. I'm fine for full dives down to the low 50s, pretty usual temp in San Diego, my most common destination. I've dived down to 47 degrees and got quite cold by the end of the dive, nearly shivering

If cold water was my local conditions, I would certainly invest in a drysuit

 

[fjpatrum]

Ricky, personally I'd go with the combined option. I have a 3mm FJ that I thought might be enough under a 7mm step in jacket but it wasn't. I ended up using a 4/3 full suit under the step in jacket with a 5/3 hooded vest under both. It sucked. It's hard to breath with that much neoprene on. Conversely, a 5/4 or 7/5 hooded vest and a 7mm full suit is almost as much core coverage and is quite comfortable for most people down to the temps you're talking about in Monterey. Either way, you're going to want a hood.

As to the quality of the neoprene, that's garbage. Most of the cheap suits are made in the same factories with the same neoprene as the expensive suits, they're just not lined or taped or niceties like that (which do significantly help with warmth and comfort) but the neoprene isn't crushing any differently at depth.

EDIT: One thing to consider-- the "hyperstretch" neoprene suits are not as warm (to me) as other non-stretchy neoprene suits. If you get cold easily avoid those. I don't know for sure if it's just design differences or neoprene differences but my hyperstretch suit stays in the closet... it's significantly colder than my other suits of the same thickness.

All that said, look for deals on dry suits as well. I bought a used DUI TLS350 for $200. Works great and even when it slightly flooded I was significantly warmer than my vest/suit/jacket option and far more comfortable. Finding that kind of deal is very unlikely, but when you factor ~$130 for a 7mm suit (inexpensive) ~$60-80 for a vest (inexpensive) you're starting to add up the costs.

Diving wet can be done and if budget is the biggest factor, that's the route I'd go. You could consider some of the heated vests as well, which get mixed reviews. They are an option, though, as are heat packs inside your suit (just get the kind that don't require air to work and put some insulation between them and your skin).

As for comfort, I have no issues getting into or out of a full 7mm suit or stripping down to the waist and wearing it like that for surface intervals. It's not as easy as doing it in a 3mm but I'm fairly flexible in the shoulders and skinny, which helps. Others have significantly less comfort.

One last thing... I've never been too warm under water. Certainly wouldn't happen in Monterey unless I had poured lava in my suit. If in doubt, go the "warmer" option and deal with the buoyancy issues as they arise.