Weekend Courses

[DCBC]

As we decrease our standards, we decrease the level of proficient divers. As the number of proficient divers decreases, resorts and dive boat operators will prevent divers from engaging in more exciting diving opportunities.

I agree Trace. Much of the industry seems only interested in revenue generation. The standards of the 60's and 70's were broken-up into so many pieces by PADI that once a diver completes their first program, they are only 20% trained.

They are dependent on DMs and Instructors to hold their hand in the shallows. I have seen DMs and Instructors that I wouldn't give an OW card to. If these Instructors don't have the knowledge, how can they hope to pass it on to their students? The circle keeps getting smaller...

 

[Armymutt25A]

I just got back into diving this year. I got certified in 8th grade back in 1990. If I recall correctly, the course was 6 weeks long, one night a week with an hour or so of classroom and an hour or so in the pool. It finished off with two days in a local lake. I didn't dive again until 2009. I did a refresher course last March, which consisted of answering a few questions and a table review, followed by all of the under water skills learned in OW. I didn't have any issues and realized that I had only forgot a small amount of information. I've since been on a few boat dives where there were people who had done the one week course or a weekend course much more recently than my training. They didn't seem to be very comfortable or proficient. I'm wondering if these weekend courses are really doing a disservice to divers by not allowing them to develop their skills to the point where they will stay with them after years of non-use.

 

[oly5050user]

I just got back into diving this year. I got certified in 8th grade back in 1990. If I recall correctly, the course was 6 weeks long, one night a week with an hour or so of classroom and an hour or so in the pool. It finished off with two days in a local lake. I didn't dive again until 2009. I did a refresher course last March, which consisted of answering a few questions and a table review, followed by all of the under water skills learned in OW. I didn't have any issues and realized that I had only forgot a small amount of information. I've since been on a few boat dives where there were people who had done the one week course or a weekend course much more recently than my training. They didn't seem to be very comfortable or proficient. I'm wondering if these weekend courses are really doing a disservice to divers by not allowing them to develop their skills to the point where they will stay with them after years of non-use.

So the 6 week course you took back in 1990 was a total of 12 hours.It was "an hour of class room and a hour of pool" that comes out to 12 hours.
A weekend course usually runs from 7 to 11 on Friday night (4 hrs) Saturday is 9am to 4 pm and Sunday is 9 am to 4 pm..Total time is 18 hrs.Then there are the 4 ow training dives to be done next. How is this shorter than what you did in 1990? It comes down to the individual ,wheter it was a 40 hour course or an 18 hour course.Everyone has different abilities and skill sets.I have seen people do a discover scuba ,which can take as little as 1 1/2-2 hrs and be better divers than people who say they have been diving for 10 years.

 

[RU4SKUBA]

Perhaps it would be wiser to consider requirements for Staff Instructors and Course Directors to take education/instruction courses and learn to teach the teachers?

That way the instructors begin to develop actual teaching ability, become more efficient, and create a better product within the current framework. Then it puts the onus on the upper levels to take continuing education courses rather than just dumping a new standard on the already-over burdened OW instructors and there's an eventual payoff to the students.

Ever had a computer genius try to teach you how to do something? Better to ask their partner or roommate the same question, since the expert is rarely capable of relating since their skill sets are usually so much more specific and complicated.

I've been relatively fortunate on the quality of my previous instructors, but if there's an alternative to increasing the duration and cost of the OW program I'd say its making the instructors a more credible teacher.

 

[TMHeimer]

Am I understanding correctly that they had an 11 hour day? That is nuts.

Yes. The 6 hours in the pool were broken up by a pee break or two. Everything was completed, and rather thoroughly, as we had two instructors, a divemaster and the 3 of us DMs in training. Nevertheless, if I were taking the course I think I would've been overwhelmed. We had 11 students.

 

[SubMariner]

Perhaps it would be wiser to consider requirements for Staff Instructors and Course Directors to take education/instruction courses and learn to teach the teachers?

That way the instructors begin to develop actual teaching ability, become more efficient, and create a better product within the current framework. Then it puts the onus on the upper levels to take continuing education courses rather than just dumping a new standard on the already-over burdened OW instructors and there's an eventual payoff to the students.

Ever had a computer genius try to teach you how to do something? Better to ask their partner or roommate the same question, since the expert is rarely capable of relating since their skill sets are usually so much more specific and complicated.

I've been relatively fortunate on the quality of my previous instructors, but if there's an alternative to increasing the duration and cost of the OW program I'd say its making the instructors a more credible teacher.

I can assure you that any time there is a standards change at OW, it impacts EVERY level of Instructor, up to/including CDs, IDCSs, and MIs. We are ALL required to keep abreast of any new standards that apply to PADI Recreational diving.

ANY Instructor who wants to better themselves through Con Ed will be faced with having to update their knowledge base, depending on what Specialties they teach. Frankly, OW is just a fraction of what is out there.

In this context I would submit that "overburdened" is inaccurate when referring to OWSIs & OW classes. "Burned out", yes... "overburdened", no.

 

[MauiScubaSteve]

I for one wish the term Weekend Course would go away. The Open Water Certification Course includes the Open Water Dives! Pretty much none of the courses discussed in this and other Weekend Course threads or posts are actually Weekend Certification Courses. All these courses sound like 2-weekend courses to me; you folks are spoiled!

I have never heard the term Weekend Course used by any real operator here in Hawaii. There are con people with instructor certs who false advertise and I'm sure some big wave surfers/freedive hunters have have been certified in a weekend with their instructor ('cause I've done it), BUT the most typical advertised cert course here in Hawaii is the 3-day Course.

I consider it a 4-day course as the book/dvd takes one day (~8 hours). The first day is as described above; morning academics, afternoon pool (10 hours minimum). Second and third days are easier; just 2 Open Water shore dives (~7 hours). That is ~24 hours instruction. If you have lunch together and do happy hours together the instructor/student interaction approaches 30 hours and no tipping is required; just pick up the tabs

A reputable dive instructor working with the 3-day schedule should also have 4 and 5-day options, 'cause only people who are very comfortable snorkeling/freediving are likely to get it in 3 days. Most modern humans spend too much time in the cubicle or on the couch so 3-day courses should not be the norm. Most modern humans are cheap and impatient so 3-day courses are the norm. Luckily scuba is not really that hard and most half wit, half fit 10 year olds can manage a 3-day course.

 

[RU4SKUBA]

We are ALL required to keep abreast of any new standards that apply to PADI Recreational diving. ANY Instructor who wants to better themselves through Con Ed will be faced with having to update their knowledge base, depending on what Specialties they teach.

The point that you missed was that if many of the complaints regarding inferior students can be directly linked to inferior teachers, then why not ask the Staff and Course Directors to get some authentic education credentials?

Otherwise the only continuing education they're going to get is within the dive agencies specific to diving.

Sure it's very important, but it doesn't address the issue of quality of teachers in the instruction ranks. The people teaching the instructors should really possess some of this knowledge base or all they really are is a teacher with more knotches on the belt and the funds to pay for the title... so to speak.

Not bashing the Staff Instructors or Course Directors, just saying the issue of quality need not be necessarily always directed at the OW course and always suggest more dives and more hours in classrooms. Its obtuse thinking. Why not develop the teaching skills and make them more efficient?

A good teacher usually accomplishes their instructional goals because they're well-trained in documentation, follow strict lesson plans with logistics planning, use educational system design, are fully prepared for the lesson, and are excellent at paperwork.

Let's be honest here, these are not the strengths of the typical dive instructor.

 

[TMHeimer]

I've had 8 Instructors so far and they all seemed pretty good to me. But I guess what you're saying could be true. It took me 5 years of college to get my public school teaching certificate. Then again, there are 20 basic scuba skills, so the subject matter to be learned isn't comparable. How one presents the work and rapport with students is the key.

 

[Trace Malinowski]

I've had 8 Instructors so far and they all seemed pretty good to me. But I guess what you're saying could be true. It took me 5 years of college to get my public school teaching certificate. Then again, there are 20 basic scuba skills, so the subject matter to be learned isn't comparable. How one presents the work and rapport with students is the key.

Basic Scuba Skills:
1. Swimming Ability (strong swimming ability) - seldom required
2. Water treading (no longer required in steel tanks or even full gear with no BCD inflation) - often only required in swimsuit no gear and not always required. Note: My students have to do this in full equipment no BCD inflation. Rescue divers have to do this without fins.
3. Resting position - face down in water breathing properly through a snorkel (most instructors teaching snorkeling cannot teach proper breathing)
4. Surface dives in snorkeling equipment - one-legged, two-legged, feet first or "dirty water/kelp dive"
5. Snorkel clearing - expansion and blast methods
6. Propulsion - flutter kick, frog kick, modified frog, modified flutter, helicopter turns left and right, backward frog kick, rescue kick (inverted scissors), dolphin kick
7. Removal and replacement of scuba unit - at surface, on bottom,hovering over bottom, mid-water or blue water like during a safety stop
8. Removal and replacement of all scuba gear and equipment - at surface, on bottom, hovering over bottom, and mid-water/blue water
9. Removal and replacement of weight belt or weight system
10. Underwater breath hold swimming
11. Ditch, surface, return and don equipment
12. Mask flood & clear, mask removal and clear, no-mask swimming
13. Regulator clearing - 3 ways - hum/exhale into it, purge button, swish/tongue piston
14. Air sharing with additional second stage
15. Buddy breathing with primary
16. Buddy breathing with octo
17. Breathing from the corrugated BCD inflate/deflate hose using auto-inflator
18. Tank valve breathing
19. Creating a face mask with an air pocket
20. Proper ascent rate - kicking
21. Emergency ascent - kicking
22. Air sharing ascent - kicking
23. Buddy breathing ascent - kicking
24. Proper ascent rate - BCD (oral & auto control)
25. Emergency ascent - BCD (oral and auto control)
26. Air sharing ascent - BCD (oral and auto control donor, oral receiver)
27. Buddy breathing ascent - BCD (oral and auto control, donor, oral receiver)
28. Proper ascent rate - breath control
29. Air sharing ascent - breath control
30. Buddy breathing ascent - breath control
31. Repeat all ascents with 1 diver missing mask
32. Repeat all ascents with both divers missing masks
33. Safety stop - maintain normally, air sharing, buddy breathing, no mask and two divers no mask (all skills with and without up line)
34. Buoyancy - no more than a 3 - 5 foot shift in any skill
35. Trim - no more than 20 to 30 degrees from horizontal
36. Trim 'round the world - vertical, horizontal, right side down, suppine, left side down, inverted
37. Regulator breathing while inverted and suppine
38. Breathing through a free-flowing second stage
39. BCD inflation at surface (bobbing)
40. Controlled descents - feet-first, head-first, horizontal
41. Valve drill - one of the worst crimes in diving education is to not perform valve shutdowns and openings. No diver should die because he or she jumps into the water with the air off and cannot turn it on. Proper weighting, strong swimming and water treading abilities, and ability and skill at valve drills will prevent many of these deaths.
42. Rescue - simple self-rescue and simple buddy rescue and assist techniques should be part of all open water training
43. Compass navigation - outbound and reciprocal courses
44. Stuck BCD auto-inflator - kick against buoyant force, vent gas from rear dump, disconnect auto-inflator, and neutralize buoyancy orally
45. Air-gun first stage - understanding how to manage the noise, bubbles, confusion, and ascent or air-share ascent related to a first stage malfunction in class will reduce stress later
46. Gas management - being able to plan and conduct dives working in PSI, RMV, and SPG calculations on the fly, i.e., reading gauge psi and knowing one's remaining volume and time at a glance
47. Being able to use decompression tables in case of accidental overstays, adjust for altitude, and understanding what to do for omitted deco and treat DCS and AGE
48. Properly plan a dive to include sequence and responsibility of team members, whether to use all air, 1/2 air or thirds as it pertains to recreational diving, planned and max depths, duration, distance, direction, safety stops, etc.
49. In water check for: Deployable additional second stage, octo, long hose primary, bubble check, ability to reach valve, and equipment inventory
50. Reserving enough gas to get two divers to the surface at max depth in an air share slowly, safely to include safety stops.
51. Entries - giant stride, entry from height, forward & backward rolls, seated, beach/wave entry
52. Exits - Ladder, "California Crawl", beach/wave, kick/pull up into inflatable or pool deck

All skills but, backward frog, helicopter turns (using 2 feet), air gun of first stage, and rule of thirds, and planning in rmv and spg pressure to volume on the fly were part of my open water course as a student. I added the backward and heli kicks, air gunning and SPG time/psi/volume on the fly relationship to my PDIC OW course when I teach it.

Some of the older guys have done even more. I may have left a skill or two out accidentally, but if I missed something or you older guys have a good OW skill aside from advanced navigation, Search & Recovery, line/reel work, etc., that is better suited for AOW let me know.

Compared to nearly 30 years ago and earlier, today's open water diver is really only getting a Resort Course - Plus. In fact, PDIC's "Resort Course" has similar training to other agencies' open water courses. It hasn't been changed since it was first created around 1980, and now, as standards have dropped, full open water programs read like an old resort program. Sometimes NEW does not mean IMPROVED.