Watson Murder Case - Discussion

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I am no expert on refugee law, but the grounds for claiming refugee status require persecution on certain specified grounds. Persecution generally is insufficient. I think in practical terms deportation to the US will be the only option...it is unlikely any other country would take him with that criminal record. The persecution argument runs into the difficulty that there if there is in fact a double jeopardy consideration, then that can be dealt with by the US legal system, or there isn't in which case there is no ground to consider him unduly persecuted.

So does that mean that if, for instance, he was facing a death penalty, we would still deport him, as his state does have that option?

Sorry, I know this is getting a bit off track but I am interested to know.
 
I am no expert on refugee law, but the grounds for claiming refugee status require persecution on certain specified grounds. Persecution generally is insufficient. I think in practical terms deportation to the US will be the only option...it is unlikely any other country would take him with that criminal record. The persecution argument runs into the difficulty that there if there is in fact a double jeopardy consideration, then that can be dealt with by the US legal system, or there isn't in which case there is no ground to consider him unduly persecuted.


That actually makes a lot of sense. Why should the fight take place in Australia? I wonder if it is a given that he will be sent back to Alabama in this case. This will certainly get more interesting when the time comes for a whole lot of reasons.

If I may ask you one more set of questions.

As you understand the status quo, Gabe being convicted in Australia should essentially mean that his case is different from others where an acquittal has happened and the government has asserted authority to try someone again.

What grounds if any will Gabe have to block evidence from Australia being used in a court of law in Alabama? Could he insist on having all witnesses present in court in order to have a fair chance at cross examination and the like, and if this ends up being logistically impossible, could he argue that the absence of these witnesses is grounds for a dismissal?

Are there any precedents that you know of in this vein?

Thanks for your indulgence in my armchair legal experiments.

Cheers!
 
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As has been said before there are no perfect systems only different ways to try to solve the same problems. It is dangerous to assume knowledge/understanding of one system necessarily translates to another.

That said I remember a case in Canada where US Citizen fought extradition back to the States for about 4 years because he was facing the Death Penalty in the US. Canada has not had the Death Penalty for years and the claim was based on this fact. In the end, an agreement was reached and he was deported.

I doubt that Australia will be any more inclined to "protect" a US Citizen from the US Government than Canada was. The most that would be likely is a temporary resistance and perhaps an agreement not to sentence him to death.

I would be interested to know just how far "circumstantial evidence" is accepted in Australia in serious crimes. If I was on a jury that is a question I would have to ask of the officials. Obviously it would take a lot more for me to find someone guilty beyond a reasonable doubt than others.

Dadvocate I have to agree that public pressure, pressure from the family and the media should not be allowed to influence the administration of justice. When the rights of a single citizen are trampled the rights of every citizen are compromised.
 
To reply to Livinoz and Dadvocate and to bowlofpetunias:

There is a difference between deportation and extradition. The former is an exercise of control over who enters and remains in the country. The latter is an exercise of power in aid of co-operation between nations (and hence, regulated by treaty).

The deportation per se would I think be unaffected by the possibility of the death penalty. It could in practice be affected by the granting of a different visa on refugee grounds but as I have previously indicate I doubt that any such refugee grounds would exist. A person is a refugee for the purposes of Australian migration law where there is a well-founded fear of being persecuted for reasons of race, religion, nationality, membership of a particular social group, or political opinion. None of those seem to be attracted simply because one might face the death penalty upon conviction in a properly constituted court of law having been afforded all due process.

There may be difficulties in extraditing Watson to the US. One is that there may be what is known as an "extradition objection" available, in this case the objection being that he has undergone the punishment provided by the law of Australia in respect of the extradition offence or another offence constituted by the same conduct as constitutes the extradition offence. Secondly, the extradition treaty between Australia and the US allows Australia to refuse the extradition unless the US gives an undertaking that the death penalty will not be imposed or, if imposed, will not be carried out.

As for the prosecution in the US, I don't really know a lot about the law of evidence in the US. In Australia, there are very limited circumstances in which one would be entitled to adduce evidence other than by having the witness give evidence (whether in person or by video-link) and face cross-examination. The US Constitution fairly stringently protects an accused's right to confront his or her accuser, and I imagine there would be similarly limited circumstances in which that would be allowed in the US.

As for circumstantial evidence, it is commonly admitted and used to some degree in most criminal trials I would think. Evidence of motive (in this case, for example, the potential life insurance payment) is almost always circumstantial in nature. It may be inferred, for example, from the existence of the policy, attempts to increase the amount insured, and the fact of financial difficulties. It is because a circumstantial case is necessarily a process of inferential reasoning that the law in Australia requires every necessary step in the process of reasoning to be proved beyond reasonable doubt, and the prosecution is required to exclude all other explanations consistent with the accused's innocence that are open on the evidence.

Finally on double jeopardy. It most often arises where there has been an acquittal on one charge, but it is not limited to that. The peremptory pleas of "autrefois acquit" and "autrefois convict" simply mean that the accused has previously been acquitted/convicted of the offence for which they are subsequently being tried and therefore the subsequent trial should not proceed.

Hope that helps.
 
And the defendant, having been fully terrorized about the possibilities of conviction of the greater charge, will lie and say it is voluntary. The innocence project has exonerated many defendants through DNA, people who pled guilty to charges of which they were totally innocent because they feared the greater evil of conviction of the higher charge--or the certainty of the death penalty.

Read John Grisham's book The Innocent Man. (It is a documentary of a true story, not a novel). You will see how an obviously innocent man was convicted of a crime he did not come remotely close to committing, with no real evidence against him, and sentenced to die. His final appeal saved him hours before his execution, and he was only saved because DNA proved conclusively that he was innocent. (It also showed who was guilty--the man who should have been the prime suspect all along.) You will also see that several other people convicted by the same people using the same process and who are just as obviously innocent will be in jail for the rest of their lives because they do not have the benefit of DNA to prove their innocence.

Here in Colorado we just had a man released from prison after many years after being convicted of a crime he did not commit, again freed by DNA. The obvious prosecutorial misconduct in the original case that led to his conviction is now being evaluated.

A number of years ago the governor of Illinois suspended the death penalty after more than half of the people on death row were proved innocent via DNA.

I was in Broward County, Fla a few years ago when when the local newspaper uncovered a mass of false confessions. Police arrested a man for something like burglary, and then told him he would get a lesser sentence if he confessed to other burglaries. Given that bonanza, the guy confessed to anything they threw at him, even crimes committed while he was in another stte. The newspaper investigated and discovered that this was a popular method of clearing cold cases there--offer leniency to anyone willing to take an old case off the books.

When you are faced with the horror of a certain conviction for a crime you did not commit, you will jump at the chance to pead to a lesser crime you did not commit, and when the judge asks if you are confessing freely, you will lie and say yes. Given the opportunity to get a lesser sentence for confessing to other crimes you did not commit, you will do the same thing.
Certainly my simplistic answer was not meant to imply that this was ideal/fair/or not inherently wrought with problems. Only stating that is how plea bargaining worked in US as I know it. My uncertainty was how much the judge is involved in this process. Being in the medical field...not legal...I do not expouse to be versed on law as a professional. Our system is rife with injustices. No doubt about it.
And being in the medical field I am forced every day to document the details of my performance, mainly to cover myself, my colleagues and the hospital, from possible litigation. There was a time we were there to help "save" lives and documentation was for the benefit of patient and other care givers. And it is redundant documentation that precludes spending quality time with the patients, which most medical personnel would prefer.
God forbid we should stop at an accident scene to help. We could lose our license if everything doesn't go just right.
 
I would argue, though probably not supported by case law, that Watson was never tried for murdering his wife. He was allowed to plead to manslaughter in her death for failing to assist her. At a technical level, that's far from the same thing. He was neither acquitted nor convicted of murder. Certainly, neither the US government nor the state of Alabama prosecuted him for any crime related to this incident. If the US and Alabama can make a case for jurisdiction, then I don't see too much problem with giving them a shot. Of course, they'll need a lot of cooperation from Australia in order to have any evidence at all to proceed. If the available evidence would support the charges in the US, then let them go forward and prove their case.

Admittedly, allowing the government to make repeated attempts to convict using different names for the crime is a dangerous precedent. Can you try someone for battery and then go after them a second time on a charge of assault associated with the same incident? Probably not.
 
I am not a lawyer, but...

U.S. law has a clever system that allows a defendant to be tried for the same crime twice. If a person has been tried in criminal court for murder, he or she can be tried later in civil court for wrongful death. The standard for conviction in civil court is less than it is in criminal court, so that a person who is acquitted in criminal court can be successfully convicted on the same evidence in civil court. The O. J. Simpson case is a prime example of this.

I would imagine that regardless of what the Alabama prosecuters decide to do, there will be a wrongful death suit to follow.
 
As a side note, what is the deal with parole in Australia? In the US, the general concept is that you serve your full sentence, but there are parole hearings and you get out early if you don't cause trouble and no one strenuously objects. One would think Tina's family would want to testify at parole hearings and that they might be persuasive under the circumstances, forcing Watson to serve his full sentence. Why does it seem a foregone conclusion that he will be paroled at the earliest opportunity?
 
Apologies for the length.

These sentencing remarks can also be accessed as a PDF file at Sentencing Remarks - Queensland Judgments - Supreme Court Library

SENTENCE R v WATSON

(P Lyons J)

HIS HONOUR: Stand up, please, Mr Watson. You stand convicted
on your plea of guilty of the offence of manslaughter causing
the death of your wife. The offence occurred when you had
both been diving in the vicinity of the historical shipwreck
Yongala some 48 nautical miles east of Townsville.

The deceased experienced difficulties during the dive. You
made some attempts to assist her but these were unsuccessful.
In the course of this, your face mask and deregulator were
dislodged. However, you were able to replace your face mask
and to get an alternative oxygen supply from what is referred
to as a "safe second". When this happened, you could see that
the deceased was sinking but you formed the view that there was nothing
you could do and you swam away with a view to getting assistance.

There are circumstances beyond those I have just described
which are relevant to determining your sentence. You were
clearly a far more experienced diver than the deceased was.
The deceased had what is called an open-water certification,
which I understand to be a basic diving qualification and
which she had attained some months previously. The dive at
the Yongala was a significant challenge for a diver of the
level of experience and competence of the deceased.
On the other hand, you were a diver with substantial
experience, although it is pointed out that much of your
experience was not in open waters where significant currents
could be encountered. You had a number of qualifications,
including a rescue diver certificate which you had obtained
some four and a half years before these events.


The dive was carried out using the buddy system. As your
wife's buddy for the dive, you took responsibility for
providing her with assistance if she encountered difficulty.
The Crown alleges against you that you failed to carry out
your duty to her in a number of significant ways. I accept
that you failed to do so in the following respects: you
failed to ensure that when the deceased had encountered
difficulties she had a supply of oxygen available to her, and,
in particular, you failed to share your oxygen supply with
her; having released the deceased to recover your face mask
and oxygen supply, you did not then take hold of her again or
stay with her, or follow her as she sank; you did not attempt
at any time to inflate her buoyancy control device or remove
the weights which divers often carry to assist them to descend.
It follows from these matters, that you failed to make any
reasonable attempt to take the deceased to the surface. I
therefore accept that you are guilty of a very serious
departure from the standard of care which was incumbent upon
you with the result that your conduct is deserving of criminal
punishment.

An offence such as manslaughter which involves the loss of a
human life is obviously a very serious matter. The deceased
was 26 years old. You were recently married. She had every
reason to look forward to a long and happy life. Her death is also
a great tragedy for her family. I have read the victim impact
statements. They demonstrate that she and her family were
very close and that she was very close to her friend.
They demonstrate how deeply her loss is felt by all of them.
Her family, obviously and naturally, take a very serious view
of your conduct and that, not surprisingly, appears in their
statements. However, there is much in those statements from
which I do not gain assistance in determining your sentence.

I propose to say something about the course of proceedings
which have led to today's hearing. The events which led to
the charge against you occurred in October 2003. You were
interviewed by the police on that day and on some occasions
subsequently. A coronial inquest was conducted in late 2007
and in 2008 resulting in your being committed in June 2008
and a warrant then issuing for your arrest. An indictment
charging you with murder was presented on the
28th of November 2008.

You have voluntarily returned from the United States and have
surrendered yourself into custody in Australia. In my view,
it is quite significant that at the time of your return you
did not know that the Crown would not persist in charging you
with murder, which carries a mandatory sentence of life
imprisonment. You no doubt expected that you would be
sentenced to a term of imprisonment for a substantial period
in what for you is a foreign country. You have, in fact,
acknowledged that you are guilty of manslaughter. You do
not seek to pretend that your actions were other than what
they were. In doing so, you have spared the deceased's family
the agony of a trial.

While in the context of the loss of the deceased's life it may
not be of great significance, it must also be recognised that
you have saved the community the expense of conducting a
trial. I regard your conduct as a recognition by you of your
wrongdoing and an expression of remorse. I am conscious
that you have no criminal history. There is, naturally, no
suggestion of a risk of reoffending.

You have provided a number of references from people who
appear to be quite reputable and to know you well. They
confirm that you are of good character. They also reveal that
you are a person who is known to help others and that you
loved your wife and were devastated by her loss.

I have referred to the delay in the prosecution of the case
against you. It is plainly considerable delay. When there is
delay in the prosecution of a criminal charge, a major
consideration which often works in reduction of the sentence
is the fact that rehabilitation may have occurred in the
period since the offence. That is not a relevant consideration
in this case. However, you have carried the burden of these
events for a substantial period. That is a matter to which I am
prepared to give weight. I consider that that burden has been
increased by the very extensive publicity which these events
have occasioned. That is demonstrated, to some extent, by
the obvious presence of a significant number of representatives
of the media in the court today. I also accept that in that period
you have been subject to accusations of matters of which you
are not guilty.

In addition to the admission constituted by your plea, I
accept that you cooperated with the police at an early stage
and that, generally, the essential matters relied on now for
acceptance of a plea of manslaughter were communicated by you
to the police in about October of 2003. In fact, a
significant number of them appear in the statement you gave to
the police on that day, including your certification as a
rescue diver, the fact that you and the deceased were on this
dive diving as dive buddies, and the circumstances in which
you left the deceased.

There have been, in some of your statements, some
inconsistencies and some attempts to put blame on other
people. There does not seem to be any persistence in your
attempt to put blame on anyone else and I accept that the
responsibility for this loss is yours alone. The
inconsistencies and those attempts, to me, while they do not
speak particularly well of you, should be looked at in the
circumstances in which they occurred. That is, they occurred
shortly after the dive and at a time when you, no doubt, were
deeply upset by the events which have occurred.

I have been referred to a number of authorities. I do not
propose to refer to all of them. There is always a difficulty
in finding authorities which are strongly analogous to the
circumstances of a particular case in which a sentence is to
be given. I do, however, note the submissions made by your
Counsel in relation to the case of Pesnak [2000] QCA 245.
That was a case where the accused had a significant period of
time, a matter of days, in which to identify the worsening
condition of the person who ultimately died.

Your case is quite different. The precise time is unclear,
but it can only have been of the order of two minutes from the
time that the deceased first started to encounter difficulties
until you surfaced, and the time within which you made your
initial decision to leave her was obviously significantly
less. I suspect that once you had made that decision and
decided to go to seek other assistance, there would have been
difficulty in reversing your decision and turning back again
to try to assist her. I accept, nevertheless, that there is a
very serious departure in your case from the requirements
of the duty of care which you had undertaken in the course
of this dive.

The seriousness of the matter, notwithstanding the factors
which I take into account in mitigation, means that it is
necessary to impose a penalty which provides for a substantial
period of imprisonment. I therefore propose to impose a head
sentence of four and a half years.

Because of the mitigating factors which I have identified and
because I accept that for you in Australia time in prison will
be harder than it will be for people who serve a sentence of
imprisonment in their own country, I intend to fix a
suspension date a little earlier than might otherwise have
been the case.

Accordingly, I order that you be imprisoned for a period of
four and a half years. I declare that the period of 23 days
from the 13th of May 2009 until the 5th of June 2009 be deemed
time already served under the sentence.

I order that the term of imprisonment be suspended after a
period of 12 months' imprisonment which will take into account
that 23 day period.

I am required to inform you that you must not commit another
offence punishable by imprisonment within a period of four and
a half years to avoid being dealt with for the suspended term
of imprisonment. For the avoidance of any doubt, I order that
a conviction be recorded.
 
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Wow...thanks for posting that. Gives a lot of insight into the decision rendered.
I prefer to think the judge knew best under the circumstances. It will be interesting to see if the US will pursue this thing...or if their first reactive posturing is giving way to more considered thought. I still think it is very likely the family will consider a civil suit. Not for the sake of money...but more in hopes of a possible chance to hear the words "Guilty of Murder."
ala OJ Simpson, since it appears the family is convinced of such.
 

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