Warning deep "bounce" dives warning

[MauiScubaSteve]

In recent days there have been some accidents that were a result of dives that have been described as bounce dives.

Could someone list these accidents? I'm only aware of one, 4 weeks ago.

 

[Tigerman]

It is definitely not overly conservative. If anything I would say it is I. The aggressive side. At 100ft, you need about 35-40 cf of air to get you & your buddy to surface with all appropriate stops. It may sound like a lot but don't forget, if thing happens, you & your buddy will be under stress, consumption will be higher than usual. 1300psi with Al80 is about 33cf, definitely not conservative at 100ft

How stressed you as the buddy or you as the one in distress would be is highly individual though..

Ive had people breathe off my octopus for 4-5 minutes because of a blown o-ring on my buddys first stage at a depth of 20m/65ft.
We jumped in and descended immediately to 20 meters. In the grand total of 9 minutes with 2 people breathing off my tank for half of it, we came out with a total consumption from my tank of 0,6 cf/min...
That said, if youre diving with someone who you dont know how responds incidents you shouldnt count on a combined consumption thts low..

 

[Teamcasa]

Could you list these accidents? I'm only aware of one, 4 weeks ago.

I'm sure there are several but they just were not called "bounce" dives.

 

[lowviz]

"If you give a man a fish, you feed him for a day. If you teach a man to fish, you feed him for a lifetime." -- Unknown......//.....

Bubbletubble: If you give a man a match he is warm for a day, if you set him on fire he is warm for the rest of his life. --also Unknown.




Where the hell is Mt. Olympus when we need them? Mods???

First (recent) "bounce diving" OP was in advanced, it was censored.

Second bounce diving post got into underwater hunting. It was just halted.

Now bounce diving is a topic of discussion for NEW DIVERS AND THOSE CONSIDERING DIVING???

Anybody awake up there???

 

[MauiScubaSteve]

What are bounce dives?
Well they are dives that are short in duration, Bottom Time but are deep done on single tanks.
What is deep? Well anything that is over 60', past recreational limits, or simply beyond the personal divers training and or gas planning requirements.

Reminds me of many AOW Deep training dives; including when I did my AOW Deep training dive (to the deck of the Duane-108'), when as a DM Candidate one of my audit dives was the same site AOW Deep training dive and when as a Dive Center Operations "student" I was the "DM" for same-same-same.

Would be interesting to hear of other's Deep training dives for AOW and Deep Specialties, where the max depths were close to Standards max depths. I think many would classify those training dives as short in duration.

 

[MauiScubaSteve]

In recent days there have been some accidents that were a result of dives that have been described as bounce dives.

Could you list these accidents? I'm only aware of one, 4 weeks ago.

I'm sure there are several but they just were not called "bounce" dives.

Well I'm not sure there was more than one, 4 weeks ago. If these several accidents were not called "bounce" dives, who is describing these several dive accidents in recent days as bounce dives?

 

[MauiScubaSteve]

A BOUNCE DIVE DOES NOT ACCOUNT FOR WHAT IFS!
I am assuming that a true BOUNCE dive is done on a single tank!
I have read of several in the last month and will not mention any particular accident nor wish to demean any diver, agency, LDS that is not my purpose!
My purpose is simple, BOUNCE DIVES ARE NOT SAFE!

As a dive guide, I had to make a single 80 cft dive to a 146' max depth, to stop the continued descent of a gray reef shark picture taking diver who was not paying attention; a dive which then continued as a multi level dive with over 45 minutes duration. So, with that as my only personal gas consumption data, if I and my bdb, who has a considerably lower consumption rate than mine, dived my 120 cf tanks (one each) quickly to 141' depth, it seems to me that the what if's are accounted for and the dive is not necessarily unsafe.

 

[TSandM]

I think the point of the original post is that depths are recommended to be kept conservative for new divers, for a lot of reasons, not the least of which is normally pretty high gas consumption. But it can be tempting to "go have a look" deeper, particularly if more experienced friends are urging you on. It's not a good idea. Until you have enough experience to understand your own gas consumption, AND to be pretty relaxed and facile with all the required functions of diving, you should stay up where your instructor told you to stay. I know very few people do that (and I wasn't one of them) but with more education, you begin to understand what the risks are of pushing your limits, and how poorly prepared you are as a new diver to cope with them.

We can argue all day about spearfishing or other reasons for deep bounce dives. But the bottom line is -- and I hope even VDGM would agree with this -- that brand new divers have no business even contemplating them.

 

[Centrals]

Actually, if I could go back to OW class and wave a magic wand, I would remove some of the emphasis on "don't dive beyond your training" (not because it's not a good message, but because it was mentioned over and over again and is a simple concept), and I would in its place add gas planning (which can be used to good effect on the dives within our OW training).

To introduce "gas management" in OW training is too early.
But make it one of the CORE topic in AOW or at least as 'speciality" for student to choose.

 

[MauiScubaSteve]

I personally think "Pandora's Box" was opened when the only deep bounce dive accident I'm aware of was used as the "introduction" of a thread in Basic Scuba Discussions. Seemed like the dive accident was already being discussed in the dive's Local sub forum, the A&I forum, the Hunting forum and the Instructor 2 Instructor forum. The Basic Scuba Discussions thread spawned the Advanced thread that was quickly closed, and now we end up discussing it in New Divers and Those Considering.



How does one now put Pandora back in her box?

And finally, if we have to discuss this now, what good will dressing the discussion up with a lot of hype and hysteria do? :sad: