Versatile Sidemount Rig?

[skankpile]

Nomad can come with a dual bladder, and I've had to use it.

Personally I like the nomad as it will let you do anything from OC, tech to rebreather hypoxic/expedition.. whatever. IMO continuous bungee sucks and when on boats, on ladders etc you need to have the cylinder secured. If you have the nomad you can change your setup to suit whatever condition you find yourself. I cant imagine the razor/xdeep style while bobbing in swells and surf. Also, the DR SM rigs cover your back so you are not ripping open your suit and the superfabric is damn tough.

On OC cave I imagine you'll be buying DR or H once your instructor starts prepping you. If an instructor has accepted you as a student you should already be aware of the equipment expectations.

I like to monkey dive on a site if given the opportunity, and the strap/bungee systems look perfect for that IMO.

 

[Patoux01]

IMO continuous bungee sucks and when on boats, on ladders etc you need to have the cylinder secured.

We all agree on that, which is why neither the xdeep or razor are recommended with continuous bungee... And why we have safety loops for the walks, but well, feel free to say it's **** =).

I cant imagine the razor/xdeep style while bobbing in swells and surf.

Exactly, you cant IMAGINE. Takes about 5 seconds to understand how to float vertically at the surface.

Also, the DR SM rigs cover your back so you are not ripping open your suit and the superfabric is damn tough.

On OC cave I imagine you'll be buying DR or H once your instructor starts prepping you. If an instructor has accepted you as a student you should already be aware of the equipment expectations.

I lol'd



As a conclusion, I was waiting for someone to say "The xdeep doesn't have the 9000 pounds of lift the SMS100 has, thus it's ****.", but this one is pretty good as well. Are you scraping the ceiling of the cave when you dive that you're scared of poking a hole in your suit?




I think it's just up to you to try the rigs. Everybody has their favourite and will defend it. I'm hoping to try a SMS100 someday to see how it feels, then comparing to a contour and finally back to my own rig.
There's plenty of people who can teach you in the stealth down there in mexico. Does it have to be Patrick? I'd say no.
I don't think you'd go wrong with sms, contour, xdeep, whatever there is in the main brands.

Agreed with the guy on previous page: It's a bit sad to take a course with someone that doesn't seem to be very good from what you say. I'd rather have spent that time on my own or with a buddy watching over me to get everything "in place" (roughly) and spent the money somewhere else. However the fact that he's not into "tec" diving does NOT mean he's bad. There are very good divers out there who wouldn't even think of taking stages with them becaues they don't feel like it. Does that mean they can't teach you the basics of your diving methods?


Finally, except if your tanks make you heavily overweighted, I don't think you need more than 40 pounds for a while, because then they're simply part of your weights. A bcd compensates the gas you use and the compression of your suit, nothing more, nothing less. You might want to double that in case you think you have to get your buddy up on only 1 bcd, but that means in "tec" that there's been 3 failures already...

 

[Jim Lapenta]

I did my OW Sidemount with Doppler last year. Used a Dive Rite Nomad LT tech. Got around 50 dives in with it. It's a nice rig for travel but for me and per Dive Rites recommendations not for more than LP 85's with a dry suit. Not even considering it with my 95's.

I have it, a Manta with 50 lbs of lift and a fun rig to dive. It does have more of a traditional BPW harness type but very easy to adjust and set up. I am not crazy about the lack of a full butt plate but it is not for those dives that require it.

I did my Adv Nitrox, Deco Procedures, and Advanced Wreck Instructor classes in a HOG SM rig. It performed very well for me. What I like about it is easy to adjust, three adjustment positions for the waist belt, and very easy to customize to the individual.

I've since sold one to a student and taught him his OW sidemount class in it.

Had mine on in the pool last night in fact conducting a tech skills workshop for one of my students.

 

[Razorista]

... neither the...or razor are recommended with continuous bungee...

Who does not recommend a continuous bungee on the Razor? The manual does not even mention alternatives.

---------- Post added November 8th, 2014 at 01:09 AM ----------

... a bit sad to take a course with someone that doesn't seem to be very good from what you say...

Most today experienced sidemount divers that are not instructors themselves share that bad experience, I think.
Most survived
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Regarding the Topic:
Stealth, Diamond and Razor have already been mentioned (I do not like the Manta personally, but it was mentioned as well and is at least adequate).
I would add the Agir Brook Ratatosk to that list - great name, versatile, small and cheap system, but there are many good ones beside that.

I would recommend the Razor 2.1, expensive but it is the 'best' system without doubt.

The Stealth has a few disadvantages in durability but will surely survive a single trip.
The wing will not be damaged by anything that can normally happen inside a cave, a wreck or outside (the valve is placed a bit awkwardly, however), the weight system is one of the most versatile and complete available.

The Contour is just a big piece of luggage, I would not want to take that on a plane (or in a cave, mind you, but I am not a cave diver admittedly).

 

[karstdvr]

Good luck with your cave class... I think you will have a blast.

LOTS of scope on kit. It certainly would help to get a chance to try out some options. If you intend to dive SM in caves and Great Lakes conditions from time to time, I've had students squared away very easily and quickly using the Hollis SMS75. It's designed to fit and deliver good profiling with a minimum of screwing around.

Too bad that you are taking a "SM class" with an instructor who sounds like he/she got their cert card with little or no experience... sounds like a bit of a dodgy affair. Sorry if this seems negative. However, the bottom line is take any advice they give with a pinch of salt and look forward to getting proper instruction in Mexico. Have fun!

I agree with Steve on two points here. Mexico tends to be myopic with their sidemount rigs specific to their conditions,which may not translate well to local diving,or cave diving in Florida/Missouri. Also,caveat emptor on picking sidemount instruction. Too frequently you will get someone trying to cash in on the sidemount commercialization rage and learn their skill one weekend and start teaching the next weekend. You will learn things you will unlearn and relearn in another course. FWIW it is very hard to get advice for best selection for your situation off forums,it is best to travel to a location and try different rigs,then purchase one and get very proficient before taking a cavern/intro class. You may find your time line of getting a rig,and becoming proficient by January may be too optimisitic,but you will get more out of your class if you don't have to learn new skills and new gear.

 

[gearhound]

I find that it's the other way around. The Florida divers are the closed minded ones. They figure everyone needs to be diving large overfilled steel tanks...not realizing that 99% of the rest of the world doesn't dive that way. You don't see the Mexican advocates saying you "need" to dive a certain way, but you certainly hear that coming from Florida. And I think they form these opinions without having tried any other system.

 

[rddvet]

I find that it's the other way around. The Florida divers are the closed minded ones. They figure everyone needs to be diving large overfilled steel tanks...not realizing that 99% of the rest of the world doesn't dive that way. You don't see the Mexican advocates saying you "need" to dive a certain way, but you certainly hear that coming from Florida. And I think they form these opinions without having tried any other system.

I agree with that, but will say it really happens everywhere. I find us Floridians are less open minded than the Mexican divers, but not by a ton. I've had conversations with Mexico-based, French, British, Russian, and Finnish cave divers and every single one didn't really understand why us americans do things how they do it. I'd say that the russians and the americans are the most opinionated though.

 

[nakatomi]

The wing will not be damaged by anything that can normally happen inside a cave
[...]
The Contour is just a big piece of luggage, I would not want to take that on a plane (or in a cave, mind you, but I am not a cave diver admittedly).

I never heard a non cave diver talk so much about cave diving...

 

[karstdvr]

I find that it's the other way around. The Florida divers are the closed minded ones. They figure everyone needs to be diving large overfilled steel tanks...not realizing that 99% of the rest of the world doesn't dive that way. You don't see the Mexican advocates saying you "need" to dive a certain way, but you certainly hear that coming from Florida. And I think they form these opinions without having tried any other system.

I didn't say Mexico cave divers were closed minded,but I have seen numerous people who come to Florida with their rig stylized for Mexico,and truly flop in Florida,requiring wholesale changes. Conversely I have been to Mexico with rigs that worked well in Florida,and didn't need any modification to dive Mexico caves. Perhaps it is the student's responsibility to tell the instructor when helping them with buying their rig to identify the environments they will be diving in,and have it able to accommodate both. I am sure it is ideal to have rigs for both envrionments,and if I traveled enough to both I would. If I recall the original poster lived in Michigan,he would struggle significantly if he chose to you a Mexico oriented rig for the caves in Missouri which are closer for him.

---------- Post added November 9th, 2014 at 06:08 AM ----------

I never heard a non cave diver talk so much about cave diving...

Isn't that what they made Holiday Inn Express for???

 

[Patoux01]

Mind if I ask what is so special about those caves in Florida? Honestly, isn't a cave a cave? I mean, water can be cold/warm, there can be current, but why would that even change something to your rig?
I have done neither, but really can't understand what's so special about it.
Same goes for the "cold quarries" that some seem to mention, how would those be different from the ones in Europe or wherever in the world?

It's the diver that does the dive, not the rig...