venting about Mass boating laws...

[Diver Dude]

I'm not afraid of any power boats, you can hear them. It's the sailboats that are scary.
I dive with dive flags all over my boat and one in the water. Last year I surfaced to find myself in the middle of a sailboat race. I scrambled on board but my buddy was still underwater. Got my gear off and grabbed a large 3x4 foot dive flag to hold up. Those people looked at me like I had two heads. There were at least 40 boats in that race. All of them passed me 15 to 40 feet away.
As far as I am concerned a dive flag is just a target for most boaters.
My buddy was under about ten minutes after the last sailboat went over him. He never knew they were there.

 

[rockjock3]

As a scuba diver and a boater in Massachusetts , I'm always VERY careful when operating my boat around divers.

But what does Massachusetts law really have to say on the issue? I checked it closer today and was kind of shocked.

For boaters and divers...

If possible, vessel operators not engaged in the diving operation should stay at least 100 feet from a displayed flag. If not possible, vessel operators must reduce speed to no more than 3 miles per hour.


But if you are a whale you get MUCH more protection from motor boats.

From the Mass Environmental website -
http://www.boat-ed.com/ma/handbook/environ.htm

To protect whales in their habitat, the following operation guidelines are recommended:

Avoid excessive speed or course change within 500 YARDS of whales.
Boat operators are prohibited from approaching within 500 yards of Northern Right whales.
Approach with extreme caution within 100 YARDS of any other species of whales.

So, if you are a whale 100 to 500 YARDS of protection.
If you are a diver...no protection really because the law states that a boat only 'should' stay away and can actually go over you at 3 mph...

Go figure...... :shakehead

Something tells me us divers need a lobby

John C.

Whales don't know that a boat can hurt to run into. It is also for the protection of the boaters. Whales don't know what a boat is and/or how to act around it so neither party gets hurt. They might actually come towards it and endanger themselves or the boat/boaters.

A diver on the other hand knows what a boat is. I diver also takes actions to try and avoid contact with surface obstacles. If I diver is underwater and hears a boat in the area then they should look around and wait before surfacing (obviously air permitting).

Big difference here and easy to see. Whales don't have a clue what you are and if you are any kind of danger. Divers do know what you are and of the dangers.

 

[rockjock3]

I haven't had occasion to use it for this purpose yet, but my digital camera takes long enough video clips to show violations like that, including the boat registration number. I only wonder if I'd send the clip to the USCG, channel 7 news, or offer to sell it to the offending captain. Probably the latter... it would still drive the point home, and if I'm the one who almost got run down, I'd rather the fine go to me.

Great idea. I never even thought of this. Catch them in living color, stop them and explain their infraction (calmly or loudly), then politely ask them how much they are willing to give you for you to delete the images right there rather then email them to the CG. That is definitely one way to help finance my hobby.

Here on Oahu I haven't really seen any problem with that "YET." I have even done some shore diving up current in some fairly popular boat drift dive sites (towing my flat) and when the charter boats came into the area to pick up their drifters they actually stopped outside the area and waited until we had cleared the area to come in and pick up their divers. Thanks out there to Capt. Joe and the Nori Z.

 

[eponym]

Topkayaker.net has summaries of the regs, state-by-state. But they're not actually quotes from the regs, as on another site that slips my mind at the moment. Here in Oregon, the diver-down flag only requires "caution." Here's the reg in full:

250-010-0210 The "Diver's" Flag
(1) A red flag with a white diagonal running from the upper left hand corner to the lower right hand corner (from masthead to lower outside corner) and known as the "Diver Flag" shall, when displayed on the water, indicate the presence of a diver submerged in the immediate area.
(2) Recognition of this flag by regulation will not be construed as conferring any rights or privileges on its users, and its presence in a water area will not be construed in itself as restricting the use of the water area so marked.
(3) Operators of support vessels shall comply with OAR 250-012-0030 as required.
(4) Operators of transiting vessels shall exercise caution commensurate with conditions indicated when in the vicinity of indicated diving operations.

 

[eponym]

As someone who's been involved in whale observation and research from Canada to Mexico, and the Antarctic, I know that the protection offered marine mammals is there to prevent harrassment by tour operators and private boaters. Chasing whales, attempting to get close to them, stresses them and alters their behavior.

Same thing applies, for instance, to the grizzlies in Katmai National Park (Alaska), a wonderfully untouched place. You're required to keep your distance so as to minimize the impact on their lives.

 

[nyprrthd]

The real problem is that any idiot can buy a boat. In most places no classes, no training required (CT and NJ are two minor exceptions). Just pay and drive away. We truly need boaters to be licensed. THAT'S what a lobby should be focused on.

1 knot or 30 knots, doesn't matter. Those giant Cuisinarts on the back will turn you into chum very quickly.

 

[eponym]

The real problem is that any idiot can buy a boat. In most places no classes, no training required (CT and NJ are two minor exceptions). Just pay and drive away. We truly need boaters to be licensed. THAT'S what a lobby should be focused on.

Well said. But note that training requirements are being phased in in many states. There's a state-by-state list on boatsafe.com.

Granted, training requirements alone are not enough. Enforcement and real penalties are the next steps. Whether or not boating mindsets can be changed in the face of advertising hype and movie fantasies is the real question.

Bryan

 

[ScubaBabe22]

Whales are on the endangered list-- humans are not!!!


KIDDING! Sorta

 

[RIOceanographer]

Aside from boaters who don't know the rules of the road, another giant problem is alcohol. DUI laws on the water are so poorly enforced that people don't even try to hide the fact that they are drinking and driving. I have had boat captains drive by and give me a "beer salute" with one hand while holding the steering wheel in the other.

 

[nyprrthd]

Aside from boaters who don't know the rules of the road, another giant problem is alcohol. DUI laws on the water are so poorly enforced that people don't even try to hide the fact that they are drinking and driving. I have had boat captains drive by and give me a "beer salute" with one hand while holding the steering wheel in the other.

On our dock there's a simple rule that most of us follow:

The captain doesn't drink until the dock lines are secure.

I have to be stone sober to watch out for the morons who think that being on the water exempts them from all common sense. Not that common sense is all that common ..............

I agree that laws without enforcement are just a waste of ink. Hand-in-hand with that idea is staffing and equipment (patrol boats). I've complained to local marine patrols about stupid boaters, and they've all told me that they do their best, but can't be everywhere.

Good thing that all divers are brainiacs! eyebrow