Valves up or down? Considerations...

[Schwob]

I had a student take an Advanced Wreck class who had reduced mobility due to a martial arts injury that permanently reduced the range of movement in one shoulder which made reg. isolation/valve drills with standard double tank configuration impossible. He finished up with double 95s inverted, with a cage to protect the manifold when setting tanks down. He used 5ft and 10ft hoses on his regs so he could route the hoses between the wing and the doubles(same side as his body, not open to entrapment) so the hoses "came out" over the shoulder and the regs then appeared and functioned as normal. He was easily able to do his valve drills with the tanks inverted. It is one way to get by. There was no chance of damaging/dislodging his regs when going through a restriction in that configuration

Thanks for posting. Good to know. Appreciate.

 

[Schwob]

Nigel's twinset rig

Thanks for posting!
And
@ Nigel: if you were to read this: Thanks, .... and
1. yes, those pesky alluring rebreathers... Good thing they are so well out of my budget that I won't need to bother considering going there for a while...
2. and I feel I should be a better diver first anyway (although some people I met think I should go for it...) ... - see 1.

 

[Schwob]

Well.... I've been involved in I-don't-know-how-many discussions about this over the years but I can summarize everything I've ever heard about it in a couple of lines.

1) it works
2) there are some complications, some of which deserve careful contemplation, but it works
3) it's taboo, but it works

I once knew a guy who had shoulder injuries related to racing motorcycles who did this. At the time the DIR world war was happening and the reactions he got ranged from

- oh? ok, cool.... whatever... you bloody outcast.
to
- I see risks and complications and blah blah blah blah blah from people who dove mostly behind a keyboard
to
- If you can't reach your valves in the "correct" position then you are not a proper diver (the word used was "stroke") and you should stop diving

Some of that is still present in the diving community and I'm sure you'll see it on this thread too. My conclusion, after 15+ years of he-said-she-said about this on the internet is that if you want to make it work, you can. Full stop.

R..

What to say to that? Oh, I know:
AMEN.

Yeah, I am all about trying to understand and weighing pros and cons for myself. Sure, I can follow a prescribed or agreed on recipe of doing something for a dive to unify things or while still trying to understand, but that doesn't mean I eventually won't make up my own mind. Diving is just great really. For me, part of the fun is also in really figuring things out, which does require to take info which comes in "absolute-, dogma-, religion-" like terms a bit with of a grain of salt and enough healthy skeptisism to at least check up on it... what any reasonable person should do anyway...
In any case, I don't know about "proper" and don't really care to... "Good", "Safe", "Efficient" and even "Fun" are way higher on my list anyway.

 

[Schwob]

I have no issues with them and the CCR guys almost exclusively dive with valves down *exceptions being the GUE guys with their funny manifold, Poseidon recreational version, and I think that's it*. The issue now is finding the cages for the doubles so they will stand up. Personally, I don't believe it's worth the hassle, and if you have mobility issues of just reaching the isolator, then dive independent doubles *I do quite regularly, it makes filling a PITA though I have built a fill whip to fill both of them simultaneously, and it means you have to switch regulators which will irritate DIR divers, but I do that anyway*, or dive sidemount.

Yeah, thanks... when I finally will try it, I will start out with independent doubles anyway (regular and inverted), cause I currently only own two AL80s (yeah, I know, not the greatest, but fits the budget, is the defacto "everywhere rental standard" anyway) and an AL40 slung pony. And I"ll try sidemount too (already slung all I have for a precursory look, not that that means anything).

Much easier to switch around between singles doubles and sidemount "trials" and try stuff w/o the manifold at first... Once I know where I am "happier" I may get more or better equipment for that...

 

[Schwob]

From a UK GUE instructor
Reaching your valves

Twinset Configuration

I thought ....

Yeah, I once thought too. Not worth it, too much trouble, avoid it at all cost now.

Kidding of course.

Appreciate the reply and that article in the link does have a lot of worthwhile pointers in it. I will definitely re-read that once a have a chance to try in water (at the earliest in a month).

 

[Schwob]

Sorry for the thread hijack, but I have an unused OMS bracket for inverted doubles. There are brackets that go around the neck of your tanks and a platform to support the tanks.

$30 plus shipping from Oregon

John, thanks.

@KenGordon and
@ahereng
Thanks for your links as well.

Since the price for John's second hand unit was right I decided to "play with that".

 

[KenGordon]

REMOTE LEAD
Another option. Saves the swapping between regulators of true indie twins but allows for shutting the isolator.

 

[Schwob]

You may want to consider Sidemount, if you have shoulder mobility problems.

Me as well wanted to do back mount inverted doubles, I ended up with Sidemount.

If you look for Akimbo here in SB he have a nice setup picture of what he build for him self

Yeah, I understand. I will just try doubles both ways and SM and find out. There are of course a lot of additional questions I will have a harder time figuring out by myself in the quarry... e.g.: I haven't had a chance yet to see how someone in SM does a fast negative entry from a dinghy in heavy waves... and I like how a completely renoved rig (partially inflated) floats when taken off for getting back in the dinghy. I dont know yet if as a SM diver you then also remove the whole rig. I read about people removing tanks individually... well, if they don't float I don't like that at all. The heavier the sea, the less I like it...
But I got more diving to do before I need to figure that out... And it's to early for me to ask much about SM...

 

[Schwob]

Once you have the stand fitted, there is a lot of weight going on very low (valves, manifold etc etc) so you might have to deal with some trim issues, especially if you are wearing a lot of weight on a belt already.

Nothing that can't be solved, just bears thinking about. Personally, I would go side mount , its changed my life (and my wife's) and I really only dive back mount with my rebreather these days.

There's no scuba police, find what works for you and have at it!

I hear you. Will try it all

 

[Schwob]

Yep!