Using A Long Hose Isn't Just For Tech Divers

[JeffG]

In the situation JonnyThan brought up, he stated that he has run out of gas. So, at this point, proper gas managemnt has gone out the window. My question was, in this situation, how can you be sure your buddy has enough gas to get both of you back to the surface?

OK, so we have thrown out rock bottom...gas management....So in our theoretical dive...the answer is you don't know...but you better hope he does

So based on this theoretical dive...we should all get ponies

 

[jonnythan]

In the situation JonnyThan brought up, he stated that he has run out of gas. So, at this point, proper gas managemnt has gone out the window. My question was, in this situation, how can you be sure your buddy has enough gas to get both of you back to the surface?

It hasn't gone out the window.

Pre-dive, you should have figured out just how much gas you need in your tank to get yourself and your buddy up from the deepest point in the dive. This is called rock bottom.

You turn the dive at some point before you reach this amount of remaining gas.

If my regulator literally blows apart and leaves me isntantaneously with zero remaining gas, I *know* my buddy has enough air in his tank to get us both up. We planned it that way. It requires me to trust my buddy to keep an eye on his gas supply. Of course, if my reg blows apart, even if he's running low, he's going to have some gas on him, so I know I'll get at least a few good breaths.. unlike a pony, where I'm not 100% sure since no one has touched the system since the start of the dive (or earlier).

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I'm not going to give an OOA diver freedom to do anything. I give him my secondary, and I hold onto him throughout the ascent. Period.

And I can respect that decision. But as an instructor my perspective will be different than that of a divemaster.

You are concerned with controlling the situation and making sure this person surfaces safely.

I am too ... but I also want this person to learn something from the experience ... and if this diver is showing a clear head, I'm going to give them as much freedom as possible to deal with the situation.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[limeyx]

I use the 7' hose only in cave or overhead dives, with the secondary on the necklace. In open water OOA practice, I find that I WANT the OOA diver close to me. On my open water rigs the regulators are on 5' hoses, and I consider EACH to be used for air sharing at any given time.

Odd, with the long hose, I just reach out and grab their arm when I want them close to me Seems a bit more sturdy than relying on a hose connected to a reg in their mouth to keep someone close ... better hope they don't ascend a little too far on that short hose and yank it out of their mouth...

I do agree though, the first few times I practiced with long hose were a bit awkward, so I would certainly recommend anyone going to long hose find someone they trust to practice with before diving that way.

 

[BigboyDan]

... unlike a pony, where I'm not 100% sure since no one has touched the system since the start of the dive (or earlier).

Well, test the pony reg throughout the dive and pay attention to its spg.

The pony should never be needed with the proper predive gas planning and the correct use of buddie skills, as you described.

I think of the pony as a last resort option, usually to be used near, or at the surface, waiting for the boat to pick you up.

 

[BigboyDan]

And I can respect that decision. But as an instructor my perspective will be different than that of a divemaster.

You are concerned with controlling the situation and making sure this person surfaces safely.

I am too ... but I also want this person to learn something from the experience ... and if this diver is showing a clear head, I'm going to give them as much freedom as possible to deal with the situation.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

As I said, I agree. You're one of the best, Bob.

 

[matt_unique]

..... unlike a pony, where I'm not 100% sure since no one has touched the system since the start of the dive (or earlier).

Slightly off topic but....

This is not a valid argument for the "disadvantages" of pony bottles. You would not have touched your second primary or octo since the start of the dive either yet you would plan for emergencies as though it would work. Your pony is no less reliable than your octo or second primary.

--Matt

 

[novadiver]

Every one of the worst case senarios in this thread could have been solved with a short hose. If you don't need it , don't bring it and please don't give it to a newbie poser. That's uncool

 

[limeyx]

I'm not taking sides here, just curious...

If you are out of air at depth, how can you be sure that your buddy isn't?

If your bungied backup is 'always on,' and a standard secondary is 'always on,' what's wrong with a pony being 'always on?'

And, again, I'm not taking sides here, just curious...

I think he was saying that he did not know for sure if the pony was on (might have accidentally been turned off somehow or not checked etc.)

Seems to make sense to me to give the OOA diver a known good working reg (your primary) and you go to your backup (which if you put it around your neck has a high chance of working as it hasn't been dragging on the coral for the last 40 mins). If for some reason your backup does not work then you buddy breathe your long hose that you donated.

You can keep the other diver close by grabbing their upper arm but still have slack if surge/current etc. tries to yank you apart.

 

[jonnythan]

Slightly off topic but....

This is not a valid argument for the "disadvantages" of pony bottles. You would not have touched your second primary or octo since the start of the dive either yet you would plan for emergencies as though it would work. Your pony is no less reliable than your octo or second primary.

--Matt

My argument is that the regulator in your buddy's mouth is more trustworthy than the pony bottle. The potential for problems in the pony bottle system over the course of the entire dive is greater than the potential for problems during the .8 seconds while you hand your buddy the regulator in your mouth.