Undercurrent--"Why Divers Die"

[The Kraken]

From Charlie59's post . . . I love statistics !!!

"Going on to say that "45% of dead divers had a body mass index of 30 or above".

That means that 55% of dead divers had a bmi of less than 30, therefore, without other related factors, one could deduce that healthy divers are more prone to diving deaths . . .

Fun with numbers.

Just an idle observation . . .

the K-urtosis

 

[all4scuba05]

So is it more accurate to say that divers with high percentage of body fat have a much higher chance of killing themselves underwater?

 

[Rick Inman]

IOf course obesity will greatly increase someones chance of death...

Actually, everyone has the same chance of death.

100%.

No one understands the challenges added to the out of conditioned diver more than the diver themselves.

I have a buddy that's about 40 pounds overweight who works out at the gym like a race horse four days a week, then eats pizza and donuts and junk food for every meal. He seems to do just fine on the dives, schlepping his doubles around easily while the younger, skinnier folks are huffing and puffing.

And his technique is good in the water.

For me, if get even ten pounds over my best weight, I can feel it.

 

[Fish_Whisperer]

A guy I dive with is obese, by anyone's standards. I hope, someday, to be half the diver that he is. (No pun intended.) He's an awesome diver, and does Public Safety Diving for the county, has been a cave diver, a commercial diver, and teaches and conducts underwater crime scene investigation. The guy just ROCKS...

Kraken, I noticed that same statistic and thought the very same thing! LOL

"There are lies, damn lies, and then there are statistics." -Mark Twain

 

[String]

BMI isnt a great indicator. A lot of professional athletes are "obese" as it takes no account for fat/muscle ratio.

Having said that yes a lot of people too fat to be safe to dive are diving and are dieing.

 

[OHGoDive]

From Charlie59's post . . . I love statistics !!!

"Going on to say that "45% of dead divers had a body mass index of 30 or above".

That means that 55% of dead divers had a bmi of less than 30, therefore, without other related factors, one could deduce that healthy divers are more prone to diving deaths . . .

Fun with numbers.

Just an idle observation . . .

the K-urtosis

Well, except that in the US adult population in general, only around 30% of people have a BMI > 30, so you wouldn't expect them to account for 45% of the deaths. I would suspect that in the world diving population, that percentage is probably quite a bit lower than 30%.

And yes, I know BMI is not accurate for EVERYONE. But, for MANY, it's a pretty good indicator.

Arguing that obesity is not a problem because you know (or are) someone who weighs 400 pounds and is a good diver is like arguing that smoking is healthy because you know someone who smokes and is a good diver. Being overweight and being a good diver aren't mutually exclusive, but being obese is not the same as being healthy.

Seems to me anyway, and I think that is what Undercurrent was trying to say.

 

[The Kraken]

OhGo,

You've validated the point I was making.
No other statistics were given, especially what percentage of the population being studied falls into the >30 BMI range.

Just observing that a statistic, without supporting information, is pretty much useless.

But . . . back to the topic at hand.

I would agree that obesity can increase the possibility of creating a physical factor which can cause a fatal diving incident.

the K

 

[OHGoDive]

OhGo,

You've validated the point I was making.
No other statistics were given, especially what percentage of the population being studied falls into the >30 BMI range.

Just observing that a statistic, without supporting information, is pretty much useless.

But . . . back to the topic at hand.

I would agree that obesity can increase the possibility of creating a physical factor which can cause a fatal diving incident.

the K

I agree that a standalone statistic can be misleading, but even as often as we are bombarded with how fat us Americans are becoming, my initial reaction was that nearly half of all divers couldn't possibly be classified as obese (ok, ok, so as not to offend our bodybuilding divers, as having a BMI > 30)!

 

[MikeFerrara]

Well, except that in the US adult population in general, only around 30% of people have a BMI > 30, so you wouldn't expect them to account for 45% of the deaths.

I don't think that's a statistically valid statement. While you say that only 30% of the US population is over a BMI of 30, only 1% of the population are divers. What is the mean, median and mode BMI of the population of DIVERS? Is it a normal distribution?The nondivers don't go diving.

Also, DAN reports about 100 diving deaths per year. I'm thinking that it's too small of a sample size to say anything about the correlation between BMI and the probability of one being killed while diving so we don't care about those.

And, since, last I heard, the average age of divers was about 37 years old. Divers may indeed be in worse physical condition than the average for the whole population.

Just correlate BMI to diving deaths and show me the results.

And yes, I know BMI is not accurate for EVERYONE. But, for MANY, it's a pretty good indicator.

How many?

Arguing that obesity is not a problem because you know (or are) someone who weighs 400 pounds and is a good diver is like arguing that smoking is healthy because you know someone who smokes and is a good diver. Being overweight and being a good diver aren't mutually exclusive, but being obese is not the same as being healthy.

Seems to me anyway, and I think that is what Undercurrent was trying to say.

Obesity is a health risk. However, an obese person with good dive skills can be at far lower risk while diving than a non-obese person with rotten dive skills. We are all going to die but it's the divers who aren't any good at diving who are more likely to die in the water.

 

[OHGoDive]

Obesity is a health risk. However, an obese person with good dive skills can be at far lower risk while diving than a non-obese person with rotten dive skills. We are all going to die but it's the divers who aren't any good at diving who are more likely to die in the water.

You're right, there is a lot of generalizing in the article. But, I don't think that discounts the point they are trying to make.

If I had to guess, yes, just a guess, I'd say that recreational divers as a whole match the general population as a whole. I might be wrong though, but I'd bet a beer I'm not too far off.

You are generalizing here as well. Far lower risk of what? Death from DCS due to poor skills, or death from a heart attack due to poor health?