Unacknowledged subtext in fill pricing

[KenGordon]

In an area like Seattle, where there are lots of active divers, would it be feasible for a local dive club to evolve into a sort of community-owned, non-profit LDS, with its own compressor purchased from modest annual fees of its members, who in return get heavy discounts on air fills, or unlimited free fiils at higher membership levels, and retain voting rights over the club's policies, including the rules that govern pricing of fills and whatever services the club would want to offer. If there were a critical mass of members, which I imagine is not impossible in an area like Puget Sound, perhaps it could be just enough to rent a small place, buy a compressor, and some tanks to bank air, and hire someone to sit there, maybe even multi-task as a technician to repair equipment. In the era of online shopping, no need for a store with equipment to purchase, and if the LDSs lose money on fills, there should be no hard feelings...

This happens at a number of UK clubs. Often they have a club house, sometimes even a pool. Those by the sea are likely to have storage for their RIB. Some provide trimix as well as air and nitrox, it depends on the diving the enthusiastic members are doing. Typically these are clubs which are part of BSAC rather than "clubs" which are an offshoot of a dive shop.

Maybe the US could do with an association of dive clubs which is about the members rather than a wholly commercial enterprise?

Ken

 

[Brandon]

CF pricing can be its own can of worms - especially if you can't agree on how many CF were filled.

Flat fills also have their own problems -we recently had local shop go to a very high flat fill rate ($30 for double 100s, $15 for a single up to 100CF, $20 for a single up to 130CF). My concern was that it would encourage divers to do exactly what you were saying - breathe their tanks down as low as possible so they felt like they were still receiving a good value. They since changed their tune and are back to selling by volume and increased the price to $.20 a CF.

The hybrid idea is a nice one - I'd love to pay $10 flat rate + some smaller amount per CF. It's not more than an hour of shop monkey time to fill even a set of double 130s off a slow compressor, and much faster if off a cascade. That ensures that the shop is being compensated for their employees taking the time to do proper, rated pressure fills, and that the costs of producing the gas are compensated for as well.

The big objection is probably the same as for CF pricing - it requires people check pressures and do the math to compute volume. It's a lot easier to just connect a whip, spin a few valves and take the $$.

 

[oldschoolto]

It's really easy... Buy a compressor and fill your own tanks.... I just pay my money and go diving... OH... And say thank you for the air fill....

Jim..

 

[Eric Sedletzky]

This happens at a number of UK clubs. Often they have a club house, sometimes even a pool. Those by the sea are likely to have storage for their RIB. Some provide trimix as well as air and nitrox, it depends on the diving the enthusiastic members are doing. Typically these are clubs which are part of BSAC rather than "clubs" which are an offshoot of a dive shop.

Maybe the US could do with an association of dive clubs which is about the members rather than a wholly commercial enterprise?

Ken

If there weren't as many dive shops around as there are we probably would see more of that.
I could also possibly see local fire depts. getting into the air business.
Maybe if a diver was also volunteer or a donor to their fireman's association they could then be eligable to recieve air fills for a price.
It's worth running it by someone.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

As an instructor if I am teaching a class and bringing students to the shop for fills or rental gear and to some training sites my fills are free. Otherwise I get a discount. I'd buy my own compressor but see no need to. In my area there is a shop that caters to independent instructors. There are six of us that contract with him. It's good air, nitrox, or O2. He is working on bringing in a CD to do a full gas blender course for all of us and then is probably going to start offering trimix.

He is also working on getting his cave instructor rating current and since I am now offering more tech classes the need for more than standard recreational gasses is there to justify the added expense. Charging by the cu ft for a regular fill seems to be more trouble than it's worth. Do you charge for the actual fill at the time or what it settles down to if the diver was in a hurry and got a little bit of a hot fill. Unless they are willing to wait overnight and then that means someone has to come in twice to fill and then top off. Should the shop charge extra for that? I agree that a fill on a 30 or 40 should be less than that on a 100 or 120 and usually is. One thing I have found is that some places if they only need to top off a 40 with a 1000 or 1500 psi they just do it and charge nothing. So I will use my transfill whip, since I pay full price if they top off one of my 85's, and bleed them into the smaller bottle. They hook it up, see it only needs a little and just do it gratis.

 

[Imla]

In my area... (Norway... ) usually the shops have a "fill card". My "go to" shop charges around $200 for a years worth of air or banked 32% as you can possibly use.

 

[Hatul]

In my area... (Norway... ) usually the shops have a "fill card". My "go to" shop charges around $200 for a years worth of air or banked 32% as you can possibly use.

I like that idea as an option for the frequent diver as it removes the monetary factor from how much gas you use, encourages diving and probably provides more income on the average for the dive shop.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

In my area... (Norway... ) usually the shops have a "fill card". My "go to" shop charges around $200 for a years worth of air or banked 32% as you can possibly use.

That's a serious bargain. I pay $100 per month for unlimited nitrox fills. Over the course of a year it factors out to between $5 & $6 per fill ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

---------- Post added July 4th, 2014 at 08:02 PM ----------

... for those who haven't seen it, this is the loss that TSandM is mourning ... Scott's garage as it appeared before he closed up Sound Aquatics and moved to California ...

... a whole bunch of really good memories started there ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[Imla]

Yup... Not only a serious bargain, they also fill using a long hose, so I can leave my doubles in the car... Minimal amount of carrying

 

[eelnoraa]

Air? Air is for tires.

Actually, the proper gas for tire is pure nitrigen. It can extend life of tire by up to 40%. Most big tire shop use it today.

All but one shop around me charges recreation nitrox fill by cf of oxygen. It is bamboo reef in Monterey. Air fill is still flat rate. Above mentioned the cost of recreation fill is really the handling of the tank, moving the tank to fill station, hooking up the fill whip, topping off after initial fill, ..... Not the gas itself. I think I am ok with that.