Ultima Dry Glove System question

[Deep South Divers]

Im here from DEEP SOUTH DIVERS YT channel... saw him diving the ultima without seals.. how does he seal the suit side where the rings are mounted? would like to dive a similar setup! Oh and is the system compatible with the showa 282 temres glove?

Best regards and stay healthy,
Simon

Hey Simon!

Great to see you here from our YouTube channel.

Here's the video where I create "sealless" Ultima rings:


To clarify, indeed Zef is right ... The seal is still technically there and needed for the system to seal properly... It's just trimmed all the way back. You'll see what I mean in the video.

I love diving the system "sealless," but it requires a certain amount of faith in your gloves, which people diving latex and butyl rubber gloves do not have. :-D

Personally, I'm diving the very tough (ANSI cut rating 5) SHOWA 3416s at work. They are TOUGH and don't leak, even when I abuse them doing chainsaw cuts and boat bottom cleanings. For sport diving, the SHOWA 720 is a thinner, better, more dexterous and tactile glove with an ANSI cut rating of 2. Both of these gloves are tough enough to trust to do "sealless."

Diving "sealless" is great... I love it, personally... But I get why people feel better about using a seal. It's a judgement call, really.

 

[Deep South Divers]

UPDATE

After another season of diving the Ultima Dryglove Ring System combined with a set of SHOWA 3416s, I've discovered a new modification that I really, really like: Doing away with the cosmetic rings.

My rings take some abuse from working... And every four or five dives I had to replace the cosmetic rings (some have the "Ultima" logo silkscreened on them) because they'd get cut up and would split and basically fall apart. They are, after all, just TPU... Which has virtually no cut resistance.

It just seemed silly to use a material with zero cut resistance to "protect" a glove fabric that had an ANSI cut rating of 5.

...So I ditched them.

They do, however, have some purpose to them... The "lip" on the cosmetic ring tends to help lock the glove in place, so to simulate it, I took a regular black o-ring that Zef had sent me (he'll have the specifics - they're the same black o-rings that are used elsewhere on the Ultimas) and placed them in the groove between the glove and the hard plastic body of the gloveside Ultima ring.

...Now things are locked in place and there's nothing to get cut up except the glove... Which is highly resistant to that kind of damage.

...So yeah - real happy with the setup. Anyone need a bag of cosmetic Ultima rings that I bought as extras? PM me.

 

[Zef]

UPDATE

After another season of diving the Ultima Dryglove Ring System combined with a set of SHOWA 3416s, I've discovered a new modification that I really, really like: Doing away with the cosmetic rings.

My rings take some abuse from working... And every four or five dives I had to replace the cosmetic rings (some have the "Ultima" logo silkscreened on them) because they'd get cut up and would split and basically fall apart. They are, after all, just TPU... Which has virtually no cut resistance.

It just seemed silly to use a material with zero cut resistance to "protect" a glove fabric that had an ANSI cut rating of 5.

...So I ditched them.

They do, however, have some purpose to them... The "lip" on the cosmetic ring tends to help lock the glove in place, so to simulate it, I took a regular black o-ring that Zef had sent me (he'll have the specifics - they're the same black o-rings that are used elsewhere on the Ultimas) and placed them in the groove between the glove and the hard plastic body of the gloveside Ultima ring.

...Now things are locked in place and there's nothing to get cut up except the glove... Which is highly resistant to that kind of damage.

...So yeah - real happy with the setup. Anyone need a bag of cosmetic Ultima rings that I bought as extras? PM me.

All,
The o-rings that Seajay is referring to above are standard size 341 with durometer/shore of 70. I am using these o-rings to mount my gloves (SHOWA 720) to the glove-side rings. I suggested that they could also be used as a backup to help lock the glove in place just like the o-ring-like lip on the cosmetic protective rings.

If one finds their cosmetic rings are trashed, I have had great luck with a couple of wraps of electrical tape around the area where the cosmetic rings cover. This allows for some color and protection...then a 341/70 O-ring can be used to back up the glove retention o-ring (the one folded into the glove and stretched over the glove-ring).

If anyone has any questions don't hesitate to ask here or by direct message.

Cheers,
-Z

 

[MaxBottomtime]

I plan to experiment the next time I have to replace a seal. Rather than buying seals that I am just going to cut anyway, I'm going to try using bike inner tubes instead. If that works, who knows, I may try thread tape.

 

[Zef]

I plan to experiment the next time I have to replace a seal. Rather than buying seals that I am just going to cut anyway, I'm going to try using bike inner tubes instead. If that works, who knows, I may try thread tape.

Because of the order/ timing of responses this comes across a bit dijointed.

For clarity for anyone coming across this thread, what @MaxBottomtime is referring to is that one needs to have wrist seal material between the si-tech ring glued into the sleeve of the drysuit (known as the PU ring), and the cuff-side ring of the ultima DGS in order for water to not leak between the two rings.

He and other folks cut their wrist seals back to the end of the cuff rings, making it a bit quicker/easier to get their hands and arms into and through their suit.

He is suggesting he will try using a section of bicycle inner-tube (most definitely a mountain bike/ballon tire/beach cruiser type tube) mounted on the cuff ring portion that inserts into the PU ring, to test if it will provide an adequate seal.

A pair of silicone wrist seals cost between $30 and $60 depending on source (less expensive end of the price spectrum in the EU than the US). A new bicycle innner tube costs between $2 to $7 and popped one can be had for free from most bike shops if one asks nicely, and one can cut multiple cross sections from one tube.

If this works, it would be a boon to those who dive exusively with drygloves with their wrist seals cut back.

Cheers,
-Z

 

[rob.mwpropane]

I plan to experiment the next time I have to replace a seal. Rather than buying seals that I am just going to cut anyway, I'm going to try using bike inner tubes instead. If that works, who knows, I may try thread tape.

Ordering from Seaskin is the least expensive I've found for seals. You can order 3 and get them shipped for about the price of what one set costs in the states.

If we could use teflon tape, electric tape, bicycle tubes.... that would be awesome.

Edit: when the water gets warmer I can try some teflon tape. We have some thick / wide tape we use at the shop, it's about twice as wide as the normal stuff.

 

[Deep South Divers]

I like being sealless... Donning and doffing is easier and there's no tubes or strings to worry about.

I've holed a glove set up like that before... I bumped my hand against a chainsaw blade (it wasn't running) and put a tiny leak in my SHOWA 3416. It was the very first time (and only time) I'd ever gotten a leak out of those gloves. I was working ten feet underwater, cutting piles, so... I just surfaced and asked for a replacement glove, which I keep in the truck already loaded on rings. I popped the old one off and put the new one on and it was fixed. Later that night I pulled the glove off the gloveside ring and loaded a new one, just to have as a spare.

Inside my glove, my fingertip got a little moist... That was it... And the only way I knew I'd just FUBARed my glove. Had I been diving deeper and needed a deco stop or whatever, I'd have just put a finger over the hole and done what I needed to do to end the dive and get a replacement.

The point is... Diving sealless isn't catastrophic in the case of a leak in a glove like the 720 or 3416. Any hole in the glove becomes a mild annoyance, rather than a full-blown problem like it is in a latex glove that will not only puncture, but will tear wide open once punctured.

My holed and leaky glove leaked less than my wrist seals do with wet gloves. Lord knows I can't get a wrist seal to seal for anything... If I'd had a wrist seal installed, t wouldn't have done much good to keep water out of my suit arm with a holed glove anyway.

Bottom line? Diving sealless with these gloves rocks... Way more than a wrist seal and standard latex or butyl rubber style glove - even when the proverbial stuff hits the fan.

 

[ericfine50]

Anyone mounting the Showa 3416 to a pair of Santi Smart Rings? I am assuming you have to roll the edge over like the 720s

 

[Deep South Divers]

No, but you'd load SHOWA 3416s the same way that you'd load SHOWA 660s.

This seems to be the preferred method:


You'll find 3416's to be softer, easier to load, tougher, warmer, more dexterous, and more tactile (feel through them) than 660s - which are a relatively thick, stiff glove.

The 720s would load the same way - and would be as easy to install as the 3416s. They wouldn't be quite as tough as the 3416s, but they'd be equal to the 660s. They'd be warmer and more dexterous and more tactile than either the 3416 or the 660.

 

[ericfine50]

No, but you'd load SHOWA 3416s the same way that you'd load SHOWA 660s.

This seems to be the preferred method:


You'll find 3416's to be softer, easier to load, tougher, warmer, more dexterous, and more tactile (feel through them) than 660s - which are a relatively thick, stiff glove.

The 720s would load the same way - and would be as easy to install as the 3416s. They wouldn't be quite as tough as the 3416s, but they'd be equal to the 660s. They'd be warmer and more dexterous and more tactile than either the 3416 or the 660.

Thanks for confirming