Training fatality claims Utah woman in Florida

[PatW]

The dive sites at West Palm beach all seem to be at a minimum of 55'. If you are coming from Orlando, West Palm and Jupiter are the closest salt water dive locations. These places allow you to drive, dive and drive back in one day. To get to a place with shallower dive spots, you need to go to Pompano Beach.

I did my first 2 dives at Alexander Springs which has a maximum depth of 28'. I was not able to get down that far because the "deep" spot is about the size of a phone booth and it was already full. I did my other 2 dives at West Palm in 60' of water. It was good visibility and little current. We had a 2 instructors in the water and 2 dive masters for about 6 students.

If the medical people are right and the cause of death was a stroke, I doubt that there was much of anything that could have been done by the people present to alter the outcome. When I read the first account, I thought that the problem sounded like a stroke or heart attack. She was not young which put her potentially at risk. Also she went very quickly from being a diver who seemed perfectly "fine" to being unconscous, unresponsive and apparently not breathing. So the problem did not sound like equipment failure, panic, out of air, nitrogen narcosis, bends etc.

It is very unfortunate. But sometimes these things happen and no one is really "at fault".

 

[c0r3yz]

I did my first 2 dives at Alexander Springs which has a maximum depth of 28'. I was not able to get down that far because the "deep" spot is about the size of a phone booth and it was already full. I did my other 2 dives at West Palm in 60' of water. It was good visibility and little current. We had a 2 instructors in the water and 2 dive masters for about 6 students.

My wife and I did our first two dives a Alexander as well, I got 26' max depth, but that place is always so crowded... Like you said, you can't get to the "deep" spot unless you're there at sun up and before it gets crowded. The remainder of our OW dives were done at Devil's Den. We saw 45' there.

 

[Moonglow]

There are very real risks in taking anyone to sixty feet on a checkout dive, especially in intial open water certification training-- risks that I would never take as an instructor.

 

[Thalassamania]

Our policy is a minimum of 12 supervised dives before going below 30 feet, and then 12 supervised dives between 30 and 60 before making unsupervised dives to that depth. In many programs this also means a free ascent from 60 feet.

 

[nolatom]

My first-ever dive was a resort dive on a boat out of WPB. They were heading for one of the reefs just south of Riviera Beach, but low oil pressure limited boat, and us, to diving the outside of the breakwater in 25 feet. If not for that, my resort dive would've been around 55'. So I think going to 60 off WPB is kind of routine, at least when the water's warm.

I'm with Chuckitall on this. Is there more risk at 3 atm than at 2? Yeah, but there's less risk of an uncontrolled ascent below 30 feet too, esp for a new diver who might not have quick dump button reaction time, or judgement as to when and how much to use it.

In New England? Nuh-uh. But in the WPB drift-dives? Sure.

Condolences to this nice lady and her family, friends, and colleagues. I think the discussion about training depths kind of off-topic where an unfortunate medical event was the reason.

 

[RonFrank]

My first ocean dive was to a whopping 20', and it was a shore dive at LBTS. I had done a bunch of dives in BlueHole to 80' but I liked that my first Ocean dive was shallow. Of course I hit over 100' feet that week on the Grove. But it was one of those perfect dives with fantastic vis and no current. I was also diving with an instructor even if he was diving for pleasure that day. Ahhhh....memories.

 

[daniel1948]

Off the original topic, but seems to have become the new topic:

My PADI Discover Scuba dive, after some skills in shallow water, was to 40 FSW at Long Caye Wall, Glover's Reef, Belize. IIRC, my other 3 OW dives were to the same depth in the same general area. My "confined water" dives were next to the pier in shallow water. My first dive as a certified OW diver was to 60 feet, on Long Caye Wall. I was a bit nervous about the depth, but stayed very close to my buddy, who was a very experienced diver and a DM, though not "the" DM for the dive. The water was warm and clear with an extremely light current.

After that, my instructor offered to take me to 100 feet, which would have been the PADI "deep" dive of the AOW course. I declined. I saw no reason and felt no need, to go that deep.

 

[Ken Kurtis]

Our policy is a minimum of 12 supervised dives before going below 30 feet . . .

Clarify please: Who is "our"?

In many programs this also means a free ascent from 60 feet.

I would question the "many" qualifier. Most likely a "few".

But the other issue this raises is that if you're suggesting you're doing a 60-foot emergency ascent while someone's still in training, you may have agency standard violation issues.

- Ken

 

[Thalassamania]

Clarify please: Who is "our"?

Ken: Scientific Diving Community.

I would question the "many" qualifier. Most likely a "few".

I need to do a survey to find out precisely who is still doing what.

But the other issue this raises is that if you're suggesting you're doing a 60-foot emergency ascent while someone's still in training, you may have agency standard violation issues.

- Ken

Several things here, first the sixty foot free ascent is done prior to Endorsement to sixty feet. At that point the diver has had a minimum of 12 supervised instructional dives to 30 feet as part of entry level training, and 12 more mentored supervised dives between 30 and 60 feet. This is not part of any recreational agency's class, though the safety record of the recreational diving world might be significantly better if it were, so there is no question of standards violations ...

This is a conversation we are carrying on in another thread that branches off from:

I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest that the reason the scientific diving community enjoys the safety record that it does is (aside from good medical screening) because of the time spent working on free ascents and free diving. All of my students can comfortably and confidently hold their breath for 2 minutes (or more) and all have made, on the order of, 50 buoyant free ascents, first free diving and then later on scuba as part of learning, practicing and perfecting the doff and don exercise. If there is no cause for any medical concern and if any problem from equipment or less than careful monitoring of gas supply can be met with a calm and confident, properly executed, free ascent ... would that not go a long way in accounting for the scientific diving community's safety record?

How long is the recreational scuba diving world going to insist on jumping out of an airplane without a reserve chute and blaming the ensuing collision with the ground on running out of air?

your input is always valued.

 

[Garth]

I was diving dry in doubles by my 38th dive... Your telling me I should have had my hand held for the first 24 dives before I went to sixty feet?

That sounds like government progress with all do respect.

I don't see how training plays into this one other than coincidence.