Question Too early to consider tec?

[Wreck(ed)Diver]

Hi guys!

My lofty goal is to get my first tec certification in a year or so. I dive a lot and already have a solid understanding of the math behind my dive computer, GFs, and decompression theory in general. However I only have about 30 dives and AOW/Nitrox L2. In between now and then, I will be taking an AAUS underwater science class, working a research diving job, getting my drysuit cert, TAing a scuba class, and of course more diving.

Now my plan for getting into tec is to get my rescue diver cert, then take a technical foundations class, (maybe sidemount) and then finally take my first XR class.

Am I rushing things too much? I feel comfortable at my level and of course will stop if I noticeably get ahead of myself but I would greatly appreciate advice from more hardcore divers who have already been through this.

Thanks for the advice!!

 

[PfcAJ]

Hi guys!

My lofty goal is to get my first tec certification in a year or so. I dive a lot and already have a solid understanding of the math behind my dive computer, GFs, and decompression theory in general. However I only have about 30 dives and AOW/Nitrox L2. In between now and then, I will be taking an AAUS underwater science class, working a research diving job, getting my drysuit cert, TAing a scuba class, and of course more diving.

Now my plan for getting into tec is to get my rescue diver cert, then take a technical foundations class, (maybe sidemount) and then finally take my first XR class.

Am I rushing things too much? I feel comfortable at my level and of course will stop if I noticeably get ahead of myself but I would greatly appreciate advice from more hardcore divers who have already been through this.

Thanks for the advice!!

Nothing about what dives you want to do, just the certs you want to collect.

Reevaluate why you’re doing what you’re doing.

 

[AJ]

Nothing about what dives you want to do, just the certs you want to collect.

Reevaluate why you’re doing what you’re doing.

Agree. I had a complete mind shift about certification when I started my tech journey. I was very proud of my rec certifications and they are great to have, but they don't mean much when really going into tech. With tech it's not the certification that counts, but mastering the needed skills at a very high level to do the dives you want. Training and certification are just a part of the path to those dives

I have a goal for my tech diving ambitions and my path to that goal is paved with very specific carefull chosen training. Tech training is not a goal in itself but a means to a achieve a (diving) goal.

 

[Lorenzoid]

My lofty goal is to get my first tec certification in a year or so.

While the saying goes, "Begin with the end in mind," that doesn't mean you should set a timeline. First decide what it is you want to see down there and what kind of diving is needed to get you there and back. Then you find a route that should give you the skills to do it. But I don't recommend setting a timeline. Target only the next milestone along the route--maybe that's a course in a progression offered by your training agency of choice, or maybe it's to practice a certain skill or set of skills until you reach some threshold of performance. When you reach that milestone, look to the next one. It doesn't matter that much how long it takes to reach the "end" goal of being able to do that dive that lets you see that thing you wanted to see.

I took the GUE path, and it took me a couple of years of work to reach tech-level Fundies performance. Maybe I'm at the low end of the bell curve, but the point is that I didn't set a goal like "earn a Fundies tech pass within one year." That's too much pressure and takes the fun out of diving.

 

[Germie]

ITT/Fundies, etc are not technical courses. But if you do them too early, you will not be satisfied probably.

Is it too early to think about tec? No. You can think about it. I already did during my open water course, I knew I want to become a technical diver. If you go with 'begin with the end in mind', you can start thinking about tech. This does not mean you start directly now.
But if you have to buy stuff, buy directly the right equipment. I got a lot of wrong advices when I said I want to do tech with less than 8 dives. I was adviced to buy a normal bcd for example. And I had to gain experience. Yes, I agree, but my next question was 'how much experience?' And I did not get an answer on that question, only 'go diving'. I did. I read a lot, I tried to do all kind of dives. I readed standards for courses, etc. And after 10 months I felt ready for tech. And I could sell all my equipment and buy new again.
So for me it took 10 months to start tech after open water, 18 months to finish full cave, 24 months to do my first 100m dive and qualifying dive for full trimix. But to let you know the numbers of dives: 200 after 1 year, 390 was the qualifying dive of full cave, 521 was my first 100m dive.
And people complaigned I went too fast

But back to you. Thinking about tech is not bad. Don't buy the wrong equipment as I did. And go diving, try to find some techdivers as buddy to help you. But also remember there is a chance you quit diving before you got to your goal. I know from a diver who started and said: in 2 years I want to dive to 60m. He bought for his open water his own equipment, twinset, drysuit, etc. A complete techset. But he quitted diving before reaching the 60m and the 2 years. It was not his thing.

Standards state sometimes only 30 dives needed for an advanced nitrox. But I can tell you that for most divers this is too fast. You will do decompression diving and this means you need to have a good bouyancy. I have seen divers doing it between 30 and 50 dives, but in most cases I would not certify the divers then, they most times bought a plastic card.
But I brought 1 diver in a cave with only 50 dives. I met the diver with 25 dives and she said she wanted to become a cave diver. I had an intro to cave course planned and here buddy was 1 of my students. She asked if she also could join. If I said yes, she would buy a drysuit and do the other 25 dives in the 4 weeks that were left before the course started. We did a dive together and of course some basics where not that good, but it was also not bad. A diver with a lot of feeling for diving. It ended with buyin a drysuit the next day and a month later she also came to the caves. I did not pass her. But she was not that bad that it was dangerous. So all was fine from both sides. 6 months later I could pass her. A year later the full cave was done. Now 5 years later the interest in diving moved away like you see quite a lot.

A lot of people only dive 3-5 years, the time a hobby is interesting for them. This is with every hobby. Some divers start technical diving because recreational diving is becoming boring, but then they also quit in a few years. For divecenters not a problem. The money must be earned. This is not different from DIR/GUE, or any other agency.

So my advice to you:
-Don't quit reading about diving and watching videos if you like to do this. It is not necessary, but it won't hurt you.
-Don't buy equipment you cannot reuse when starting technical diving
-Try to find some techbuddies. They don't bite, and in shallows most will dive with you and practise things.
-Talk to an instructor. Better if there is a techinstructor that has a group of buddies/friends for fundives. Then maybe you already get some extra tips and tricks for later and you know when you are ready.
-Go diving in all kind of different waters/places.
-There is a chance your interest in diving is gone before you became a techdiver. This can happen to everybody. It is not your fault, it is just being human.
-Don't forget to have fun when doing the recreational dives. Even if you have a technical cert, most dives will still be in the recreational depths and open water for most technical divers.

 

[Wreck(ed)Diver]

In my opinion, I think that going for technical class early is good or bad depends on the quality of instructor teaching you. I think you should find a good technical instructor and trained with him/her as soon as possible before bad practice becomes bad habit. Practice makes permanent not perfect.

For me, I did GUE fundamental class when I had 75 dives. I tried to go for tech pass, but no one have ever taught me how to do a properly frog kick (I thought "This is probably right" and stick with it), so it became problem when my instructor tried to correct me (bad muscle memory). Obviously, I did not pass but I did learn lots of stuffs that I wish someone taught me when I trained for open water certification (ex. forward/backward frog kick etc.)

However, if you think you're able to evaluate and practice your diving skill every time you dive. There is no need to take technical class early. I talk about this because of my friend who took GUE fundamental that the same time as me. He usually practiced and perfected propulsion techniques whenever he dives. When we took the class, he needs little adjustment to perfect the technique.

This makes sense. I have a lot of reasons for wanting to tec dive (my bucket list of shipwrecks, being able to spend longer in my favorite recreational dive sites, and to expand my knowledge of the more complex points in diving) though really the main thing right now is I want to be as good in the water and have the best understanding I can.

I do currently talk a lot with the tec divers and tec instructors at my local dive shop and they are definitely people I would want to keep training under.

I definitely don’t want to build bad habits and I’m worried I will since most of the dives I do are to practice my skills but I don’t have anyone who can really give me guidance on what to improve or what I do wrong.

I definitely think I’ll take the tec foundations class and then from there, re-evaluate my skill level and what to do next.

 

[Wreck(ed)Diver]

I think that a nice benchmark is being comfortable at the "going diving" thing. Suppose that a diver who just finished their open water asked you to go diving in your local quarry or for a shore dive to practice some skills as a buddy pair.

Would you know where to go, where to get gear and would you be comfortable being underwater with someone very inexperienced? Or would you be scared because you only dived abroad during a class or with a divemaster on guided dives?

I wouldn't bother with tech classes until you are comfortable doing unguided dives to 30 meters, with people who are less experienced than you are. Usually a rescue class + having about 100 dives works well.

And for the record: Fundies or Intro to tech is not a tech class, it's just remedial recreational training

What worries me is that I do feel comfortable with that already and I can’t tell if it’s a false sense of security or because I focus so much on practicing my skills.

I have had to rescue a friend at 85ft and experienced a burst tank o-ring on the same dive so I do know that I can at least keep my head. I am just having trouble knowing where my confidence stands in the scale of “overconfident moron” to “actually comfortable”

 

[Wreck(ed)Diver]

I think it depends on how much open water diving you're planning on doing this year. 20-30 dives? Probably too soon, especially if you first need to get a drysuit, plus some doubles/sidemount experience. I went for an ITT class a few years ago at around 50-60 dives and my inexperience really showed. I was told to practice more, especially trim and buoyancy. 150 dives later I'm much better now but would like another 30-50 dives in a drysuit and doubles before going for AN/DP.

If you're planning on getting in 100-200 dives this year then I don't think next year is too soon.

Either way I don't think it's ever a bad idea to engage a competent instructor to go through the basics of trim, buoyancy, propulsion and some task loading (shooting smb, valve drills). I had a great time during my ITT and my instructor corrected some bad habits and it has definitely made me a more competent diver.

Through work I’ll probably get somewhere in the range of 30 more dives and if I dive the same frequency that I do now, that would be another 40-50 dives. So probably an extra 70-100 dives, depending. I think you are right and I should take the tec foundations class with the tec instructors so they can judge where I stand.

 

[Wreck(ed)Diver]

where in Mass are you? I highly recommend getting plugged in with @macado when he's back from MX.

Also, no offense, but the vast majority of AAUS classes are a joke unless you have a DSO that comes from a technical diving background. Better than 95% of AAUS divers you would never recognize as being an AAUS diver in the wild, they look exactly like any other recreational diver, which is to say, not that great.... Not their fault, AAUS is more like a loose governing body and the training is left up to the DSO's who are almost always recreational instructors who got a job at a university many of whom have no technical training at all.

ASAP, I would recommend trying to take that technical fundamentals class, the sooner you take it, the less bad habits the instructor is going to have to break. Reach out to Heather Knowles and/or David Caldwell who are in the north shore and can help you more directly.

Training – Northern Atlantic Dive Expeditions – Wreck Diving, Exploration, Training

northernatlanticdive.com

My local dive shop is East Coast Divers. I’ll definitely take the tech fundamentals class then! Seems like the best option at the moment.

 

[Wreck(ed)Diver]

While the saying goes, "Begin with the end in mind," that doesn't mean you should set a timeline. First decide what it is you want to see down there and what kind of diving is needed to get you there and back. Then you find a route that should give you the skills to do it. But I don't recommend setting a timeline. Target only the next milestone along the route--maybe that's a course in a progression offered by your training agency of choice, or maybe it's to practice a certain skill or set of skills until you reach some threshold of performance. When you reach that milestone, look to the next one. It doesn't matter that much how long it takes to reach the "end" goal of being able to do that dive that lets you see that thing you wanted to see.

I took the GUE path, and it took me a couple of years of work to reach tech-level Fundies performance. Maybe I'm at the low end of the bell curve, but the point is that I didn't set a goal like "earn a Fundies tech pass within one year." That's too much pressure and takes the fun out of diving.

That definitely makes sense. I’ll worry about taking my first XR class after I do my tec fundamentals class.

 

[Wreck(ed)Diver]

ITT/Fundies, etc are not technical courses. But if you do them too early, you will not be satisfied probably.

Is it too early to think about tec? No. You can think about it. I already did during my open water course, I knew I want to become a technical diver. If you go with 'begin with the end in mind', you can start thinking about tech. This does not mean you start directly now.
But if you have to buy stuff, buy directly the right equipment. I got a lot of wrong advices when I said I want to do tech with less than 8 dives. I was adviced to buy a normal bcd for example. And I had to gain experience. Yes, I agree, but my next question was 'how much experience?' And I did not get an answer on that question, only 'go diving'. I did. I read a lot, I tried to do all kind of dives. I readed standards for courses, etc. And after 10 months I felt ready for tech. And I could sell all my equipment and buy new again.
So for me it took 10 months to start tech after open water, 18 months to finish full cave, 24 months to do my first 100m dive and qualifying dive for full trimix. But to let you know the numbers of dives: 200 after 1 year, 390 was the qualifying dive of full cave, 521 was my first 100m dive.
And people complaigned I went too fast

But back to you. Thinking about tech is not bad. Don't buy the wrong equipment as I did. And go diving, try to find some techdivers as buddy to help you. But also remember there is a chance you quit diving before you got to your goal. I know from a diver who started and said: in 2 years I want to dive to 60m. He bought for his open water his own equipment, twinset, drysuit, etc. A complete techset. But he quitted diving before reaching the 60m and the 2 years. It was not his thing.

Standards state sometimes only 30 dives needed for an advanced nitrox. But I can tell you that for most divers this is too fast. You will do decompression diving and this means you need to have a good bouyancy. I have seen divers doing it between 30 and 50 dives, but in most cases I would not certify the divers then, they most times bought a plastic card.
But I brought 1 diver in a cave with only 50 dives. I met the diver with 25 dives and she said she wanted to become a cave diver. I had an intro to cave course planned and here buddy was 1 of my students. She asked if she also could join. If I said yes, she would buy a drysuit and do the other 25 dives in the 4 weeks that were left before the course started. We did a dive together and of course some basics where not that good, but it was also not bad. A diver with a lot of feeling for diving. It ended with buyin a drysuit the next day and a month later she also came to the caves. I did not pass her. But she was not that bad that it was dangerous. So all was fine from both sides. 6 months later I could pass her. A year later the full cave was done. Now 5 years later the interest in diving moved away like you see quite a lot.

A lot of people only dive 3-5 years, the time a hobby is interesting for them. This is with every hobby. Some divers start technical diving because recreational diving is becoming boring, but then they also quit in a few years. For divecenters not a problem. The money must be earned. This is not different from DIR/GUE, or any other agency.

So my advice to you:
-Don't quit reading about diving and watching videos if you like to do this. It is not necessary, but it won't hurt you.
-Don't buy equipment you cannot reuse when starting technical diving
-Try to find some techbuddies. They don't bite, and in shallows most will dive with you and practise things.
-Talk to an instructor. Better if there is a techinstructor that has a group of buddies/friends for fundives. Then maybe you already get some extra tips and tricks for later and you know when you are ready.
-Go diving in all kind of different waters/places.
-There is a chance your interest in diving is gone before you became a techdiver. This can happen to everybody. It is not your fault, it is just being human.
-Don't forget to have fun when doing the recreational dives. Even if you have a technical cert, most dives will still be in the recreational depths and open water for most technical divers.

Great advice! Thank you! I do talk with a lot of tec divers but I haven’t gone diving with any yet. I definitely should!