Tips on tips

[cappyjon431]

Dennis, most do it because they see it as a steppingstone to get into the dive industry. U.S. crews gain sea so they can get their USCG captains licenses. Many of our crew have gotten their ABs, licenses, etc. and gone on to run crew boats in the gulf where the money is excellent.

Foreign crews do it because compared to many jobs on land (if they can get them), the pay and tips are relatively decent.

I swore I was only going to work on a liveaboard for two years, get some experience teaching classes, earn my captains ticket, and get a land based job. Because of all the wonderful guests I met (and because they tipped fairly so I could make a decent income) I ended up staying for eight years. I do not regret it for one second, and the customer service skills I learned alllow me to run a very successful business.

 

[reubencahn]

As an informational point, tips of 10 to 15% are not standard across all liveaboards. On each of the liveaboards I've been on, at the end of the trip, I've asked the captain or trip director about standard tips. The answers I've received (which are generally given in dollar amounts, not percentages) have suggested amounts of 5% or less. The only exception to this was the trip I just finished on a Peter Hughes boat. There, written materials provided in advance suggested a tip of 10%. All of these liveaboards were foreign. I've never been on a liveaboard in the U.S. or even in the Carribean.

The argument being made here in favor of large tips (and I consider tips of 10 to 20% large) are all applicable to any service job paying a low wage. The employee works hard for long hours and low wages. Therefore, the person receiving service should tip to compensate the employee. Apply it to any other service job and one can see it's not really much of an argument.

Tipping culture is really a matter of expectations. Charter operators expect guests to tip, so they pay poorer wages. Employees expect guests to tip and so accept poorer wages. Guests expect to tip and so do not balk at this arrangement. This only works where everyone has the same set of expectations.

Europeans, Asians and Australians do not have the same expectations as Americans. They don't expect to tip as much as we do. I would guess that on boats with a primarily American customer base, the expected tip is higher than on other boats. For that reason, I'd guess that tips on boats in the Carribean are higher than those in the Pacific and Indian Oceans.

 

[cappyjon431]

As an informational point, tips of 10 to 15% are not standard across all liveaboards. On each of the liveaboards I've been on, at the end of the trip, I've asked the captain or trip director about standard tips. The answers I've received (which are generally given in dollar amounts, not percentages) have suggested amounts of 5% or less. The only exception to this was the trip I just finished on a Peter Hughes boat. There, written materials provided in advance suggested a tip of 10%. All of these liveaboards were foreign. I've never been on a liveaboard in the U.S. or even in the Carribean.

The argument being made here in favor of large tips (and I consider tips of 10 to 20% large) are all applicable to any service job paying a low wage. The employee works hard for long hours and low wages. Therefore, the person receiving service should tip to compensate the employee. Apply it to any other service job and one can see it's not really much of an argument.

Tipping culture is really a matter of expectations. Charter operators expect guests to tip, so they pay poorer wages. Employees expect guests to tip and so accept poorer wages. Guests expect to tip and so do not balk at this arrangement. This only works where everyone has the same set of expectations.

Europeans, Asians and Australians do not have the same expectations as Americans. They don't expect to tip as much as we do. I would guess that on boats with a primarily American customer base, the expected tip is higher than on other boats. For that reason, I'd guess that tips on boats in the Carribean are higher than those in the Pacific and Indian Oceans.

Very good points. I was only writing from my own perspective, which was from someone working on a liveaboard doing both the Caribbean and the Bahamas. While the majority of our guests were Americans, we still did get many from Asia and Europe (very few from Australia) who usually tipped between 10%-15%.

As for tipping on liveaboards in other areas of the world, I would defer to your experience since I have not had the opportunity to work/dive from other liveaboards. When I say 10%-15% is standard, I was speaking only from my personal experiences, and then only if the level of service is deserving of such a tip.

 

[H2O Gal]

The Nekton trip I'm going on suggests a tip of $35 a day. But here's where it's a bit confusing...it's theoretically a seven day cruise, but it leaves late on the departure day and gets in early on the arrival day, so should those two days be counted? I think I like the idea of tipping a percentage of the cost of the cruise--easier to calculate!

 

[RJP]

The Nekton trip I'm going on suggests a tip of $35 a day. But here's where it's a bit confusing...it's theoretically a seven day cruise, but it leaves late on the departure day and gets in early on the arrival day, so should those two days be counted? I think I like the idea of tipping a percentage of the cost of the cruise--easier to calculate!

Don't worry - they're telling you $35 a day because it sounds cheaper than rolling it up for 7 days, which is $245 which is 15% of a charter costing $1600.

So feel free to tip $35 a day or 15%...



PS - Doesn't $35/day in tips sound pretty reasonable if you consider how much you would you spend in tips a day if you did 4-5 boat dives and ate three meals out at a restaurant?

 

[cappyjon431]

The Nekton trip I'm going on suggests a tip of $35 a day. But here's where it's a bit confusing...it's theoretically a seven day cruise, but it leaves late on the departure day and gets in early on the arrival day, so should those two days be counted? I think I like the idea of tipping a percentage of the cost of the cruise--easier to calculate!

15% of the cost of the cruise would be very generous, and while I have been very vocal about the need to tip, remember 15% should be given IF the service has been outstanding.

The $35/day thing is a new suggestion, and might have been implemented because Nekton will be implementing 4 and 6 day cruises later in the year, although this is only my guess. $35 a day is fair (remember, that comes out to less than $3/day per crewmember for a normal crew of 12). The Saturdays that are only partial cruise days are by far the worst day of the week for the crew. Essentially they must turn around the entire boat in about 8 hours. They must clean it top to bottom, empty tons of trash, carry all of the guests luggage (dive bags/suitcases are heavy!) provision, fuel, prepare and serve a snack on arrival and continental breakfast on departure, go through customs with you when you disembark, etc. Most of them will get less than 2 hours of free time to get to an internet cafe, call loved ones, run errands, etc.--it is their only time off the boat all week.

 

[PvtStash]

but nobody's tippin' me... (or the other 99% of the working world)

but nobody's holdin' a gun to my head to stay there either... jus' as I suppose no one's forcin' these poor underpaid wretches to work these boats.

At the moment the work exceeds the benefit of staying (whether that be a factor of money, experience/continueing education) you choose another path... just like everyone else...

the renumeration from workin' a diveboat is no great mystery... the people that do it, do it for their own, various reasons and tho' some might think it "fair" I think its crazy to expect me to pay $3/day x12 people for 7 days for doing the things that are involved with providing the trip thats already been paid for.

 

[cappyjon431]

but nobody's tippin' me... (or the other 99% of the working world)

but nobody's holdin' a gun to my head to stay there either... jus' as I suppose no one's forcin' these poor underpaid wretches to work these boats.

At the moment the work exceeds the benefit of staying (whether that be a factor of money, experience/continueing education) you choose another path... just like everyone else...

the renumeration from workin' a diveboat is no great mystery... the people that do it, do it for their own, various reasons and tho' some might think it "fair" I think its crazy to expect me to pay $3/day x12 people for 7 days for doing the things that are involved with providing the trip thats already been paid for.

Do you tip your waitresses at restaurants, or do you stiff them because if they wanted to, they could always get other jobs? Have you ever even been on a liveaboard?

 

[BTravlin]

*gulp*


damn... I'm really happy there's people out there with the means for such largesse (over-tipping, whathaveyou)... but I'm a bluecollar guy... I make about 25k/yr... $200 is significant for me... an now I'm hearin' that I'm gonna be expected to cough up another $200 for a liveaboard trip? I don' suppose my Fee entitles me to any service? I don' any hand-holding, low-maintainence guest... Thats! what we need! some kinda survey/questionaire I can fill out ahead of time for them letting them know to not shower any extraordinate attention on me cus' I don' need it and cant afford to Pay for it.

I'll save an extra $100 but not $200...

If you work hard and save enough money to go on a nice liveaboard trip then feel free to tip what you can afford and what you think is fair.

I've been on three liveaboards now and all three had great crews that worked really hard. Their effort and attitude do go along way towards determining whether a trip is just okay or great.

If you go on a trip with a good crew you will see for yourself some of what that involves but keep in mind that much of their work goes on behind the scenes. You can then determine the right combination between what you can afford and what they deserve.

 

[BTravlin]

PS - Doesn't $35/day in tips sound pretty reasonable if you consider how much you would you spend in tips a day if you did 4-5 boat dives and ate three meals out at a restaurant?

Excellent way to look at it.