Thoughts on the "new" razor 2

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Karl, glad you posted this. In looking at it 'on paper' or 'on screen', the weighting system looks cool. You are right, it appears one could be made from some spare parts, particularly webbing and velcro. But, for the price ($99 USD) it might be worth a flutter. How is the central weight pocket attached to the harness? It looks like there are grommets, top and bottom, so I assume SS 'sex bolts'. Is that correct? And, if so, what is the length between the grommet holes? I am wondring if I can use the central pocket with a Transpac (Nomad).

The top of the pocket mounts to the top plate with screw and nut and the center strap goes though the several loops that runs the most of the length of the pocket. There is an additional piece that comes with the stealth that attaches to the center strap and you attach the pocket with screw and bolt and can adjusted the pocket up and down the center back strap.

I really like all the options http://www.xdeep.eu/stealth-sidemount-weight-system-smc.html of where the weight can go.
 
Looking for something with a little bit more lift capacity but as streamlined as my SMS50. The two harnesses I was considering were the razor 2 and the xdeep stealth, both look like they have had a lot of time put into them for the environment they were designed for. What do y'all think?

I see you are in GA. Are you cave diving in FL? Steel tanks?
 
I see you are in GA. Are you cave diving in FL? Steel tanks?
Cavern in fl. I'm diving faber 85s but they scare me with a cave fill in my SMS50
 
Of course it's a selection between quickly adjustable multi part harness vs single part harness which needs much more time to adjust. Everyone should decide what he preffer. But have you heard if any of STEALTH 2.0 had a failure?

Hi Piotr,

I should emphasise I don’t know of any failures on the Stealth Harness, the quick adjustment is ideal for rental or student harnesses but less important if it’s your own personal harness. I now use the Stealth harness exclusively when diving sidemount in a dry suit as it’s easier to adjust and the weight system is fantastic. I’d also credit XDeep for actually trying to develop something different than just ripping off a Razor harness like most other manufacturers have.

May be you should check out the Diamond? This is what a distinguished sidemount instructor from UK said:

"I have used both rigs so far [Stealth and Razor] and others that people ask me to promote. The Diamond wins every time, not just for its CE rating but also on price, usablity, functionality, and purpose.

X Deep ... has the weight system is in the wrong place! Too much weigh along your spine causes backache and poor profile positioning, the bladder is like a horizontal buoy on your back when inflated. But its cheaper and people like that.

Razor 2 is very good but very expensive, too hard webbing cutting through suits at the groin, Batwing is like a baloon on your back when inflated, seperate D rings involve over conscious though of trim of cylinders and can look very daft when one forgets to reposition them."


Hollis SMS50 is a very nice piece of kit, but too small for 70% of divers to hold bouyancy for their cylinders, over engineered with little foresight in where to put weights, so people add trim pockets and put them in the wrong place.

Diamond is perfect !! no need for the weight harness accessory, as the block weights fit perfectly on the harness and in the right place! Perfect sizing of wings for different sized divers and streamlined wing of course. It also has a sliding D ring taking care of out of trim cylinders. Absolutely, the Diamond is the rig to have, it's ingenious!. The pictures advertised only show the manufactures setup. I address this by configuring the whole rig to suit each individual diver which includes repositioning the inflator hose from the top to the side flange, then the blank is repositioned to the top.

Personally I’d say the weight system on the spine is exactly where it should be, right in the centre of balance, the XDeep weight pockets can also be added to the waist belt to help with trim if required. I dive the Stealth with 20lbs when dry and couldn’t ask for a better weighting system to be honest. Moving the weights to the tanks is really not a good idea (as the tanks do move), nor is mounting the weights inside/on the wing as some harnesses are intended for.

The Diamond just looks like another Razor rip-off (it’s more like a Razor than a Z-Trim? The Z-trim is firmly attached to the harness without bungees) with a few unnecessary bit of clutter (aka features). It’s ironic the weighting system looks identical in principle to the Stealth but a much lower grade version so I’m not sure how the weighting system is in the wrong place on the Stealth but yet in the right place on the Diamond. If that’s a genuine argument put forward, along with the comment the SMS50 is nicer than the Razor or Stealth , I'd seriously consider the person behind the quotation really doesn't know what they are talking about, known name or not. It could easily be they were misquoted or even that the free diamond harness(es) and sales commision may have clouded their judgement?!

I still like the UTD Z-trim BC also, although I’m not a fan of the Z-plus or Alpha-Delta wings as the lift is in the wrong place – The UTD harness itself is another blatant copy of the Razor. Basically I think UTD got the design concept spot on for a low lift and streamlined BC, sadly they still persisted with the mistake that is the Z-manifold on the thing, otherwise it’s a nice option and luckily is still available without the manifold.
 
Cavern in fl. I'm diving faber 85s but they scare me with a cave fill in my SMS50
What does your instructor dive? I am not that worldly but haven't seen many Razor's in FL. I'd say they are a poor choice with steel tanks honestly. Someday you might want something larger than lp85s or you'll have Worthington's. On anything without a butt plate they will hang down like boat anchors. (I have a Razor, tried it with Worthington 100s and 85s and gave up and bought a different SM rig altogether).
 
What does your instructor dive? I am not that worldly but haven't seen many Razor's in FL. I'd say they are a poor choice with steel tanks honestly. Someday you might want something larger than lp85s or you'll have Worthington's. On anything without a butt plate they will hang down like boat anchors. (I have a Razor, tried it with Worthington 100s and 85s and gave up and bought a different SM rig altogether).
He dives a nomad. I think I've seen two razors in Florida, and I was going to get the buttplate.
 
He dives a nomad. I think I've seen two razors in Florida, and I was going to get the buttplate.

There's no buttplate for the Razor. I have seen one adapted to a Razor but the lower wing attachments are a significant conflict.

What don't you like about the Nomad? It seems to work in FL with steel tanks where you're getting your training, finding like minded buddies etc.
 
Has you considered the Manta Wing? It is what I use with steel tanks for Fl caves. Easily holds PST 95's and stages. Plus it is a streamlined wing. Some slight mods need to be made IMO to keep it closer to the body though. I really really like it. I have the UTD Z wing as well, and while very streamlined it is really an AL setup only. I am considering trying it Friday with Faber 85's and a drysuit. Not sure yet. My next setup will without a doubt be the stealth.
 
There's no buttplate for the Razor. I have seen one adapted to a Razor but the lower wing attachments are a significant conflict.

What don't you like about the Nomad? It seems to work in FL with steel tanks where you're getting your training, finding like minded buddies etc.
I meant stealth but oh well. I do like the nomad but I also like my rig to streamlined

---------- Post added March 27th, 2013 at 01:00 PM ----------

Has you considered the Manta Wing? It is what I use with steel tanks for Fl caves. Easily holds PST 95's and stages. Plus it is a streamlined wing. Some slight mods need to be made IMO to keep it closer to the body though. I really really like it. I have the UTD Z wing as well, and while very streamlined it is really an AL setup only. I am considering trying it Friday with Faber 85's and a drysuit. Not sure yet. My next setup will without a doubt be the stealth.
I have seen it but have not really considered it. What is the pricetag?
 
I do like the nomad but I also like my rig to streamlined

The Razor seems fine with AL80s and a wetsuit. Actually most of minimalist rigs seem to work fine with AL80s. I don't know about the others, but for drysuit diving with steel tanks the Razor starts to fall well short. Tanks hanging way too low (front mounting) and the wing balloning up too high are significant issues.

Are you diving wet or dry? Who's you instructor? Is he (she?) involved with your decision process? Some instructors love or hate certain rigs for various reasons. Some also work better or worse with some body shpaes/sizes, a local instructor can probably do a much better job weeding trhough the choices compared to the internet.
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/peregrine/

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