The solo diving mentality with a buddy diver

[danvolker]

I think my comments are not for you unless only to agree.

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[DevonDiver]

Personally, I think that all divers should have the capacity to self-rescue and safely plan and complete a dive without reliance on a buddy. This is nothing more than safe diving practices.

I think some confusion arises because a considerable percentage of divers do not have a sufficiently high standard of core individual skills. The buddy system or, more often, the leadership and supervision of a dive guide/master, becomes a notional substitute for those individual skills. I say notional because divers without those individual skills also rarely display good buddy/team skills.

Any diver should have sound individual diving skills. Those skills form the basis of safety, regardless of whether the diver adopts a buddy, team or solo approach to diving.

 

[Garth]

Dan: Okay. Let me rephrase. I agree with your posts about team diving. But this thread was intended for people who dive with random people as a buddy system and do not feel they need to learn the skills needed for solo diving because they dive with a buddy. Your training if you are GUE like you say you are would have covered most of the issues in detail enough that you would be sufficient alone but would still benefits from a team. I get that. Now how would we convince people to obtain those skills when their crutch is the thought of having a buddy.
This doesn't apply to all people so there is no reason to get upset about this. Being self sufficient in the water is not highly stressed in training with some agencies, I'm just suggesting that it be covered in the event that you are either without a buddy or the buddy is unable to help.

 

[Garth]

Self rescue is maybe a better way to say what I intended this thread to be about. IMO is solo mentality to buddy diving. When able to help buddy do so. When in danger yourself, accept help but be competent to self rescue.

 

[Bob DBF]

A disciplined, trained buddy team can out-perform and out-survive a similarly skilled solo diver.

Two to one thats no fair, it's even worse odds with a team diving outfit.

Diving with an insta-buddy can be the same as diving solo, especially in open-water dives where being "near your buddy" means being in the same ocean.

Nothing is the same as solo, thats why I enjoy it.

It may be because I normally only buddy with the same few individuals, when I buddy with someone new (or insta-buddy) I have a nice chat about the dive plan and how I envision it unfolding. Other than having to deal with someone with poor skills, which I figured out going in, I really haven't had a bad time.

When that "near your buddy means being in the same ocean" starts taking off just grab an ankle and make believe you are a great white, and after he calms down, point to the spot you want him to stay and I'll bet he stays in formation. Worked for me.


Bob
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I may be old, but I’m not dead yet.

 

[DevonDiver]

Self rescue is maybe a better way to say what I intended this thread to be about. IMO is solo mentality to buddy diving. When able to help buddy do so. When in danger yourself, accept help but be competent to self rescue.

Then what we are talking about is 'rescue diver' mentality, rather than solo diver mentality?

The PADI rescue diver course focuses well on self-rescue techniques. However, many instructors do not emphasis that aspect of the course sufficiently IMHO.

 

[Dracunos]

It never ceases to amaze me how much people on scubaboard can completely 100% (okay, let's say 98.5%) agree with each other and yet continue to argue over semantics and wordplay.

Some of these terms you guys are arguing don't even have an real meaning! Honestly, who the hell cares what one guy considers a 'solo mentality' and another considers some other kind of mentality, etc etc. You should be able to take care of yourself AND be a good buddy. I think it's pretty obvious we all agree. Every post seems to stink of this type of arguing. If the semantics are all that damn important to you guys why don't you define your personal meanings of the terms you are using in your posts.

 

[DevonDiver]

It never ceases to amaze me how much people on scubaboard can completely 100% (okay, let's say 98.5%) agree with each other and yet continue to argue over semantics and wordplay....

...If the semantics are all that damn important to you guys why don't you define your personal meanings of the terms you are using in your posts.

I don't think we argue about semantics, or the meaning of words. There is just debate because we have different concepts about the same things, based on the terms used to describe them.

Also...98.5% is ludicrous. Far more like 38.6%, accounting for double-posts, moderator actions and spams. It all depends on what people mean by agreement. What if posters agree to disgree? Is that counted in the statistics? What if they disagree about agreeing? Or do we only count the times when people agree to agree, or disagree to disagree? What if posters disagree about agreeing to agree?

 

[danvolker]

Dan: Okay. Let me rephrase. I agree with your posts about team diving. But this thread was intended for people who dive with random people as a buddy system and do not feel they need to learn the skills needed for solo diving because they dive with a buddy. Your training if you are GUE like you say you are would have covered most of the issues in detail enough that you would be sufficient alone but would still benefits from a team. I get that. Now how would we convince people to obtain those skills when their crutch is the thought of having a buddy.
This doesn't apply to all people so there is no reason to get upset about this. Being self sufficient in the water is not highly stressed in training with some agencies, I'm just suggesting that it be covered in the event that you are either without a buddy or the buddy is unable to help.

OK Garth, I would be inclined to agree with you on this....When I see a bunch of new Basic Open Water divers, I absolutely do not feel that buddying is going to make them safe divers....mostly because they are not safe divers, period. The only way for any of them to ever be an "effective" part of a buddy team, is far more training AND skills than they have "typically" after BOW and AOW ( which still leaves a diver with less training than they should have to be out on their own on a reef)... At this point, most need mentoring, or good DM's from the charter boat, or at minimum to dependant buddy up to two good divers. I think if this was a new direction pushed along with the modular approach to training now used, it could help alot.

Regards,
DanV

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Getting back to the subject ... I think there's distinction to be made between solo and self-sufficient. When choosing to dive with a buddy, self-sufficiency is desirable ... but a solo mentality can get you in trouble. Some comparisons ...

Air management
Solo - I have to reserve enough to get myself to the surface
Self-sufficient - I have to reserve enough to get me and my buddy to the surface

Awareness
Solo - I have to maintain an awareness of my surroundings, my gas supply, my NDL and my mental and physical condition
Self-sufficient - I have to maintain an awareness of my surroundings, my gas supply, my NDL, my mental and my physical condition ... and my buddy

Communication
Solo - I make my own decisions, and conduct the dive as I please
Self-sufficient - I have to communicate my decisions to a dive buddy and conduct my dive as we agree to

You see, solo is more than just kitting yourself up to be self-sufficient ... and self-sufficient buddy diving is more than just preparing to take care of yourself and jumping in the water with someone else. It's like speaking two separate languages ... where there are words and concepts that are not common to both languages.

It's entirely possible for someone to be good at both ... but it's difficult sometimes to make the mental transition from solo diver to buddy diver, and vice-versa. Diving is, by its nature, a routine-oriented activity ... we develop habits over time and we rely on those habits to maintain a comfort zone. Buddy diving has a particular set of habits ... solo diving has a particular set of habits ... and the two only partially overlap. For someone who falls into a solo mentality while buddy diving, it's very easy to find yourself in a buddy separation ... at which point you're likely to say "see, I told you so". But in fact, it wasn't inevitable ... more like a self-fulfilling prophecy.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)