The PADI PSD program / Request for action

[muddiver]

Somewhat, but they should stay in the Recreational Diving world
whats next PADI Commercial Scuba

They tried that. OSHA and the Assoc. of Commercial Diving Contractors put them in thier place.

Seems the really big boys don't want to share the $$$ so there is incentive there other than just the safety of working divers. It is bad enough that there are a number of fly-by-night start up commercial diving schools out there for a market that is already saturated with new apprentices.

PADI teaching PSD is just a case of someone trying to teach some thing they know nothing about. They might be betting on their name in the SCUBA world carrying them into the areas that are starting PSD programs, but have not heard of the industry accepted training agencies.

I would suggest a call to the NFPA and that the training agencies should band together to get an ANSI standard written up for training of PSD divers. That will stop anyone who doesn't have the knowledge or experience from trying to do their own thing.

 

[BladesRobinson]

Blades, did anyone point out to them to differences? Did they offer any sort of suggestion how these signals evolved, or did they just make 'em up to be different??

The person who authored the program is a respected and very capable dive team leader who is affiliated with a state team that I also respect. His team is very efficient and effective in what they do. In November of 2008 I explained to the author how line signals were developed by both the U. S. Navy and Dive Rescue International. Essentially, the things you communicate most frequently require the fewest number of line pulls and the things you communicate least often have the greater number of line pulls. Because a tender is constantly checking on the well being of a diver (or at least he should be), 1 pull = okay / okay?

Additionally, in the "standard" PSD line pull system, we account for a possible "line snag" followed by a sudden release which might be interpreted as a single pull and doesn't stop the operation or result in an action that may adversely affect safety.

The "4 or more" pull signal allows for a reflexive, gross motor function reaction that would indicate a need for assistance, and most of the PSD forum readers know the rest...

I also had a lengthy telephone conversation with the author in March of 2009. I was told that both his signals and the standard ones used by DRI, IANTD, ERDI, PSDA and NAPD would be submitted to PADI for consideration. PADI selected the signals written by the author.

I don't fault the author and I don't blame PADI since the people in their office really don't know anything about public safety diving. The fault lies with PADI's "subject matter experts" who reviewed the proposed material and didn't voice a concern over the line signals. The PADI representative that spoke at the "unveiling" at DEMA stated that "bridge inspection" is a function of public safety divers and that is why they had a bridge inspector review their PSD program before it went to print. Again, the PADI office folks only know what they have been told by others...

I am hopeful those in the PSD community will speak up and let PADI know that a "standardized" set of signals in the PSD community would be beneficial to ALL public safety divers. Your concerns and comments should be sent to:

steve.mortell@padi.com
steve.mortell AT padi.com

and to:
qa@padi.com
qa AT padi.com

 

[ditch-diver]

I see the Padi PSD course is "two to three days". I guess our 30 day course has a lot of skills and training in it we do not need.

I can't see it meeting Canadian standards, where it is written that diver must be trained in all types of dives they could be expected to perform. Never do it in three days.

 

[tbaldi]

I don't fault the author and I don't blame PADI since the people in their office really don't know anything about public safety diving.

If that is the case, it begs the question, why is PADI authoring a PSD safety course?

 

[ChainSaw0069]

At DEMA I was able to attend one of the info seminars on PADIs PSD course. It was asked by dive shops / dive instructors from outside the US if they would be able to teach it. The PADI people pretty much stated that this course was developed for the US only and they are looking at it for elsewhere.
It seemed to me that this course is very basic and leaves alot to be desired. I didnt see where after the psd course you could get further training in the basics: Black Water No Vis, Muck Diving, Current, Hazmat - Contaminated Water, Vehicle Recovery and more than what I have mentioned.

 

[Padi Scuba Instructor]

First, I am somewhat new the the PSD realm. Second, I dont want to seem biased in this because several members have posted valid concerns., SO my question, PADI allows for members to deviate from a standard if they submit a free application. Did anyone who is a PADI instructor who also is a PSD and wants to teach the PADI PSD submit a request to deviate to the more standard line signals using mutual aid agreements as the reason? I have this request drafted but am waiting to submit since I have to submit my PSD app first.

 

[bridgediver]

First, I am somewhat new the the PSD realm. Second, I dont want to seem biased in this because several members have posted valid concerns., SO my question, PADI allows for members to deviate from a standard if they submit a free application. Did anyone who is a PADI instructor who also is a PSD and wants to teach the PADI PSD submit a request to deviate to the more standard line signals using mutual aid agreements as the reason? I have this request drafted but am waiting to submit since I have to submit my PSD app first.

I guess I'd have to ask why would a PSD instructor want to teach a PADI PSD course (even if it were altered) if he already teaches a genuine PSD course?

maybe I don't understand your question...

 

[DM95]

Here are the requisites for being a PADI PSD Instructor:

Instructor Pre-requisites
1. Master Scuba Diver Trainer Instructor, or higher
2. Full Face Mask PADI Distinctive Instructor Certification
3. Dry Suit Instructor Certification
4. Any three of the following PADI Instructor ratings:
a. Search and Recovery
b. Night Diver
c. Limited Visibility
d. Emergency Oxygen Provider
e. Underwater Navigation
5. Current EFR Instructor or qualifying equivalent
6. Current Medical
7. Proof of related profession – Police, Fire, Paramedic, Dive Team Member etc.
8. Minimum 1 year PSD experience
9. 20 missions or 10 missions and 10 PSD certs.
10. ICS (Incident Command System) training Level II (200). It is free and available online through FEMA website (NIMS – National Incident Management System). You can simply send a copy of your diploma.

Diver Prerequisites:
1. PADI Advanced and Rescue Diver or qualifying equivalent certification;
2. 18 years old;
3. Proof of affiliation/employment with a public safety team
4. Any ancillary courses necessary to carry out public safety diving in the local area (dry suit, full face mask, etc.)

I would think that anyone who has been in this field for a year and has the call outs/certs would stick with the standardized line pulls. Why would a department change? All they are going to do is confuse people. I think if enough instructors bother to get the rating (Not sure why they would) and advise PADI that they want their open app because of the deviation from the standards in place by professional teams, they might change it. Maybe not

 

[ditch-diver]

First, I am somewhat new the the PSD realm.

Want a little advice.., if you are somewhat new to the PSD realm, take four or five years, get some good exposure and experience in the field doing the work and THEN start looking at your PSD Instructor cert.

A year experience and 20 missions is a little light for being 'the guy'. Taking a few years will help you establish credibility as a knowledgeable instructor to the teams you will meet down the road.

Good Luck, stay safe

 

[Padi Scuba Instructor]

Ok, to clarify. If a PADI instructor who also happens to be on a PSD team want to teach the PADI PSD can apply to use the more nationally recognized and standard line pulls. I am an PADI MSTD and have no interest in getting a new instructor rating if the PADI PSD is just as good. I have the PSDA instructor outline and it is very close to PADI's, except the line pulls. So if line pulls are the main concern, apply to deviate from the PADI line pulls and use the national standard.

I also foresee a "Well they aren't experienced as a PSD but they can teach?". Well the above post shows there must be association to a team, experience with the team and PSD, and also experience as an instructor. What are the minimums to become an instructor for a PSD organization?

I just want to have the right info.

JT 208-640-6710