TDI or DIR

[jccl]

i've completed my PADI OW, AOW and Rescue, and am wondering what path to take from here on. My main goal is to improve my diving techniques, and to eventually dive wrecks, so its' either DIR or TDI. I know there are lots of strong proponents of DIR on the board, but can someone tell me the main strengths and differences for the two courses. (pardon my ignorance by comparing apples with oranges, but I need to pick one instead of doing a PADI DM course)

For wrecks, I need to start of with DIRF-F, then DIR Tech, but with TDI, I suppose I can just do Decomp/Advance Nitrox. So cost- and time-wise, TDI appears more attractive.

I think I have good instructors for both, so I need advice on the better route to take to further my dive education with the eventual goal of diving wrecks.

 

[Scubaroo]

uh, DIR is a style of diving. You can be certified through TDI and still dive DIR.

GUE on the other hand is the training agency that's the definitive DIR education.

 

[ppo2_diver]

Like Scubaroo said, DIR is a style of diving. Kind of like a philosophy. If you really want to improve your overall diving skills, then take the fundies class (DIR-F). It will focus on mastering the core skills of diving and WILL make you a better diver. Once you feel that you have mastered these skills, then practice, practice, and practice. Then move on to techinical diving via TDI, GUE or even PADI (remember, it's the instructor that makes the class not the agency).

 

[jccl]

ah...that clears things up a lot. DIRF first then. thanks!

 

[TX101]

Maybe you could have asked a less "political" question? Like "Do you think GWB is a good president??" lol

To answer your question.. it all depends on what you want to achieve. I think both routes will improve your diving. TDI is more recognised worldwide and will be easier to get helium fills with. It's also probably easier to get the training and they back it up with student manuals. Most people say that the GUE classes expect a lot more from the students and this results in making you a better diver.

 

[DA Aquamaster]

The quality of the instruction and the standards expected depend as much on the instructor as the agency.

My luck with GUE instructors has not been good. My experience may be out of the ordinary, but in my experience they seem to insist on specific equipment right down to make and model of lift bag. To be fair I have also encountered other instructors from other agencies with similarly picky equipment standards, but rather than being a philosophical thing I got the impression it had more to do with them also owning dive shops selling the "required" equipment. Being independent minded and already owning equipment that I like and that is well suited to the task but not 100% DIR, I passed on those options and went with a TDI instructor who was open minded on configurationas it made much more economic and philosophical sense to me.

Philosophically, you can probably go the TDI route and dive with a configuration you like and that works best for you including diving with a completely DIR configuration if you prefer. In my experience in shopping for instruction, it is not usually the case the other way, as the GUE instructors I have talked with tend to regard DIR as an all or nothing proposition in terms of configuration.

The words "solo diving" also tend to make GUE folks cringe while other agencies are more open minded on the subject. In my case the TDI focus was on teaching each diver to be fully self sufficient with the goal of being able to safely complete the dive independently in the event a separation of the buddy team occurred. A GUE/DIR adherent would be more likely to regard a separation of the buddy team as a cardnial sin that should never occur under any circumstances. While I admire the idealism behnind that philospohy, I personally prefer the self sufficient approach as it still works in the real world when a cardinal sin occurs.

So my suggestion is to take a DIR-F course and see what it's about, but also seek out and develop some interaction with other instructors and decide what is right for you long term.

 

[detroit diver]

Never, in any of the 5 fundamentals classes that I've been associated with (with 7 different GUE instructors), has an instructor insisted, or even mentioned that the diver should use a particular make and model of equipment. They do require certain types of equipment (ie BP/wings, no bungees, no split fins, long hose etc.), but they do not tell you to use Halcyon, Oxycheq, or any other brand.

The quality of the instruction and the standards expected depend as much on the instructor as the agency.

My luck with GUE instructors has not been good. My experience may be out of the ordinary, but in my experience they seem to insist on specific equipment right down to make and model of lift bag. To be fair I have also encountered other instructors from other agencies with similarly picky equipment standards, but rather than being a philosophical thing I got the impression it had more to do with them also owning dive shops selling the "required" equipment. Being independent minded and already owning equipment that I like and that is well suited to the task but not 100% DIR, I passed on those options and went with a TDI instructor who was open minded on configurationas it made much more economic and philosophical sense to me.

Philosophically, you can probably go the TDI route and dive with a configuration you like and that works best for you including diving with a completely DIR configuration if you prefer. In my experience in shopping for instruction, it is not usually the case the other way, as the GUE instructors I have talked with tend to regard DIR as an all or nothing proposition in terms of configuration.

The words "solo diving" also tend to make GUE folks cringe while other agencies are more open minded on the subject. In my case the TDI focus was on teaching each diver to be fully self sufficient with the goal of being able to safely complete the dive independently in the event a separation of the buddy team occurred. A GUE/DIR adherent would be more likely to regard a separation of the buddy team as a cardnial sin that should never occur under any circumstances. While I admire the idealism behnind that philospohy, I personally prefer the self sufficient approach as it still works in the real world when a cardinal sin occurs.

So my suggestion is to take a DIR-F course and see what it's about, but also seek out and develop some interaction with other instructors and decide what is right for you long term.

 

[Vie]

ah...that clears things up a lot. DIRF first then. thanks!

jccl, I see that you are based in Singapore.

Give Gideon Liew a call at 65 6435 0436 or 65 9638 6808 or e-mail him at gideon@livingseas.com.sg. He’s a Singapore-based GUE instructor (he also does a lot of GUE teaching in Australia and Malaysia) and a very nice guy. He’ll be happy to answer any GUE/DIR questions you may have. He is also the general manager of Living Seas dive store which is located at The Riverwalk, 20 Upper Circular Road #01-20, Singapore 058416.

 

[Doc Intrepid]

Give Gideon Liew a call at 65 6435 0436 or 65 9638 6808 or e-mail him at gideon@livingseas.com.sg. He’s a Singapore-based GUE instructor (he also does a lot of GUE teaching in Australia and Malaysia) and a very nice guy. He’ll be happy to answer any GUE/DIR questions you may have. He is also the general manager of Living Seas dive store which is located at The Riverwalk, 20 Upper Circular Road #01-20, Singapore 058416.

Second Gideon Liew. Excellent reputation. He'll provide straight skippy. No BS. Best of luck.

 

[Mako Mark]

go and talk to a couple of instructors that can teach you the programs you want, look at their operation and store etc, that is probably the best way to figure out what kind of training you want.