Tank valve Thread O-ring failure

[scubadobadoo]

I brought home a brand spanking new Worthington X8-130 (not painted). It started leaking within minutes of bringing it home ... within in an hour of its first fill. It had the same purple O-ring material extruding out from between the valve and neck as in your pic.

I brought it back to the LDS this morning. They said that they have experienced several failures of this nature with tanks that have valves from Thermo Valve Corporation and use the special non O2 reactant material (called something like EPDS ????) which is an alternative to Viton (the purple stuff). They replaced it with a regular Viton O-ring. It's holding pressure just fine now. Here's a pic of the failed O-Ring that was removed from my tank.

Nice of them to sell something to you without warning of the "several" failures experienced personally. Maybe I am nit picking here, but I wanna know if they know. This is the kind of info a LDS is supposed to provide.

 

[moneysavr]

FYI
I tried to post the other night but it ran late,
ITS NOT A O-RING FAILURE!!
I sent a PM and E Mail to Mike at XS Scuba a owner/ MFG Rep for the Worthington Tank line,I got a call the next day with a e-mail,
As we spoke he told me how a tank valve would of been installed on a Steel tank=JUST LIKE MINE WAS as I watched it be put on wrong! ie. between the legs and three hits to tighten the valve as this works fine with a AL tank but not the steel tanks.
Reason being you need to read the torque specs in the valve bag and the valve needs to sit 360 deg around the tank valve neck as mine in photo was not!
I took my tank to my LDS different then the first one as he used a 2' crescent wrench to crank it down and same thing he replaced the o-ring on my other HP Steel and torqued it down.
Mike at XS Scuba said they were working on a tool to solve this but if you see any gap between your valve and tank neck WRONG! the seat in a steel tank and I did not know this as I don't do vis's is a angle seat, and a AL tank seat is a square seat.
So this is not any failure of HP tanks or the O-Ring as this has happened to other brands. We just need to read the instructions in that plastic bag or the LDS VIS or valve installers.
If any one has questions I can pass Mikes e-mail or PM and he will answer questions as I am no expert I just got the info and thought to pass it on and my LDS did agree with the answers I got.
Dive safe,
Brad I

 

[padiscubapro]

FYI
I tried to post the other night but it ran late,
ITS NOT A O-RING FAILURE!!
I sent a PM and E Mail to Mike at XS Scuba a owner/ MFG Rep for the Worthington Tank line,I got a call the next day with a e-mail,
As we spoke he told me how a tank valve would of been installed on a Steel tank=JUST LIKE MINE WAS as I watched it be put on wrong! ie. between the legs and three hits to tighten the valve as this works fine with a AL tank but not the steel tanks.
Reason being you need to read the torque specs in the valve bag and the valve needs to sit 360 deg around the tank valve neck as mine in photo was not!
I took my tank to my LDS different then the first one as he used a 2' crescent wrench to crank it down and same thing he replaced the o-ring on my other HP Steel and torqued it down.
Mike at XS Scuba said they were working on a tool to solve this but if you see any gap between your valve and tank neck WRONG! the seat in a steel tank and I did not know this as I don't do vis's is a angle seat, and a AL tank seat is a square seat.
So this is not any failure of HP tanks or the O-Ring as this has happened to other brands. We just need to read the instructions in that plastic bag or the LDS VIS or valve installers.
If any one has questions I can pass Mikes e-mail or PM and he will answer questions as I am no expert I just got the info and thought to pass it on and my LDS did agree with the answers I got.
Dive safe,
Brad I

I have been using FABER steel cylinders for almost 20 years now and have NEVER had an extruded o-ring and the valves are never more than hand tight...

Every rebreatherdiver I know only hand tightens their valves as well since they have to be frequently removed to travel with..

 

[riguerin]

I have been using FABER steel cylinders for almost 20 years now and have NEVER had an extruded o-ring and the valves are never more than hand tight...

Every rebreatherdiver I know only hand tightens their valves as well since they have to be frequently removed to travel with..

Independent of tank manufacturer, the problem seems to manifest itself in newer "Thermo Pro" valves from the Thermo Valve Corporation. Do your tanks have these valves ? If so, what material are you using for main O-Ring ?

 

[padiscubapro]

Independent of tank manufacturer, the problem seems to manifest itself in newer "Thermo Pro" valves from the Thermo Valve Corporation. Do your tanks have these valaves ? If so, what material are you using for main O-Ring ?

I have been using viton and epdm o-rings.. I have used thermo valves (and just about every other brand as well) in the past (although they are not my first choice).. I haven't tried the latest valves (the newest I have used/replaced) are probably about a year old.. I havent heard of any issues with these valves and faber cylinders, all the reports I have heard are with worthington so far..

It might as well be some tolerance issue, where other valves will work fine on these cylinders and the valves may work without issue on other cylinders, but the combination may be borderline..

 

[steintheman]

I too had an extruded o-ring experience with a brand new Worthington LP-85/Thermopro valve right after the first fill. I walked out of the shop, threw the tanks in the trunk, and before I could get the car in gear, she blew. Also, the original yoke o-rings were shot after only 3 dives. The valve o-ring was purple and the yoke o-rings were a blue-ish/gray color.

 

[wpscortland]

if LDS had several previous issues with this brand tank, I think they should warn purchasers to watch for this problem (or swap the o-ring from day 1--or just don't sell that tank)

 

[oxyhacker]

I've never liked valves that cut too deeply into the flange overlap area to provide a flat. In the case of the Thermo Pros, where the flat is actually recessed, it seems like at best purposeless and at worst insane. While it not cause problems when the valve and tank tolerances and O-ring specs are spot on, and the valve has been tightening correctly, it offers a reduced safety margin for the times they are not.

And what is the point of the recess, anyhow? Surely not just to provide a space to stamp another number? If so, instead of the number, it might be more appopriate to stamp "Extrude Here".

 

[cerich]

Guys, I have seen the same failures using that oring and simalar failures back in themid 90's when Nitrox started to be common, people were getting too soft orings and the exact same thing was happening. The difference as I see it is those were "aftermarket" non manuf spec'd orings but these are coming with the valves.

Could a mod punch this over to the XS Scuba manuf forum? They distribute Worthingtons and I'm sure will have a definative answer or get one for us.

 

[pescador775]

My umpteenth warning, tighten those valves, and not with a damm mallet, or you get what you get. Your O ring material doesn't have to be extra hard but it should be US manufacture, if possible. Viton is fine. Another thing, make sure the ring is the right size. Recently, I had to disassemble a buddy"s pony tank (who uses those things anyway?). The valve which had been installed by a dive shop was leaking. The O ring was one size too large. This type of ring will fit perfectly in the tank neck recess. That's a good sign it is the wrong ring. The ring should fit snugly on the valve boss above the threads. Install it on the valve not on the tank. Lubricate it.