"Tank lift" regulator recovery

[TMHeimer]

I dont really teach the tank lift method either, IMHO it's not really that practical. When your primary air source is lost, switch to your alternate life support system before trying to find your primary. When I first started out, there were many a time when a student ran out of breath (in confined water) before finding their primary. I think also teaching the student to grab their alternate first is much easier and less intimidating or for lack of a better word, "scary." If you are a new student and you hear that you have to remove your regulator, that can be daunting! But if someone is really paranoid about loosing their regulator, then I suggest getting a regulator necklace... giving piece of mind for the low price of $6.99!

Good point about using your own octo first. I've heard only one (of our many) instructors mention that for a real life situation. I've heard that the reason for the "tank lift' method is in case your reg. gets caught up in back somewhere and the arm sweep method fails. Again--the octo. I found that because I have an issue with my shoulders at times, I find it nearly impossible to grab the reg hose right next to the tank valve--but no problem if I just reach a bit down from there and grab the hose.

 

[abyss_scuba]

Not to get off topic, but I think any diver that starts to get "cared"because they have lost a regulator is just not comfortable in the water. Think about it. Is it better to find "tricks" ie grab your octo before looking for a primary or teach them to be so comfortable that they can blow bubbles for the what 10 econds it takes to do an arm sweep or reach behind? Also if you use a necklace on a standard reg set up then is an ooa diver to go for your primary and end up with the shorter hose or yank the octo from around your neck and possibly dislodge your primary? I am not a fan of necklaces unless you have a long hose setup and know how to use it. I think I am going to have to go to the pool and time myself and a few students and see actually how long this skill takes. But more on that in another thread.

 

[agesilaus]

As a recent student in OW (SSI) our instructor taught the sweep and reach methods but never mentioned lifting the tank. He just told us if we cannot easily recover the reg by the reach method just use the sweep. I don't have a great range of motion in my right shoulder so I stuck with the sweep.

 

[boulderjohn]

Students who are taught to do the skills while kneeling usually prefer the sweep method to the reach method because it is so hard to reach the regulator hose while kneeling. Gravity pulls it away from you while kneeling, so you have to lift the tank to reach it.

So how often do you think you will lose your regulator while you are kneeling during a dive?

Instructors who instead teach students these skills while in a horizontal position, as PADI emphasizes in its new OW program, find that their students have a very different experience. When students are in a normal horizontal diving position, that regulator hose is easily reached, right behind the right ear. There is no need to lift the tank. It is so ridiculously easy that divers taught that way wonder about the purpose of the sweep method. Why do something so complicated when you can just reach behind the ear and grab the regulator?

If you plan on doing all your diving on your knees, make sure you are good with the sweep method. Otherwise, count on the reach method to help you out.

 

[chrispete]

An easy way to teach the "tank lift" method that doesn't require reaching behind yourself is to reach over to your right shoulder strap with your left hand, then shrug and pull the strap down toward your waist. Grab for your right ear with your right hand and at least one regulator hose will nearly be (if not) touching it.

I do teach horizontal sweep recovery as the primary recovery method however.

 

[agesilaus]

Now that you mention it, we were vertical tho not kneeling. I'll have to try it next time I'm in the water horizontally.

BK

 

[NAM001]

As said in a previous post you have to lift the tank if you cant reach the valve to find the hose. I have thought of this situation every time I see a pic of a diver and his tank is hanging from thier but and the valve is in the middle of thier back. I have just grown to accept that perhaps it is just a loose bcd or that way for the instructors who,, like overweighting,, do this to keep the students head up. Raise that tank so the valve is somewhere at shoulder level or between the shoulder and the ear. If that does not make lifting unnecessary, it will surely make it easier. Look at where the (forgive me) the tech divers wear thier tanks and copy that. if you can reach your valves dont vent your bcd.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

The reason to go for the octo also assumes that the instructor has taught students how to secure it in the first place. Many do not from what I see at training sites. I actually think some tell students to let it dangle or don't care if it does. And in the event someone is diving where poorly trained divers tend to go, getting used to reaching for the octo is a damn good idea if someone does try to mug you for your primary. But then I also do not teach students to take the octo or primary if they run out of air. They are to signal OOA and allow the donor to hand them a working reg.
In my OW class I was told to signal OOA and the donor would spread their arms and allow me to locate and take their octo while they protected their primary. Seems ok in a benign training session. But in real life I am convinced that this sends the following message to an already stressed diver "Holy Crap Buddy! You're gonna die if you don't get a reg in your pie hole. Well you ain't getting the one I have in my mouth! Here try and find one on me! Good luck with that!"

Whereas teaching a diver to donate the reg says to the stressed diver "You're OOA? No problem, here's a working reg I was just using. It's ok, I'm here to help. I'll just get on my back up."

So in my mind and in my classes the idea is to get a working reg in your mouth ASAP. Either one. Doesn't matter. If students are taught to and get into the habit of stowing the octo in the same place every time there is no need to try and locate it. You know where it is and instinctively reach for it and get it in your mouth.

As for being in a place where maybe you can't get vertical or even reach out to the side to sweep? Why is an OW diver in there anyway? What is it about "NO OVERHEADS" that the diver does not understand or was not taught? And what yahoo is leading them into such a situation?

 

[TMHeimer]

I find the arm swoop method to be just as easy while horizontal and swimming, as well ,obviously, as mask clearing.

 

[tdtaylor]

Swimming horizontal, I don't even have to think about finding my primary. It is "right there." I have gotten it caught while maneuvering through trees in a quarry, but just go to the Alternate and then calmly find the primary.

But I have had two shoulder surgeries, and my reach is not what it use to be. When in a drysuit, and more vertical, I find I have to lift the bottom to be able to reach my hoses. No big deal. Occasionally, on a good day, I can reach it without lifting.

Most of our instructors still teach lifting the tank as part of Reg Retrieval 2. I have to say, 9 out of 10 new divers appear to have no issues just reaching back and reaching their hoses. We do have them do the sweep, then go to alternate, then search for the primary. One thing that helps is before the exercise, we have them familiarize themselves in Buddy teams where the proper hose is by touch.

And although not PADI, I think moving to the horizontal method of training is far superior. Hopefully all agencies will follow.

Terry