taking nitrox cert with basic scuba course

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I did my OW and Nitrox at the same time. (NAUI) The first two cert dives were on air, the second two on the follow day were on EAN32. (Of course, my nitrox card didn't show up for a couple weeks after my OW did.)
 
Anyway, it's like I've said repeatedly. Whether there is a way for someone to game the system and get a Nitrox card without finishing OW or not is beside the point. I'm willing to take tursiops' (implied) word for it that there is no way that could happen.

The point is, I think it's perfectly reasonable for a shop to want to see a C card that requires dives before they let you dive. I.e. I think it's reasonable for a shop to not accept a Nitrox card as proof of having an OW C card. I didn't have to do any dives to get my Nitrox card. I'm not going to show up someplace with only my Nitrox card and EXPECT them to accept it as proof of a diving certification.
Implied word? LOL. What do i have to do to make you a believer?
Here is explicitly what PADI says in its EANx instructor guide (it was easy for me to find): "the Enriched Air Diver certification is issued only after the Enriched Air Diver course requirements are met and after the student diver becomes a certified PADI Open Water Diver." This is in the instructor guide, you won't find it in the "open" literature. In the SDI OW instructor guide, it has a similar statement, but I don't have it electronically and don't want to type it all down. It is in the section on classes that can run concurrently with OW, like drysuit and altitude.

Quoting the standards does not mean I think it could not happen.....I agree completely one should show their OW card (at least) to be able to dive.
 
I did my OW and Nitrox at the same time. (NAUI) The first two cert dives were on air, the second two on the follow day were on EAN32. (Of course, my nitrox card didn't show up for a couple weeks after my OW did.)

that's what I did/we do, but only issue the NAUI Nitrox Diver cert card, not the regular OW card. No reason to issue redundant cards and it is frustrating that $$ is the only reason the agencies haven't just rolled nitrox into the standard OW courses for all new divers
 
Implied word? LOL. What do i have to do to make you a believer?
Here is explicitly what PADI says in its EANx instructor guide (it was easy for me to find): "the Enriched Air Diver certification is issued only after the Enriched Air Diver course requirements are met and after the student diver becomes a certified PADI Open Water Diver." This is in the instructor guide, you won't find it in the "open" literature. In the SDI OW instructor guide, it has a similar statement, but I don't have it electronically and don't want to type it all down. It is in the section on classes that can run concurrently with OW, like drysuit and altitude.

Quoting the standards does not mean I think it could not happen.....I agree completely one should show their OW card (at least) to be able to dive.

That extra info is enough to convince me ... for PADI and SDI. It still doesn't tell me that someone couldn't go through SSI or SEI or on and on to get a Nitrox card without finishing OW. But, like I said, it doesn't really matter.

So, I guess if you're doing PADI or SDI and you want to do OW at home with referral dives to finish, and you want to dive Nitrox at your destination, but you don't want to spend any vacation time in a classroom, there's no way to accomplish all that? You either have to do the whole Nitrox course at your vacation destination, or you have to dive only air on your vacation, or you have to finish your entire OW course at home before you go?
 
that's what I did/we do, but only issue the NAUI Nitrox Diver cert card, not the regular OW card. No reason to issue redundant cards and it is frustrating that $$ is the only reason the agencies haven't just rolled nitrox into the standard OW courses for all new divers
There it is. I've said the same before. It would be nice to see an agencies making improvements that aren't a money grab.

Given that the instructor requirements are a more clear on the subject, I'm a bit less worried about my buddy's situation. He's a good bit older than I am, so it would probably be the end of diving for him if he had to go take another open water course to replace his decrepit certification card. I just don't think he'd put the time and money in for what will likely only be a couple more years before he can't do it anymore. I think it was from NASDS if I'm not mistaken.
 
Ok- but I thought you based this whole sidebar on SDI written standards? So why are you questioning SSI and SEI (?) now? I see you are saying it really doesn't matter but since you keep bringing it up, it seems like it does matter to you.

That extra info is enough to convince me ... for PADI and SDI. It still doesn't tell me that someone couldn't go through SSI or SEI or on and on to get a Nitrox card without finishing OW. But, like I said, it doesn't really matter.

So, I guess if you're doing PADI or SDI and you want to do OW at home with referral dives to finish, and you want to dive Nitrox at your destination, but you don't want to spend any vacation time in a classroom, there's no way to accomplish all that? You either have to do the whole Nitrox course at your vacation destination, or you have to dive only air on your vacation, or you have to finish your entire OW course at home before you go?
 
Ok- but I thought you based this whole sidebar on SDI written standards? So why are you questioning SSI and SEI (?) now? I see you are saying it really doesn't matter but since you keep bringing it up, it seems like it does matter to you.
Don't bother, you will just keep banging your head against the desk.
 
That extra info is enough to convince me ... for PADI and SDI. It still doesn't tell me that someone couldn't go through SSI or SEI or on and on to get a Nitrox card without finishing OW. But, like I said, it doesn't really matter.

So, I guess if you're doing PADI or SDI and you want to do OW at home with referral dives to finish, and you want to dive Nitrox at your destination, but you don't want to spend any vacation time in a classroom, there's no way to accomplish all that? You either have to do the whole Nitrox course at your vacation destination, or you have to dive only air on your vacation, or you have to finish your entire OW course at home before you go?

No way to go through SEI and get one without being a certified diver. SEI requires open water certification and actually recommends AOW. Unlike the other agencies SEI also requires two dives with nitrox.
 
Ok- but I thought you based this whole sidebar on SDI written standards? So why are you questioning SSI and SEI (?) now? I see you are saying it really doesn't matter but since you keep bringing it up, it seems like it does matter to you.

There are a huge number of certifying agencies around the world. Verifying that 3 or 4 of them have a process in place that prevents someone getting a Nitrox card without OW is not proof that there is no way to get a Nitrox card without completing OW. I wasn't trying to single out SSI or SEI. They were just examples, along with "on and on" to illustrate that knowing that PADI and SDI won't allow it doesn't mean it can't happen.

People keep saying "you can't get a Nitrox card without having OW." But they don't specify which agency or agencies they are talking about. And I'll bet you a dollar there is no one saying that that has actually verified that statement with every single agency from around the world that issues Nitrox cards. I like correct and accurate statements, not partially verified generalizations. That is the only reason I have continued to respond on that issue. Annnnd.... now I'm done.
 
Ok- but I thought you based this whole sidebar on SDI written standards? So why are you questioning SSI and SEI (?) now? I see you are saying it really doesn't matter but since you keep bringing it up, it seems like it does matter to you.
You are mistaken. It was split from another thread where we got off topic. In this case we were discussing (first) PADI and NAUI appearing to not require OW certification in order to take Nitrox. An instructor posted material from PADI that even said at the completion of the NITROX course he MUST issue the nitrox card. i.e. he isn't allowed to tell a student they can't have the nitrox card if they didn't complete OW. Hopefully he wouldn't give them the nitrox written test until after the OW stuff was done or something along those lines. I'm sure no self respecting instructor would give an uncertified diver a nitrox card.

Later the discussion changed to agencies other than PADI or NAUI, and included SSI and SEI. We postulated that maybe most agencies had similar deficiencies in their policy.

Due to the thread split, I can understand your confusion.
 

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