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The personal story Mike quoted is not about mainland Honduras but relates to an expat currently living on Roatan. I would invite you to visit the Bay Islands Voice facebook page to read the articles and the comments by many people living on the Island. In the past 6 weeks you will read about murders of a tourist,2 security guards,2 expat business owners and an Islander who was killed in a shootout with an expat business owner. Crime seems to be escalating on the Island at an alarming rate.
.... Roatan comes up in any search done as a good candidate for retirement due to some articles that appeared about 10 years ago, since those articles came out, as the media will do it piggy backs on them and more articles were written, the good old top 10 places to retire in the Caribbean and such. Many people including myself have considered Roatan retirement, or Roatan investments in land, 2nd home, business ect...
Is this really that difficult to comprehend that what's been stated is in regard to Roatan is looking less and less likely to many as a safe place to retire, invest or buy a 2nd home.
Also, Why do people feel the need to defend crime in the first place? I totally don't get that. Do you fail to understand that one of the things that make/made a place like Roatan a favorable place to retire, invest or buy a 2nd home is because the crime is below the average such as places like Curaca and Aruba, not on par with it.
I would disagree on a very minor point, though... "... that one of the things that make/made a place like Roatan a favorable place to retire, invest or buy a 2nd home is because "
No, I think those articles that you mention key off of one main thing: the cost of buying, building and living is still a bargain compared to the other more known (and bug free) islands. That's the big selling point.
No multiple murders on Dominica, Bonaire, Curacau, Bahamas ... Nor did I encounter or even hear of violent crime. A little gas hoisting was the worst of it. I had no fear of travel anywhere, day or night. I doubt that Turks, Cayman, Fiji, Bora Bora, Tahiti, ... would be unsafe.
To an extent, yes. They have had their own security previously. Ascertain if they do now. I wouldn't fear any personal crime while on property.
This is a good idea with any choice of any resort in the world- take a good look at security.
I stayed at the one in the SoPac resorts where terrorists abducted a group of SCUBA divers and held them for ransom. They had now hired armed security. Hard target: no threat.
On Roatan, different resorts offer different levels of security, largely as a function of their physical, geographic isolation.
IBR (Infinty) does not have geographical isolation other than it is "at the end of the road", so it's pretty easy for any staff to see what's going on.
AKR (Anthony) is a fairly well controlled access environment, although a public road runs through it to an otherwise isolated village. The guards know who belongs and who does not. Their security provided on the ocean side of the Keys has been well thought-out and staffed in my previous visits. It is also close to the West End for an easy quick cab ride if you want to do that every day or night.
FI (Fantasy) is on it's own island but there is fluid access both by bridge and to a lesser extent by boat. Locals are allowed in to use the bar and disco. There have been in the distant past some very minor property crimes traced to the staff. Caveat: I don't know if it is actually presenting a fully operational product at his time- no reports here on SB in many months since its sales/management collapse and ownership turnover occurred. Trip Advisor has some widely varying comments.
CCV (CocoView) is certainly the most isolated and best patrolled, being on its own island accessed only by boat and the security staff is professionally trained. It is the hardest target on the island.
BFK (Barefoot Cay) is in good stead if nothing else by it's perfect location. Nothing getting on or off that small islet without being seen in the glare of the industrial harbor's lighting that it sits within.
RHR (Reef House Resort) is on an isolated Key that houses a small settlement. Outsiders and n'er do-wells are quickly spotted and easily discouraged. Not a lot of issues there.
TURQBR (Turquoise Bay) is fairly well patrolled and the access is controlled to an extent.
Again- always look at the on site staff security at any destination in paradise.
You're not in Kansas anymore. These places have better diving.
The personal story you posted was a report about crime in HONDURAS....not Roatan....although Roatan is part of Honduras, the crime rate on the island of Honduras is SUBSTANTIALLY less than the mainland of Honduras.....The Roatanians keep it that way for a reason...they want people to come back. The mainland of Honduras, however, is a completely different story...
I think you read it too fast. Read it again and you'll see it' about Roatan.
In that quote is a reference to how disputes on Roatan sometimes end up being settled by one of the parties hiring a contract killer to murder the other person. The police now suspect that the murder of Vern Fine the ferry owner to Utila was a contract killing also. It has all the signs which are the murders were from the mainland, nothing was stolen, the murdered person didn't know the murders etc...
Another locals take on the escalation of violent crime --
No sooner did I finish gathering the facts from Austin Bodden about that outrageous crime than I got a call from the Bay Islands Voice about the tragic murder at sea of Vern Fine, an American who ran a catamaran service between Utila and Roatan. According to the US warden on Utila, Fine, like Bodden, was transporting two Hondurans on his boat, plus his mate. Just outside Red Cliff on the east side, he said, Fine was assaulted by the two passengers, who stabbed him to death. The mate jumped overboard. The assailants were reportedly apprehended while hiding out in Camponado, the underbelly of Utila.
An outraged public is now calling for better security and screening of people arriving from the mainland. There is an old Utila saying: “Nothing good comes from the coast.” They say this even though many hardworking mainlanders have settled here and blended in well with our small community.
The truth is that a community that for years cowardly looked away or kept its head in the sand rather than get together and take care of the crime problem is now paying the price. Criminality is like a cancer. If you have cancer, you cut it out while it’s still small. On the Bay Islands the cancer has been allowed to spread. Now even on Utila, with a church on every corner, savages are acting with total disregard for human life, or for the damage they cause to the tourist industries as every crime goes on the internet. This is unacceptable!!
I don’t remember having much of a problem with crime when I came to Utila in 1970. What’s the problem now? Back in 2005 the chief of the Bay Islands tourist police said at a meeting here about crime-fighting strategies, “This is a justice system for a different country than ours.” So perhaps we need a system more suited to our country, one that gives those savages a taste of their own medicine. What are we waiting for?!
Yes Judy Cole this is the beautiful Island that we frequent and purchased land. It has turned bad there and we are having a hard time as we just loved the place but now we don't know what to think. What a shame we speak of it often and we decided not to build. As for vacation for this Dec and Jan we will not be going to Roatan. I am so upset about all the stuff going on
Another who felt much the same as those on this thread who have posted crime is everywhere and rationalized the escalation
It Can Happen to Anyone; It Happened to MeArmed Robbery on Roatan Reflects the Dark Side of “Paradise”
Normally I would be composing my monthly column in the comfort of my house on the beach on my personal laptop. But I no longer have a personal laptop. Two guys with a gun stole it from me. Normally, after putting the magazine to bed for the month, I would hop on my scooter and ride into West End for happy hour. But I no longer have a scooter. They stole that too.
The aforementioned guys were waiting for me in an unlit area behind my house when I pulled up on my scooter on a Friday night two weeks ago. They shined a light in my eyes, pointed a gun at my head and told me to get off the scooter and lie face down in the sand. They relieved me of my wallet, a neck chain and wrist chain and took my keys from my pocket, with which one of them entered the house and took the laptop, three cell phones (two belonging to the Voice), a backpack with a pair of Raybans, $80 cash, and a wristwatch off my nightstand. Then they told me to get up and walk toward the beach while they rode off on my scooter.
Having a gun pointed at one’s head can do wonders to clarify one’s thinking. I can’t say my life flashed before my eyes, although there was a moment when I thought I might be about to punctuate my final sentence. But I’m seeing some things more clearly now about life on Roatan. I’m not ready to leave. But the place may never again look so idyllic in my eyes.
I knew before I came here that crime was a risk to my investment and to my person. I factored in that risk and decided it was acceptable. Now, however, the crime here for me is no longer an abstraction or a statistic – it’s an ugly reality. I think about it every time I approach a dark corner, enter or leave my house, or can’t find a phone number because some creep stole my cell phone.
I’ve thought a lot about the rationalizing and dismissive comments many people make about the crime situation here. Before I saw them as a mixture of self-interest and self-delusion. Now I see them as borderline deceitful. So many people have approached me since my incident – my admission to the club, so to speak – to relate similar experiences that I’ve concluded that, if you live here long enough, it’s not a question of whether but when you will become a crime victim.
Many long-time Roatan residents have been victimized multiple times. Yet they stay. Some may be crazy. Others just pig-headed. Or maybe they’ve got no place else to go, or they really, really like the climate. In my case, I’ve invested too much of my life’s savings and my life’s dreams to come here for a couple of thugs to intimidate me into giving it all up.
But the crime has already changed my lifestyle. I moved. I can no longer walk out my door and go for a swim when I wake up or return from the office, because the same beautiful beach that drew me to the island provides camouflage for vermin, and I don’t mean sand flies. I live in a house on a hill now, behind a tall iron gate with a lock. I don’t go out much anymore.
Which leads me to question: Why is it that I am now living behind bars instead of the lowlife bottom-feeders who robbed me? Or, in keeping with the Independence Day theme of this issue: Having just commemorated their independence from Spain in the 19th century, when will Hondurans stand up and demand their independence from the criminals and thugs who terrorize them in the 21st?
Bay Islanders deserve and must demand better! Accepting the current situation as normal and inevitable is suicide. And it doesn’t have to be this way.
I dutifully reported my incident to the police as soon as I could safely get to the station. And the police . . . well, as far as I can determine, they did nothing. Even when I related to them that three suspects were reportedly wandering around El Swampo selling my things, rather than go try to catch them, they wanted to know who gave me the information. Nonetheless, reporting crimes to the authorities, then collectively demanding that they act on the information, is the only way law enforcement will be made more responsive to the citizenry.
Hondurans, those who vote here, must insist on better from their public servants. We foreigners can only vote with our feet by leaving, as roughly one of eight Hondurans have done. As I said, I’m not ready to do that yet. But perhaps more of us need to before people here will accept that they have a problem.
Finally - please take the time to read this one -- while you're reading it, imagine that you and your family were staying at this resort, the Mango Creek Lodge, when this happened, all that stood between you and death was the owner and his shot gun holding off murderers with automatic weapons. Fifteen years of him and his wife building their dream on Roatan about to be abandoned as they will be forced to leave to protect their lives. What's truly ironic is this February the owner made a blog post on his resorts website about crime on Roatan, talking about how safe his resort is due to it's isolation. Very, very sad.
Bay Islands Voice » Blog Archive » Fatal Shots Ring Out in Port Royal Canadian Charged with Murder, Says He Acted in Self-Defense
Mike, you now have 7 posts in a thread of 33 total.
I still haven't heard where you would go diving (as a tourist) and feel safer (or whatever is required) to do so.
Here's your profile:
About Mike
Biography:Akumel Mexico, Cozumel Mexico, Puerto Vallarta Mexico, St. Lucia, Jost Van Dyke, Anegada, Tortola, Virgin Gorda, Norman Island, Roatan, Anguilla, St. Barts, St. Kitts, Nevis, Antigua, St. Maarten, Jamaica, Haiti, Grand Cayman, New Providence, Maui, Bonaire, Isla Mujeres, Key West, Key Largo
Or was there someplace else, some similar (like your list) exotic unexlpored islet, that you might venture off to in the Caribbean in search of, as posters here often ask, for "great diving" ?
Possibly even someplace without a McDonalds or even a Casino... maybe?
Where else would you recommend we go?
Like I said, I sold my property years back when I saw this coming. I still return to go diving a few weeks each year. I stay on the Cocoview resort property, I come to dive. I believe the drive to O'Hare airport exposes me to more risk than my 14 days in Roatan.
Pretty depressing and worrysome. being there for 4 months training lving in the west end and traveling to two dive centers for training is much different than what folks are now describing..... go to a resort and sty there just to dive. Is this also a threat on Utilla? IF these two Hondurus islands are now unsafe for an extended time as DM and IDC internships, where else would somone suggest?
You stateside people just want to think this only happens in other countries. Denver and Chicago are much more dangerous than Roatan. No place on earth can escape globalization, and the spread of desensitization of violence through the media in the US...
I have to ask myself, do I really want to vacation in an environment where a lesbian three-way is a risky endeavor? And what does that imply about the risks of an old-fashioned menage-a-trois? If there is no prospect of an assignation with a couple of lipstick lesbians, what could possibly motivate me to travel there? I'm sorry, I too have crossed Roatan off my list.
Is this also a threat on Utilla? IF these two Hondurus islands are now unsafe for an extended time as DM and IDC internships, where else would somone suggest?
The biggest problem: Most people who arrive in search of IDC and DM internships are not there with 100% focus on the goal.
You can bang out the DM in 5 days~ and the AI/IDC/IE can be pounded through in 10 days. People that show up for "internships" are there for something other than that.
True, many people go to these to "learn about diving", but not really a good plan.
You are seen as a well-off person (obviously) who has come with your lap-top and camera,
but late nights seem to pass at a local bar.
This is where you meet people. This develops relationships. You "make friends",
maybe even get very friendly. You might even meet a few seemingly nice people who have other paths in life.
Except for the diving thing, this might be Denver.
You want to be a diver man? You want to go Pro?
Study hard, do a lot of local dives, then go and do your IDC... bing, bang, boom~ d-o-n-e.
Want to avoid "threats" on a month long stay?
1) Stay home in the US. Failing that:
2) Stay out of bars
3) Do not go out to party scenes
4) Do not bring any toys
5) Always carry $8 in singles, no more
6) Wear a cheap watch and $12 sunglasses
7) Do not get friendly with any females
8) Be very aware of your surroundings (If you were not born with that ability, see #1)
For those who are truly serious in this path, look for US based PADI (etc) IDC "colleges".
Get it done in two weeks within the USA.
Flodad - being in West End at noon is basically like going to Park Meadows Mall. Being in West End at 6:00 pm is like going to 16th street mall at 9:00 pm. Being in West End at 1:00 am is like walking one block over around 5 points at 10:00 pm.
Flodad, I spent 3 months (August through October) living in West End (or just outside it, never really found out exactly where the boundary is), doing a DM internship and IDC. I felt quite safe when I was there, but the people I made friends with and hung out with at bars after the shop closed were basically all people I met through the shop - other DMTs, instructors and customers, very few of whom were actually Honduran.
Would I go back there? Yeah. Would I feel the need to stay at an all-inclusive resort with security? No.
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