Stages

[Wreckie]

Hi all,

Have heard this a couple of times from a few people, want to know why.

Steel cylinders are dangerouse when used as stages.

Please avoid arguments revolving around the words 'must always' or 'must never', i find that both statements are rarely true :monkey:

Mike

 

[mempilot]

The severe negative bouancy would keep me from using them.

 

[MikeFerrara]

It's not that they're dangerouse they're just too heavy. Just try to manage 4 or 5 of em.

They also don't lay as well as a aluminum tank.

I know people who ise them for oxygen on cave dives. That works ok because you're not carrying it with you anyway.

 

[NEWreckDiver]

I personally use all steel for back gas and deco. And have not had any issues. This allows me to remove weight from my belt.

It is just a matter of balancing the your weighting no matter which tank you use.

DSAO

 

[mempilot]

It is just a matter of balancing the your weighting no matter which tank you use.

DSAO

good point. do you ever tie off your tanks for tight penetration?

 

[Genesis]

I never drop or tie off a tank in the ocean.

If I can't take it with me, I don't go wherever I'm contemplating. The risk is too high - several people have died this way, by getting blown off a wreck and losing their stage or deco gas, and not having the supply required left to complete their deco obligation.

I can see where it would be ok in a cave - there's only one way back out - the way you came in. This is most assuredly NOT true in a wreck.

Now most of my wreck penetration dives around here are "weenie" dives by many people's standards - deco required, but still on Nitrox with max depths of 130-140. Typically you only need one deco tank full of 50%. But in my view, the argument gets even MORE compelling about NOT dropping things the deeper you go and the more (and larger) tanks you sling, because the risk of losing them goes up in terms of impact.

IOW, I can (typically) deco out on backgas with a single tank of 50% that "disappears", provided that I play by the rules and dive thirds. If I am carrying a tank of 50% and a tank of Oxygen, and lose BOTH, I'm probably screwed as my backgas will not permit me to complete the deco.

 

[NEWreckDiver]

I never drop or tie off a tank in the ocean.

If I can't take it with me, I don't go wherever I'm contemplating. The risk is too high - several people have died this way, by getting blown off a wreck and losing their stage or deco gas, and not having the supply required left to complete their deco obligation.

I can see where it would be ok in a cave - there's only one way back out - the way you came in. This is most assuredly NOT true in a wreck.

Now most of my wreck penetration dives around here are "weenie" dives by many people's standards - deco required, but still on Nitrox with max depths of 130-140. Typically you only need one deco tank full of 50%. But in my view, the argument gets even MORE compelling about NOT dropping things the deeper you go and the more (and larger) tanks you sling, because the risk of losing them goes up in terms of impact.

IOW, I can (typically) deco out on backgas with a single tank of 50% that "disappears", provided that I play by the rules and dive thirds. If I am carrying a tank of 50% and a tank of Oxygen, and lose BOTH, I'm probably screwed as my backgas will not permit me to complete the deco.

I completely agree. Most of my dives up here you are doing your dive without a buddy right by your side. If something happens and you cannot get back to the tie in point, you are about to have a bad day. Just read the “Last Dive”. That is one of the factors that contributed to the Rousses problems.

If there is a place where there is a tight penetration, you better have support before you try.

That is just my two cents worth.

DSAO

 

[LUBOLD8431]

I dont know if I would call them dangerous, but steel stages or deco bottles are definitely heavier than aluminum, and they make it alot harder to control your buoyancy UW. I am a recent convert to aluminum deco bottles, after using two steel 46's for a few years. I didnt like the buoyancy change I got with the steels. The aluminums, you hardly notice them UW.

Also, I dont factor in the deco bottles for my weighting. If for some reason you lose them (Lets not argue, just assume you lost one SOMEHOW) and your backgas is down, you will be lite towards the end of the dive and not be able to hold your last deco stop. Not a good idea. You should always be weighted with just the doubles, and DO NOT count your deco bottles as ballast. Definitely might bite you in the behind someday.

 

[flw]

Hi all,

Have heard this a couple of times from a few people, want to know why.

Steel cylinders are dangerouse when used as stages.

Please avoid arguments revolving around the words 'must always' or 'must never', i find that both statements are rarely true :monkey:

Mike

I've used both over the years, I think perhaps that US steel cylinders are heavier than the Faber lightweight's we tend to use over here. I've got a 10l steel which is older and neutral in the water.
In general the Al cylinders have better ouyancy characteristics, and are slightly positive when empty, so they stay out of the way better ( IMO, my buddy reckons they are irratating when floaty) They can be taken off if needed - the most likely reason is to hand a cylinder off to someone else if they need your deco gas, or as I did once, managed to keyhole myself into a wreck ( KPW in Scapa) and needed to unclip it
I recently have changed so that my 10l stage is Faber steel, and fine with a 16/50 mix in it, and my 7l 50% is Aluminium which is equally nice and neutral

F

 

[Genesis]

AL40s and 80s "ride" nicely when clipped off as stages/deco bottles. I've never tried steels for this purpose, but I suspect they won't "ride" as nicely.