Spontaneous Pneumothorax

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johnr

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Milwaukee WI
20 yrs ago I had a S/P now at age 50 I want to take up diving. I have been all over the internet learning about all the bad things that could happen to me. I could use some help separating the what could or might happen from what will with for sure happen.

I know that I do have blebs on both lungs the one is 3cm in diameter. Here are some questions I need answers to

1. are there any divers out there the have blebs and are still diving?
2. Are ther any known fatalities of divers that had a S/P?
3. Where can a McSwain dart be bought
4. What is the maximum % of a collapsed lung one could have at 60ft without it becoming a tension pnemothorax upon accent?
5.Will the pressure at 60ft absolutely cause a lung to collapse in a person with blebs.

6. Is there a site that has accident reports that I can reseach?
 
My vote is no.
Imagine, if you dare, a full pneumothorax at depth... on ascent that lung has nowhere to go but into the trachea - it's not a matter of reducing it once you get to the surface.
I'm not a doctor and perhaps the professional medical folks will have a different opinion, but if I were you I'd try something else. Sorry.
Rick
 
Thanks for your input Rick. I hope some Doctors and or persons that have had a spontaneous pneumothorax will give me some help also
 
You best bet for information is either a MD with knowledge of diving medicine or DAN.

I believe I had read somewhere that a history of SP is a contraindication to diving. The risks may just be to great for a reoccurence.

I would check with DAN.

Good Luck
Good Health
 
Hello johnr:

Answers are for information only, do not imply diagnosis or treatment and should always be used in conjunction with advice from your personal physician.

One almost fears to write anything negative on this board for fear of being 'flamed' - but here goes!

Spontaneous pneumothorax is an inherited disease which leaves some people with weakened areas of the pleural lining of the lung, called blebs or blisters. These can occasionally burst, the lung collapses and causes air to leak from the lung to the chest cavity, resulting in a pneumothorax ('air in the chest'). It is 'spontaneous' in the sense that there was no trauma or surgical cause of the ruptured bleb. It can occur when the individual is exercising, straining, or performing some other physical task, but most of the time it just happens. If one spontaneous pneumothorax has occurred, there is a 33% chance that another will occur within 2-3 years; 30% will have a recurrence after 3 years, and there is a 60% long term risk for another pneumothorax.

When a lung collapses while diving, the air in the chest cavity is at the ambient pressure of the dive depth. Upon ascending, the air in the chest cavity expands, and further compresses the lung (tension pneumothorax), often pushing the heart over into the other side of the chest, severely compromising cardiopulmonary function. This is a life-threatening situation and is one of the main reasons that a history of spontaneous pneumothorax is an absolute contra-indication to diving since most divers and dive boats are not prepared to provide first aid to a diver with pneumothorax. One of the symptoms of a small pneumothorax is a voice change after a dive. This would raise a warning flag about further diving as there might be a small pneumothorax which in itself is not harmful, but which will cause a serious problem if the diver does another dive.

You cannot assume that you are at no risk because you have not had problems in a long time - the blebs that you describe would surely burst under the tremendous changes in pressure of diving. Also, nothing in diving is invariable but there would be considerable risk of a tension pneumothorax on ascent after a sizable spontaneous collapse of your lung at depth. There has been a special instrument developed, called the "McSwain dart" for use on dive boats for this situation. This can be obtained at most surgical supply houses. A 14 gauge needle/catheter assembly will often do just as well until the diver reaches an emergency facility.

Gas embolism with air getting into the arterial circulation is another serious outcome that can happen, often with brain and cardiac symptoms, and possible death.

Surgical procedures called pleurodesis (scarring the lung surface) and pleurectomy (excision of the pleura, a thin covering of the lungs) are commonly performed for recurrent collapsed lungs. There is a recurrence rate of 8 percent following pleurodesis. Recurrence is rare following pleurectomy. Even if recurrence of collapsed lung does not occur, the underlying cystic lung disease of the other lung remains, with the inherent danger now being pulmonary barotrauma with air embolism. The following are absolute contraindications to diving:

Diving within three months after any type of collapsed lung.
Spontaneous collapsed lung in beginners.
Expert divers with recurrent collapsed lung after pleurectomy.
If you feel that you will continue your quest to dive regardless of the risk, Spiral CT scans of your lungs should be performed so as to detail the degree of risk involved.

Best advice here would be not to dive until you have had a pleurectomy (both sides, if necessary)and have been cleared to dive by your personal chest physician.

Best regards:
Ern Campbell, MD, FACS
Diving Medicine Online
http://www.scuba-doc.com/
 
Thanks DR. Campbell The statement that my blebs will surely burst will make me stop and think. Perhaps free diving will be my only option.

John
 
Hello all/ Dr Campbell.
I guess my situation is slightly different, I had 2 (at least) SP, and then underwent laparoscopic pleurectomy, with some kind of stiches closure (do not know the exact method description) After that I had a spiral scan showing no blebs on either sides. and therefore, did some diving up to 100 feet.
My qustions is: I still have some disconfort on the thorax whenever the humidity is hight or in some other situations, I understand that is common to anybody with my story and that it might be due to the parieto-viseral pleural scaring, but do you think it might indicate something? Do you think I am still at greater danger of recurrence?, would yo repeat on an yearly basis a ct scan?

I am a pediatrician, so, as a doctor, I find very hard to get serious attention from collegues. So your insight will be very much apreciated
 
Andres,

The best answer you're likely to get over the internet is to follow up with your cardiothoracic surgeon. Yours is a complex case, and to answer your question properly would require access to medical records including operative notes and radiologic results. Your surgeon is a colleague in the sense that you're both physicians, but your specialties are different and as such he/she should give you the same attention as any other patient.

Your risk of recurrence is always going to be higher than that of the general population. For that reason, any history of spontaneous pneumothorax, despite surgical correction, is an absolute contraindication to diving. Re annual CT scans: there's probably no reason to subject yourself to that much radiation but again, the cardiothoracic surgeon who performed your procedure is in a much better position to answer that question.

Best regards,
DDM
 
This is controversial, really, I live in a "no sea" city so I guess I am not very much willing to trust just the surgeon, although he is great, but may be lacking experience on this, this guidelines are any good? you are proposing differently to them
Pneumothorax and Diving
Thak you for any comments
 

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