Suggestion Splitting the BCD Forum

[Jarrett]

The BCD section has become consumed with discussion about BP/W's. It is to the point that you can't get advice on non BP/W questions there anymore. Any request for information about non-BP/W BCDs is met with 10 responses of "you should get a BP/W."

Most of the non-BP/W users have quit posting in that forum due to the beating that they take when they mention anything but a BP/W. While the BP/W may be a great option for some, the majority of divers out there are not in BP/W setups and still need advice there as well.

My suggestion is to split this forum.

How about subsections like:

Traditional BCDs (Jacket/Back-inflate)
Backplates & Wings

That way posters interested in each could inquire and receive non combative discussions on each type of platform. I believe this would also bring more traditional BCD owners back to the forum for discussions who may otherwise be reluctant to post these days due to the current bias.

 

[H2Andy]

Bottom line is if your a jacket bc diver, post about it - be as enthusiastic as bp/wing divers are

exactly ... don't try to silence the other side

join the debate

 

[pakman]

can I ask for a separate split fin forum vs paddle fin/ jetfins...

 

[ScubaRev]

A split of the forums would be a huge mistake, in my opinion. I first learned about the bp/w configuration by browsing the bc forum. I never heard of such a thing before, nor was I exposed to it in OW training. I wound up purchasing a bp/w for my first rig as a result.

What makes the SB forums so helpful at all levels of diving is the open, and often edgy, discussion. It's no different than any vigorous discussion among people who are passionate about the topic. The handful of generic "get a bp/w" responses are nothing more than background noise, and easily ignored (or not), in my opinion. (I personally think they're funny, in a silly way.)

There is a law about laws worth noting here - The Law of Unintended Consequences. Often when we enact a law, we unintentionally achieve the opposite of what was intended. Happens all the time in public policy. In this case, I fear the loss of an open forum on BCs (regardless of their configuration), will ultimately hurt the discussion and the accumulated knowledge base of this forum, and it will only drive the discussion into separate tribal groups. No fun in that at all. And no learning.

 

[Mafiaman]

I am not getting the association with DIR and bp's/wings. Sure they "were" the "techy" thing but they are more mainstream today. OW classes are now being offered in bp/wings.

Steve

I read this and heard other similar statements, And I just don't see the popularity you claim. Working on dive boats in the Keys I've seen a thousand recreational divers divers, But I've only seen two buddy's with wings and they were diving DIR set ups.

Just my truthful observation.

There is a law about laws worth noting here - The Law of Unintended Consequences. Often when we enact a law, we unintentionally achieve the opposite of what was intended. Happens all the time in public policy. In this case, I fear the loss of an open forum on BCs (regardless of their configuration), will ultimately hurt the discussion and the accumulated knowledge base of this forum, and it will only drive the discussion into separate tribal groups. No fun in that at all. And no learning.

In other words without badgering the forum traffic will drop? Hence having an adverse effect on the amount of posts.

 

[Doubles]

I read this and heard other similar statements, And I just don't see the popularity you claim. Working on dive boats in the Keys I've seen a thousand recreational divers divers, But I've only seen two buddy's with wings and they were diving DIR set ups.

Point taken

I dive at 40 fathom a few times a year for practice and have yet to see a DIR diver there. Mostly us HOG types. In fact I dove for almost 4 years before I saw my first DIR diver. I have only ever seen 2 DIR divers out on a dive boat. Doesn't mean they dont exist and the fact that you have not seen recreational divers with bp/wings doesn't mean they aren't out there.

I do know they are used in OW training today. If some instructors are finding them userful, you will see more in the future .

And my comment about them being more mainstream today was not meant to say that they were overtaking jacket bc's. Just that non-technical divers are starting to find them as an attractive alternative.

Cheers

 

[MSilvia]

Working on dive boats in the Keys I've seen a thousand recreational divers divers, But I've only seen two buddy's with wings and they were diving DIR set ups.

I think the popularity is regional. When I dive on vacation in warm (by which I mean "warmer than 60 degrees") water, I rarely see them, in fact, it's only fairly recently that I've started seeing back inflate BCs there. By contrast, here at home I'd say roughly a third of the setups I see on non-tech wreck charters are BP/W, and I understand they're also popular in the PNW. My guess is that when you're accustomed to diving in a drysuit or in 7mm neoprene with a 36 lb weight belt, the advantages of a BP for recreational dives are a lot clearer than they are when diving a 3mm skin in 80 degree open water, where pretty much anything decent you decide to use will be just fine.

Not that any of that has much relevance to the discussion about forums.

 

[ScubaRev]

In other words without badgering the forum traffic will drop? Hence having an adverse effect on the amount of posts.

Actually, a bit of constructive badgering from the moderators in the form of a warning (the equivalent of soccer's yellow card) or a friendly PM might go a long way. In a discussion where a vocal few are drowning out the silent many, you don't necessarily send the few off to a room by themselves. For me, personal discipline regarding posts would be preferable to enforced segregation.

I guess the issue is how intrusive the moderators want to be, and whether the forum participants are able to exercise a bit of self-discipline in the content of their posts.

 

[*Floater*]

I read this and heard other similar statements, And I just don't see the popularity you claim. Working on dive boats in the Keys I've seen a thousand recreational divers divers, But I've only seen two buddy's with wings and they were diving DIR set ups.

Just my truthful observation.

The reason, I believe, that they aren't "popular" is because most divers don't know about them, and that's also why I often mention them to new divers looking for advice about BCD's.

However, I saw a fair number of backplates and wings in the Philippines, even among rec divers. Some of the rec DM's had them in Egypt. And in Mexico all the cave guys had them, but I also saw a few transpacs with travel wings on the rec boat in Coz, plus one of the DM's seemed very interested in my bp/w rig and asked about the cost and brand, etc. The bottom line is that very few people who dive them decide to go back to a jacket or "regular" back-inflate BCD.

 

[Boogie711]

My only exposure to a backplate was on Scubaboard. As a newly certified diver, I would have never thought about different options that are out there.

I am intelligent enough to sort out for myself who's got valid opinions, and who's spouting for the sake of spouting. To relegate a separate BP/Wing section would be doing a huge disservice to divers searching for information. After all, you don't know what you don't know.

To split the forum just to avoid hurting the feelings of some jacket users is the same sort of logic that says we can't have any Christmas Trees or Holiday decorations of any kind, in any public space, to avoid offending anyone.

Leave the BC forum the way it is - future divers will thank you for exposing them to different options.

 

[Jarrett]

When I look the forum I see this:

Technical Diving Specialties
Advanced and focused aspects of scuba diving with a technical or advanced training edge.
Sub-Forums: DIR, Wreck Diving, Cave Diving, Public Safety Divers, Hogarthian Diving, Solo Divers, Tek Trip Reports, Divers with Disabilities

If I was looking into tech diving, I would look in each of these sub forums to get the information I wanted. Find out the differences of each and follow a path that suited me.

Then:

Accessories
This is the place to get the scoop on all those nifty gadgets, gizmos and accessories that go along with diving.
Sub-Forums: Gear Bags & Cases, Knives & Cutting Tools, Lift Bags & SMB's, Lights

If I was looking for a new gadget but wasn't sure what to get, I would look in each of these sub forums to get the information I wanted. Based on what I read, I would get the gadget that best suited me.

Now let's say I'm looking for a BCD and I see this:

Buoyancy Compensators (BC's) & Weight Systems
Point your weighty "BC" questions and input here. Tell others what you use and what you do and don't like about it etc...
Sub-Forums: Jacket & Back-inflate BCDs, Backplate & Wings

In this case, would I only look at one sub forum to find the information I need? No, I would again look in each forum, and find the solution that best suited me.

In the other cases above sub forums have worked very well. Why would it be any different in this situation?