Spare air VS pony? Why?

[Charlie99]

String once bubbled...
I cant see why anyone would pay more money for a vastly inferior solution.

An inferior solution that is with you, is superior to the superior solution that is left behind because it is too bulky and cumbersome.

The same argument you use with the spare air, has been used to question why anyone would consider any pony instead of just getting a nice isolator manifold and a set of doubles. All ponies, including the mini-micro version called Spare Air are kind of in between solutions ---- more redundancy than a single tank, less than a real set of doubles.

Charlie

 

[String]

When compared to the bulk of your main cylinder and rest of dive gear the pony is insignificant. It can be stowed either side sling or attached to the main cylinder where its totally unnoticable during a dive.

The twin set argument doesnt hold true due to cost factors and the extra training required to use them.

Pony and Spare Air are about the same price. One might not get you to the surface and will probably bend you. The other stands a higher chance of getting you up with no deco obligation skipped.

Spare air from any real depth to get to the surface would require an effective CESA and an ascent rate in the order of 4-5x the table/profile recommended maximum AND no safety or deco stop. That isnt safe - it doesnt solve the problem fully.

 

[ScubaRon]

The discussion in this thread has turned into Spare Air bashing which IMO is not justified. Of course more air is better and twin tanks would be a lot safer than a single tank with a pony. Triple tanks would be even better...

But in some cases pony bottles just aren't very practical, especially when doing air travel. Between the weight, bulk and need for visual inspection I wouldn't think of taking a pony in a plane on a business trip with a day of diving added. But the spare air is easy to travel with, so that's what I take. The alternative is to have no redundant air source.

IMO the most important part is to be ready to use it wisely: mount it so you can get to it instantly and blindly...and practise doing this! If your primary air source stops completely: grab your spare air and start ascending at a fast, but safe rate. There is no time for troubleshooting, but there should be sufficient air to get you to the surface from about 100 feet. At 15 feet, if you still have air, breath it dry as a safety stop, then head for the surface. As you ascend you could try your primary again (a freeze-up may resolve itself as you ascend in warmer water).

Personally I think this gives you a dramatically bigger chance of survival than not having a redundant air supply at all.
ScubaRon

 

[jonnythan]

ScubaRon once bubbled...
But in some cases pony bottles just aren't very practical, especially when doing air travel. Between the weight, bulk and need for visual inspection I wouldn't think of taking a pony in a plane on a business trip with a day of diving added. But the spare air is easy to travel with, so that's what I take.

Except for the fact that you're not allowed to travel with a compressed gas bottle, even if it is a Spare Air.

 

[hambleto]

Can you remove the valve/stem/regulator from a spare air as you can a pony?

 

[spthomas]

Ok, so a SpareAir is underpowered, but small and neat.

Pony has the air we need, but it bulkier and difficult.

Both are relatively the same price.

SOO, Is there something out there that has it all? Is there a Pony setup that is smaller and/or more compact, neater, more streamlined, and just easier to carry than others?

Seems like that's the answer we seek. And I thought I saw something avertised in one of the mags last month that promised something like that, but I don't remember.

=Steve=

 

[DeepScuba]

4 pages of posts, and not mentioned at all.

What's right there beside you in an OOA emergency?

Your buddy. He's free, and odds are good you know him, and have dove with him before enough to trust him to be observant.

A better plan than a CESA 99 times out of 100.

Now, if you're solo, Scare-Air isn't an issue, as you already have a redundant system (Don't you?).

If you're away on vacation with an unknown buddy?? You'd better get acquainted real quick!

 

[hambleto]

The origional intention of this thread was to explain why someone would pick a spare air over a pony bottle or vise versa. I agree completly that a good buddy is always the best idea. There have been many points brought up from this thread both for and against the spare air system as well as a pony bottle. Thank you all for your input, opinions, facts, ideas, and time in general. I now know I can make a better more informed decision.
Ben

 

[String]

DeepScuba once bubbled...
4 pages of posts, and not mentioned at all.

What's right there beside you in an OOA emergency?

Your buddy. He's free, and odds are good you know him, and have dove with him before enough to trust him to be observant.

A better plan than a CESA 99 times out of 100.

Now, if you're solo, Scare-Air isn't an issue, as you already have a redundant system (Don't you?).

If you're away on vacation with an unknown buddy?? You'd better get acquainted real quick!

That should really read- what should NORMALLY be there in an OOA emergency. You cant bet your life on a buddy being immediately available. At least, if you did, youd be foolish.
In strong currents and low visibility buddy separation happens if not often but fairly commonly. Even with agreed protocols for dealing with it (normally circular search for 60 seconds then surfacing) arent perfect, what if you experience a massive freeflow during that 60 seconds ? What if you get caught on monofilament during that 60 seconds and need time to get out ?
You have to accept buddy separation does happen and always will happen and have to assume murpheys law in that if anything else can go wrong at the worst possible time it will.

Before anyway says its so unlikely it wont happen - it can. I know of one incident in the last month where after separation on surfacing a persons octopus freeflowed losing him 160 bar of air in less than a minute. He ran out at 4m but surfaced safely.

As well as that abroad in clear vis ive seen buddys diving some 30-40ft apart. Id like to see them cover that distance and get help in one breath of air.

Carrying a redundant air source like that copes with the above problems and when added to a buddy increases the safety margin even more.

 

[Burner]

The only time I've seen spare air used in what I thought was a good idea was when we hired some divers to reattach the anchor to our water pump. We had tried many times unsuccesfully to do it free diving, we basically needed an extra minute of bottom time to get it in place and tie it off. The divers evaluated it and one of them went down with spare air and got it taken care of. It was in 10 feet of water, and it seemed like the trade off of using spare air rather then completely suiting up for a 2 minute dive was justified.