Solo... novice training?

[Ursus]

CarJack97...I am in a similar mental quandary. Although I am confident and comfortable in the water, I haven't logged the number of dives that give me the experience that I need. I would be in the water everyday if I could. Also, I haven't found a partner that is focused and would approach the dive with the same mental preparation. My interest in Solo is not based on any misconception that I am a superhero or as a result of me being anti-social. My work and family obligations make it challenging to line up with another diver's schedule. I plan to take the SSI course perhaps next year.

Having the right equipment can't substitute for experience. By the end of it you will have redundant equipment in case of emergency...begins sounding like Tech Training doesn't it? You might consider doing some advanced training in the Tech area, such as Double Tank and Deep Diving. They will cover the equipment and gear setup that you will most likely need for Solo. At the same time you will get some exposure to some new people who may have similar minded people.

Edward

 

[Jim Lapenta]

I used to worry about those looks. Now it does not faze me at all. It only gets to be an issue when diving from a boat. There are some boats that don't care once you've shown some competency. There are others where you need to get creative and say I'm diving with those guys over there and point in a general direction. Shore dives I just ignore them or say my buddy pissed me off. So I'm going back in to untie him from that log I chained him to. I thinks he's learned his lesson by now, it's been two hours!

But as others have said if you sre looking to build confidence solo is not the way to do it. I'll do any dive solo at this point I'd do with a buddy. But I also know what dives I'd do, where, when, and in what conditions. I looked into a solo course near me from the only instructor I could find who currently supposedly teaches it. I was told yeah I quailified for the training which was some classroom and I think two dives but I needed to have a buddy to take it with me! Or there had to be another person to take the class!

How friggin stupid is that? I was willing to pay extra for his time and pay for his gas to the site. But the shop he teaches and books thru required two people to take the class. I guess he has to give them a cut. So now I just dive sites where I know they don't care if I'm alone or I'll look for someone to hook up with that is of the same mindset I am. Same ocean, lake, quarry, etc meet at such and such time to exit and don't worry about it.

I'd like to see the course outline beforehand anyway. I have Von Maiers book and find it boring, extremely lacking in details and full of more opinion than actual solid practices. It is also outdated and lost all credibility with me by saying a spare air is an acceptable redundant air source. I'd never use less than manifolded doubles, a stage, or pony. When we talk solo diving my basic tenet is standard Hogarthian principles. If you don't need it don't take it. If you do take two. If in doubt, don't and accept that if the stuff hits the fan you may very well die alone. What else is there? All skills should have been learned in basic open water. They just need to be refined and polished to a very high degree. I'd still like to take the course to have the card for those places that might require it but don't tell me a buddy is necessary to get a solo cert.

Steve,any idea where I can find an instructor who offers it close to me. I have more than the 100 dives necessary to start I think. In fact I've got over 50 logged solo to max depths of 127 feet and in water as cold as 38 degrees. Where do I sign up?

 

[Diveral]

On the other hand, if you determine that you *do* want to solo dive and that you are the type of person who can handle the requirements, now that you've practiced leading, you can try diving under the watchful eye but hands-(mostly)-off of another solo diver. Basically, it's almost like a solo dive with a safety diver right there. You do everything, but if you miss something or head unknowingly toward an edge of the envelope, they can point it out immediately, as they've been there. Consider it a practical exam by an outside observer to see whether you really are where you believe yourself to be.

The most important thing about solo diving is not the dive skills or the practice or the experience. The *most* important thing about solo diving is learning to look through the assumptions (or outright lies) your own head provides until you can see what's behind them. Be wary of comfort and confidence, as they can as easily be from ignorance as from skill. You have to know where you *truly* are as a diver, and you have to have the self-control to draw the line and not cross it.

Solo diving is an advanced form of diving, and it is *absolutely* not for everyone. It requires skill, attention to detail, and even the right temperament to minimize the risks (which you must choose to respect and accept). If you want to head that direction, there is plenty of support and information available here, but if you just want to dive more, I'm pretty sure we can help there, too.

I really like the tone of this thread and the advice offered so far. I don't have a lot to add and I really liked Clayjar's response. As someone who's been soloing longer than most PADI specialties have existed, I believe solo diving is more of a journey or experience than a destination. Drop in on us over at the solo divers forum and check us out.

As far as experience and training goes I personally don't think you have enough. If you are seriously wanting to solo dive, I recommend you take a rescue diver course and consider taking a solo diver course when you are eligible. It's a good starting point and gives you some training and rules of thumb that took many of us years worth of trial and error to arrive at.

I like Clayjars suggestion of meeting other solo diving "mentors" at the quarry. Several of us dive there and many of us don't mind sharing our experience. I'll probably be diving Bluewater in May and wouldn't mind sharing some of what I've learned and discussing my particular solo diving philosophy over lunch or dinner.

AL

 

[eponym]

I've seen some good advice here for the OP. Would just reinforce the point that Solo training should be undertaken after your standard and advanced dive skills (like navigating in low viz) are solid and repeatedly tested. Have you read the sticky in the solo forum (you might have to ask to join)?

I think it was SSI that recently introduced a solo specialty.

SSI has an "Independent Diver" rating, but it's not a solo diving course. It's a holding pattern cert, issued to those who've finished the academic and pool portions of OWD but who don't want to do checkouts yet. It allows them to dive on their own in the pool they trained in, to the same depths (staying above 40' if the pool's deeper*), to keep their skills sharp until the outside water warms up enough to make it practical to do the checkout dives.

* This cert was created by an instructor who has access to Nemo33 (the Belgian pool that's 100 feet deep) so students could practice on their own until the local waters warm up in, oh, say, August.

-Bryan

PS.

I just ignore them or say my buddy pissed me off. So I'm going back in to untie him from that log I chained him to. I thinks he's learned his lesson by now, it's been two hours!

Good one, Jim.

 

[Steve SDI/TDI HQ]

Steve,any idea where I can find an instructor who offers it close to me. I have more than the 100 dives necessary to start I think. In fact I've got over 50 logged solo to max depths of 127 feet and in water as cold as 38 degrees. Where do I sign up?

Jim: a guy with your experience should be Teaching it! Hey, drop me an email with your preferred location and I'll see about getting you squared away. would love to run you through the program myself if I'm in your area sometime.

 

[drdaddy]

I'll start this by saying I feel a bit like a 16 year old asking for the car keys.
I am an AOW diver with <30 dives (Advanced...? Some of you have forgotten more about diving than I may ever know, and I love reading your posts). I firmly believe certifications beyond OW should be based on criteria other than check stroking.
ANYWAY... To the question.
I own all of my own gear and live less than a mile from a popular training quarry. What I am looking for is confidence under water (which I lack but really want). The problem I have is that when I do go to practice skills (alone) I am almost always met with disapproving looks by "pairs" of divers going down the hill to enter the water. I get the impression that I am being irresponsible in some way by diving without a buddy. Honestly, I feel irresponsible if I DONT do this (practice)... being so close and having the opportunity.
A goal of mine is a rescue certification, but know it is a waste until I have a solid grasp on skills and SEVERAL more dives logged. We are taught to ALWAYS dive with a buddy. Am I being irresponsible by not diving/ training with a buddy?

Thoughts from the TRULY advanced would be appreciated.

CarJack -

Are you still here? After over 100 dives, I thought I was ready to solo. I had difficulty finding a good buddy or a buddy at all. I was encouraged by other solo/hunting divers to solo - no big deal. Well, for about 50 dives, it was no big deal. I carried that redundant air - 13 cuft pony for 50 ft and under, and 19 cuft for deeper. But as much as I had read and practiced, and experienced - I found myself in an place that I never want to be again. By God's intervention (heathens call it luck) - I survived. I am here today, and through much processing, consultation, and practice - I know how to handle that emergency - namely how to avoid ever getting into that situation. And I have furthered my diving education and experience beyond that experience.

I have a wife, grown children, grandchildren, and aging parents. My foolishness would have brought great grief and loss to both my family, as well as my patients (psychologist).

Will I solo dive again? Yes!!! And I will be fine - probably safer than my driving !!! But now I'm buddying - and mentoring my buddy - as a way of "teaching is the best way to learn" - reinforcing my solo skills.

So, wait on the solo diving. And about the time you think you "know it all" - find a mentor.

drdaddy

 

[mudhole]

When are your ready to solo dive, only when you're ready to risk your life for a cheap thrill. Can you get a "card" to solo dive, sure, you can buy a card saying you are an instructor, or a "card" that you can do anything. No card can protect you in the water. . . there are some cards that call you a dive master, the navy offers that, It takes about 20 years and mastery of every commercial and military skill. That means a lot.

Why does every meaningful dive training organization insist on a dive buddy? Because of the total experience of millions of dives vs. the hundreds of diving deaths, when there was no "buddy" to help even a little bit. Jacques Cousteau and some of his divers started diving alone because there was only one regulator. As soon as there was more than one, they quickly knew they risked death if diving alone. Read his book "Silent World."

When I had only had a thousand dives, I made a dive with a friend with more experience, and he asked if I dove alone. I told him I, like many of my friends. would dive if an experience diver was in the boat, but not if there was no one along. He experienced a dive where the visibility turned to zero while he was down by himself. . . enormous numbers of fish were thrashing around, blocking the sun. They were in an illegal net dragging the bottom. He was tangled, and when he attempted to cut free, his knife was knocked out of his hand. He struggled against the weights of the net to reach surface. . . His soon to be fiancee, didn't swim, but paddled their anchored boat with a ski and reached him and held his head above water. Fishermen heard her screams and helped cut my friend loose.

You will choose to do what you want, and giving you some idea of how conditions can go beyond your control, even by the criminal act of others, not to mention all the things mother nature can throw at you. There are conditions where a bad dive partner can put you in danger. . . you can back away. There are many more situations where a dive partner can clear an intanglement on your back, share his air, bring you up if pass out, and more. . .

I've made a 1000 logged dives and a couple thousand without a log. . . I've got good friends that have over 50000 dives, and the idea of diving alone is not a good one. When you have that kind of experience, you have lots of people who will dive with you just to learn from you.

A common trick among hunters is to separate and go opposite directions, then about a third of the way into a dive, go look for the other to see if the hunting is better where he is. Or he will join you if you have found the fish. You need a lot of skill, and experience at finding your partner under water. . . but that is what lots of experience will teach you.

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

When are your ready to solo dive, only when you're ready to risk your life for a cheap thrill. Can you get a "card" to solo dive, sure, you can buy a card saying you are an instructor, or a "card" that you can do anything. No card can protect you in the water. . . there are some cards that call you a dive master, the navy offers that, It takes about 20 years and mastery of every commercial and military skill. That means a lot.

Why does every meaningful dive training organization insist on a dive buddy? Because of the total experience of millions of dives vs. the hundreds of diving deaths, when there was no "buddy" to help even a little bit. Jacques Cousteau and some of his divers started diving alone because there was only one regulator. As soon as there was more than one, they quickly knew they risked death if diving alone. Read his book "Silent World."

When I had only had a thousand dives, I made a dive with a friend with more experience, and he asked if I dove alone. I told him I, like many of my friends. would dive if an experience diver was in the boat, but not if there was no one along. He experienced a dive where the visibility turned to zero while he was down by himself. . . enormous numbers of fish were thrashing around, blocking the sun. They were in an illegal net dragging the bottom. He was tangled, and when he attempted to cut free, his knife was knocked out of his hand. He struggled against the weights of the net to reach surface. . . His soon to be fiancee, didn't swim, but paddled their anchored boat with a ski and reached him and held his head above water. Fishermen heard her screams and helped cut my friend loose.

You will choose to do what you want, and giving you some idea of how conditions can go beyond your control, even by the criminal act of others, not to mention all the things mother nature can throw at you. There are conditions where a bad dive partner can put you in danger. . . you can back away. There are many more situations where a dive partner can clear an intanglement on your back, share his air, bring you up if pass out, and more. . .

I've made a 1000 logged dives and a couple thousand without a log. . . I've got good friends that have over 50000 dives, and the idea of diving alone is not a good one. When you have that kind of experience, you have lots of people who will dive with you just to learn from you.

A common trick among hunters is to separate and go opposite directions, then about a third of the way into a dive, go look for the other to see if the hunting is better where he is. Or he will join you if you have found the fish. You need a lot of skill, and experience at finding your partner under water. . . but that is what lots of experience will teach you.

I can't agree with hardly any of that ... you're welcome to believe it if you like, but I don't. Then again, I enjoy solo diving ... had some of my best photo dives soloing.

I don't do it for a cheap thrill ... in fact, I'm probably one of the most cautiously conservative divers you're ever likely to meet. But whether I'm diving solo or with a team of highly experienced and familiar dive buddies, I make it a point to consider the potential risks and prepare myself to deal with as many of them as possible. One must, or course, always consider that there is no way to prepare for ALL possible contingencies.

On the other hand, I'm a dive instructor. And as an instructor I often dive with very inexperienced divers who require a considerable amount of my mental bandwidth while underwater. From a pure risk analysis perspective, I'm far more at risk of an accident when diving with those people than I am when I'm alone ... and able to devote my total attention to what I'm doing.

... and I seriously doubt you have a good many friends with 50000 dives ... in order to achieve that level you'd need to log 1,000 dives a year for 50 years and I don't think that's even possible ... so perhaps that was a typo.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[SelkieDVM]

I've got good friends that have over 50000 dives.

Seriously? If one did three dives a day every single day of the year for like 46 years strait... and you have more than one friend that's done this? Wow... simply wow.

 

[seaducer]

I'll start this by saying I feel a bit like a 16 year old asking for the car keys.
.

My gut reaction to these types of questions is usually no. If you have to ask, then you are not ready to dive alone, because if you know deep down inside that you have the skills and ability to deal with issues, then you don't need nor do you seek approval from others.

But it is up to you. You need to check with the property owner and any laws governing diving there, you may be violating some rule.