solo diver is better?

[H2Andy]

She is alive today because her buddy took her to the surface.

amazingly, she has left the hospital and is at home (has been
for a couple of months).

she has a long way to go, but that she's breathing on her own and moving
around on her own alone is nothing short of a miracle

 

[AndyNZ]

I think the key here is a true solo diver (which I read as a good solo diver) I have done complete dive's with no mask on, I also practice getting on and off all my gear even in a confined space. There are lots of other skill I believe a true solo dive should have but that is another thread, I will admit there are lots of people solo diving that should not be or for that matter should not be buddy diving.

Too true! But without practising those skills, the "solo" diver is no more prepared than anyone else.... where as a buddy diver who has practiced for situations will be more able to respond than a "bad" solo diver.

Would be interesting to see the differences (if any) of the skills that should be practiced for both the good solo and the good buddy diver.... but like you say, probably a different thread...

 

[all4scuba05]

There's also the fact that a solo diver that screws up underwater could end up killing HIMSELF. A buddy diver that screws things up could end up killing HIS BUDDY AND HIMSELF. LOL

 

[Soggy]

There's also the fact that a solo diver that screws up underwater could end up killing HIMSELF. A buddy diver that screws things up could end up killing HIS BUDDY AND HIMSELF. LOL

That's an incredibly weak and fallacious argument. It's like chosing not to wear your seatbelt because of that one guy in a thousand that died because he wore his.

 

[H2Andy]

i don't know... a team is as strong as its weakest link

if you dive with Horrible Diver, he can get you killed

you'd be safer by yourself

 

[all4scuba05]

sorry SOGGY...bad joke there

 

[rockjock3]

Obviously the consequence to a tox hit or blackout while diving is drowning. How do you know there is a "very good chance" the diver will recover? Do you have information on numerous examples of a full tox hit or blackout where the diver was good to go after a buddy rescue?

I would be pleased if this were the case and it would change my thinking a bit. The reality is, from my understanding of anecdotal stories, that you're a gonner if it happens and there is nothing a buddy can do. An earlier poster asked to see evidence of two cases and we have not collectively produced it. I'm not talking about a buddy getting woozy after a few hits off high 02 and a buddy intervenes to correct the gas switch - this thread was about a full blackout and the chances of recovery with or without a buddy.

--Matt

Well, if you understand the consequence of a TOX hit or blackout is most likely drowning then you understand the recoverability of it then. We have near drownings all the time. Also if you read your rescue diver manual or your nitrox manual it will tell you exactly what I said about recovery. I also searched diving sites around the web for information and they all said the same thing. That if they are brought to the surface that they have a good chance at recovery.

You have to look at the situation for what it is, not what you think you see. A TOXing diver doesn't have to recover from a TOX hit because that is not what kills them. The drowning is what kills them.. People are rescued from drowning all the time, but if nobody is there to act on your rescue then you will not survive.

Your chances of recovering from a drowning caused by a TOX hit or blackout are the same as your chances of recovering from a drowning because you hit your head on a rock underwater or blacked out due to any other reason that can cause people to drown. Obviously there are things such as stroke and heart attacks that might cause a drowning and not be recoverable from often.

Here are some stats from a couple of medical pages.

6000-8000 drownings in the U.S. each year
15,000-70,000 near drownings in the U.S. each year.
That translates to a 71-89% survival rate for any drowning victim.

Now, since you don't die from the TOX hit or the blackout (meaning you don't have to recover from the hit) you die from the drowning (this is the only thing you have to recover from) that 71-89% chance of living if somebody is there to rescue me seems like a "very good chance" to me.

 

[pusser]

Well, if you understand the consequence of a TOX hit or blackout is most likely drowning then you understand the recoverability of it then. We have near drownings all the time.

Yes but it's quite a leap of logic to say tox incidents and drownings are synonamous and therefore survivable. Yes all tox deaths are drownings and many drownings are survivable but to suggest toxing is usually survivable is is false. Most toxed divers have not survived no matter what they taught you on your rescue course.

 

[lamont]

Yes but it's quite a leap of logic to say tox incidents and drownings are synonamous and therefore survivable. Yes all tox deaths are drownings and many drownings are survivable but to suggest toxing is usually survivable is is false. Most toxed divers have not survived no matter what they taught you on your rescue course.

toxing and drowning are not synonymous. when a diver toxes, they are probably not drowning yet, their airway is going to be closed. once they spit out their reg, stop convulsing and try to take their first breath, then they are drowning. if the toxing diver is not alone and is part of a team which is together enough to notice the tox when it happens, then they have a fighting chance at least and there have been a few saves that prevented the drowning. i don't know of anyone who has convulsed at depth while solo and lived to tell about it...

 

[rockjock3]

Yes but it's quite a leap of logic to say tox incidents and drownings are synonamous and therefore survivable. Yes all tox deaths are drownings and many drownings are survivable but to suggest toxing is usually survivable is is false. Most toxed divers have not survived no matter what they taught you on your rescue course.

If I put you in a chamber and put you in an environment that you tox, then remove that environment (ie. bring you up, reduce the PPO2 on your system, then the symptoms reverse themselves. Toxing is not like drinking rat poison. This is not poisoning in the traditional sense. It is closer to NN as in when you remove the conditions surrounding it then the condtions will reverse. Toxing and having seizures DOESN'T kill you. If you were put into a tox seizure in a chamber you wouldn't die unless you snapped your spine or they left you there and didn't remove the stimuli.

Fact is that if another diver see you toxing and takes the appropriate actions then it is very survivable. If you re solo diving and you start toxing then you are DEAD. No passing go, no 71-89% chance at survival, 0% chance period end of sentence.

I am not trying to say solo divers are better or worse. There are cases of both and it totally depends on the individual and the conditions.

This is simply a response to somebody asking earler "is there really any situation that a buddy could rescue you from that you couldn't rescue yourself from". The answer is yes and toxing is one situation that you CANNOT rescue yourself from.