Sling tank or doubles.

[kanonfodr]

Well...I dive a "Tech"-ish setup even on my normal single-tank shore dives. I'll explain:

For doubles you will most likely want a Backplate/Wing BCD, something like this. Don't fret, they aren't all that expensive . The good news is that, by swapping the wing and, depending on your configuration, adding a Single Tank Adapter you can use the exact same setup for your regular single-tank diving.

Regulators: Well, it honestly becomes a pain in the rear swapping your regs between singles and doubles setups every weekend (or more often ) so I would honestly recommend getting a set of regulators specific to doubles when you are able to, but in the meantime you can just convert your current regulator to DIN and simply purchase another DIN 1st stage and swap back and forth as needed until you can purchase another regulator set and have dedicated regs for your configurations.

Training: I would honestly invest in either a good mentor who is diving doubles regularly or paying a technical instructor to help you become proficient with both your BP/W and doubles, as there is a bit of difference between doubles and singles, trim and stability-wise. A knowledgeable instructor or mentor can also teach you the valve drill, where you will learn to manipulate your valves underwater in case of failure. It's not really necessary to know the valve drill (in which case you are in effect diving one big tank) but being able to shut down my valves and solve a problem underwater has saved a dive before.

Hope this gives you a direction in which to look for more information.

Peace,
Greg

 

[Spazzy]

Many people choose to do deeper recreational dives with a stage/pony for some redundancy before moving on to doubles/sidemounts/rebreathers.

 

[TSandM]

If your profile is accurate, and you have under 50 dives, and you're gas limited on your dives, I'd suggest just buying a larger single tank. I'd also suggest taking GUE Fundamentals or an Intro to Tech class in a single tank setup, to work on buoyancy and trim, and work on some more efficient propulsion techniques. (You'll need those skills for technical diving in the long run, anyway, but if you can start building them now it will serve you very well.)

If you are worried about unreliable buddies* and feel the need for personal redundancy, but the majority of your diving is through surf or relatively shallow, slinging a 40 is pretty easy to do, and a 40 is going to be useful in your eventual technical diving, too. Playing around in the shallows with bottle handling and gas switching, when the gas in the slung tank is the same as your backgas, is a good way to learn to tolerate task-loading and build motor skills (but only if somebody is watching you, to give you feedback on poor trim or buoyancy issues, and to throw an OOA at you if you get so focused on what you are doing that you forget where they are ).

I really think people do better if they nail their diving skills in a single tank setup, before they cope with the balance challenges that come with doubles. (And I know at least two GUE instructors who totally agree with me on this.)

If you are really serious about getting into technical diving, I can almost guarantee you that you will end up with a lot of equipment . . . maybe some single tanks for shore diving, doubles for deeper or boat dives, and even another set of doubles, because you don't want the ones you dive regularly to end up full of trimix you don't want to waste on a shallower dive. (I have personal experience with these issues!) So optimize the gear you have for the diving you are now doing, and just accept that you are going to have to buy other tanks and more regulators in the long run.

* The solution to this problem is reliable buddies -- see the recommendation for the Fundies class

 

[DaleC]

If you buy a DIN yoke converter you can still use a yoked 1st stage on a DIN valve in the short term.

My progression has been:

1. Al80 (single)

2. Al80 + slung pony

3. Twin Al80's (independant doubles)

4. Twin St72's

4. Twin St72's + Al40 (slung)

4. St72 (single) + Al80 or Al40 or Al19 (slung)

I like smaller steel tanks (works for me) and can do the majority of my diving with 3 St72's, 1 Al80, 1 Al40 and 1 Al19 (recreational pony).

 

[franny]

Is your profile accurate? How many dives do you have?

As of today, I believe the count is 47, so the dive count is accurate. Was going to update the training part of the profile after I hit 50 dives.

Regulators: Well, it honestly becomes a pain in the rear swapping your regs between singles and doubles setups every weekend (or more often ) so I would honestly recommend getting a set of regulators specific to doubles when you are able to, but in the meantime you can just convert your current regulator to DIN and simply purchase another DIN 1st stage and swap back and forth as needed until you can purchase another regulator set and have dedicated regs for your configurations.

One of the things I was thinking about doing is using the Din regs for my main tank, and then using the existing yoke set for the pony. Changing the first stage would be another option.

Training: I would honestly invest in either a good mentor who is diving doubles regularly or paying a technical instructor to help you become proficient with both your BP/W and doubles, as there is a bit of difference between doubles and singles, trim and stability-wise. A knowledgeable instructor or mentor can also teach you the valve drill, where you will learn to manipulate your valves underwater in case of failure. It's not really necessary to know the valve drill (in which case you are in effect diving one big tank) but being able to shut down my valves and solve a problem underwater has saved a dive before.

Hope this gives you a direction in which to look for more information.

Peace,
Greg

That training will come, but again it will be the budget thing (got to get it past the minister of war and finance ). Definately want to get some proper training, but trying to do it in a cost effective manner so I don't jump too far too fast. I know there are a lot of extra challenges with doubles, which is why I was one of the cautious about going doubles.

If your profile is accurate, and you have under 50 dives, and you're gas limited on your dives, I'd suggest just buying a larger single tank. I'd also suggest taking GUE Fundamentals or an Intro to Tech class in a single tank setup, to work on buoyancy and trim, and work on some more efficient propulsion techniques. (You'll need those skills for technical diving in the long run, anyway, but if you can start building them now it will serve you very well.)

Would love to buy a bigger tank, but that would be an expensive side line. Most of the tanks I hire are 12L steels (100cf). From what I know the next size up is 15L (125cf). The plan is to end up with double 12L, because it seems that a lot of doubles are double 12's here. So buying a 12L tank initially will save hassles when it comes time to pair it.

If you are worried about unreliable buddies* and feel the need for personal redundancy, but the majority of your diving is through surf or relatively shallow, slinging a 40 is pretty easy to do, and a 40 is going to be useful in your eventual technical diving, too. Playing around in the shallows with bottle handling and gas switching, when the gas in the slung tank is the same as your backgas, is a good way to learn to tolerate task-loading and build motor skills (but only if somebody is watching you, to give you feedback on poor trim or buoyancy issues, and to throw an OOA at you if you get so focused on what you are doing that you forget where they are ).

I have one buddy i have a couple of concerns with, but he doesn't dive much. Most of the people i dive with I don't need to worry about that way. The biggest issue is for the boat dives either getting a longer bottom time for when I am diving with someone who either has a better SAC, or has a bigger air supply.

Definately thinking about the al40. That is a definate option from what I can see. I have had the opportunity to try a hang tank during training before, so hopefully it won't be a massive jump. I will do some practice prior to using it in anger of course, that is one of the advantages of shore diving.

I really think people do better if they nail their diving skills in a single tank setup, before they cope with the balance challenges that come with doubles. (And I know at least two GUE instructors who totally agree with me on this.)

If you are really serious about getting into technical diving, I can almost guarantee you that you will end up with a lot of equipment . . . maybe some single tanks for shore diving, doubles for deeper or boat dives, and even another set of doubles, because you don't want the ones you dive regularly to end up full of trimix you don't want to waste on a shallower dive. (I have personal experience with these issues!) So optimize the gear you have for the diving you are now doing, and just accept that you are going to have to buy other tanks and more regulators in the long run.

* The solution to this problem is reliable buddies -- see the recommendation for the Fundies class

I agree you have to get the current setup right first, and I will go down the path of something like fundies in a while. It's just before I do, I want to build the experience, and keep utilising the skills I already have.

I know I will end up with a lot of equipment. My idea was to try to work out the best path, so I minimise the amount of extraneous equipment I end up with and to also buy the equipment as efficiently as possible to minimise the cost. I have to work out the limit, and I don't want to hit it too quickly, so I will take my time for the next step and work it out as i go.

Thank you for the information so far, it has been very useful.

 

[packeteer]

i'm exactly the same as the OP. About 40 dives in and I'm riding the treadmill to tek

I've got 2 sets of regs (DIN and Yoke), 2 x Faber 12's and a single Al 40cf. ie. i have all the kit. Now I'm just doing lots of diving (usually with a single 12 and 40 pony).

 

[Dave Earl]

The biggest issue is for the boat dives either getting a longer bottom time for when I am diving with someone who either has a better SAC, or has a bigger air supply.

I don't want to sound offensive or anything, but if you've really only got 50 dives under your belt then the best way to improve your SAC is just to do some move dives.

I remember when I had 50 dives- I would always use far more air than anyone I dived with, and would get flustered and embarrassed everytime I had to cut my buddy's dive short. 50 dives after that I had a really good air consumption, and another 50 after that and I used less air than the majority of people.

Tec setups are fine, but, TBH, you may be better off just diving more with the gear you have, rather than spending a fortune on Techy setups you probably don't really need immediately because you're concerned about your SAC.

 

[KY]

Given you are a frequent shore diver, unless you can have a seperate single setup it's going to be a PITA to dive twins all the time because they are very shallow sites locally. But then I am one of those people who prefers to only dive twins when I have to so I guess if you are big and strong maybe you won't mind

If you can afford both setups, get twins and use that for the deeper diving. That's what I've done. Though before I had twins I used to borrow ponies off people to use when doing dives to about 40m. So far I haven't had to by my own pony/stage/deco bottle as have had them on long term loan. I prefer to dive with twins for extra gas rather than a pony, and I can also do two longer recreational dives on twins than two single tanks (as the 35bar reserve from first dive adds to dive 2's gas), and it's just less hassle for double dives.

If you would have to switch your single stuff as part of the twinset, maybe just buy a pony. I have heard people argue that ponies aren't that much cheaper but for comparison I can get:

AL40+reg+spg = $700 (new, midrange stuff)
my 12L twinset = $3000 (new, midrange stuff)

Also you need to factor in the ongoing costs such as hydros ($80/yr for twins, $40/yr for pony).

I suggest asking around and getting loans of different types of twins to try out, and different ponies and see what you like best. If you are heading towards tech diving, you'll eventually end up with it all anyway

You know what??? Sas is absolutly spot on... agree with what she says, but have to add, theres always a 3rd option, and thats going and getting a twin pillar valve on a 15L.. !?

 

[franny]

I don't want to sound offensive or anything, but if you've really only got 50 dives under your belt then the best way to improve your SAC is just to do some move dives.

I remember when I had 50 dives- I would always use far more air than anyone I dived with, and would get flustered and embarrassed everytime I had to cut my buddy's dive short. 50 dives after that I had a really good air consumption, and another 50 after that and I used less air than the majority of people.

Tec setups are fine, but, TBH, you may be better off just diving more with the gear you have, rather than spending a fortune on Techy setups you probably don't really need immediately because you're concerned about your SAC.

You are not being offensive and to an extent you are right. I need more time diving to decrease my SAC (I calculated it at around .6 a while ago). That said, an extra 40cf of air both means I can spend a decent time on the deeper dives. That is for two reasons -

1. It gives me more time underwater to get used to diving and spend time breathing
2. It makes the most of the dives I am doing which makes it more cost effective to do a dive (especially when the boat dives are a 2 hour trip each way)

It is also about planning the longer term to maximise the efficiency of what I buy. If I can buy something now, that can be used more later, then so much the better.

 

[Sas]

0.6 is pretty reasonable.

And I think some people are probably missing the redundancy aspect. A lot of the dives you can do with OW and AOW, a pony wouldn't hurt!