sidemount rescue techniques ...

[Jax]

Would it be more practical to just focus on getting the tanks off, at least initially? I can't think of any reason to try getting me out of my Razor in the initial stages of a rescue, and if you needed to, a couple of swipes with the Eazy Cut on my shoulder strap would do the trick.

The idea is to get the diver to the top as safely and quickly as possible. If you cut the tanks off, you have a very good chance to do an uncontrolled ascent with both of you. That wing holds a lot of air. Once on the surface, as soon as I was flipped on my back, I was stable. I don't think you should waste time with the tanks when you have a stable platform.

Anyone?

 

[irishsquid]

...I can't think of any reason to try getting me out of my Razor in the initial stages of a rescue, and if you needed to, a couple of swipes with the Eazy Cut on my shoulder strap would do the trick.

I was going to post the same. My hybrid Razor/Hollis SMS100 is much like a BP/W "Hog rig". One waist buckle which releasing won't help much, and I promise if I'm in need of rescue; I won't complain at all if you cut mine into a dozen pieces and deep six it. I'll buy your drinks (many, many of them) when we return from recovering my gear at a later date.

 

[irishsquid]

The idea is to get the diver to the top as safely and quickly as possible. If you cut the tanks off, you have a very good chance to do an uncontrolled ascent with both of you. That wing holds a lot of air. Once on the surface, as soon as I was flipped on my back, I was stable. I don't think you should waste time with the tanks when you have a stable platform.

Anyone?

Hmmm... I may have misinterpreted/understood RGM. I was thinking in terms of gear dump after getting to the surface to maintain face up buoyancy. Underwater, face up/down wouldn't matter.

 

[Jax]

Hmmm... I may have misinterpreted/understood RGM. I was thinking in terms of gear dump after getting to the surface to maintain face up buoyancy. Underwater, face up/down wouldn't matter.

Perhaps I misstated. A properly balanced Nomad XT is very, very stable. Flip me on my back, and I maintain face up buoyancy. Unclip the chest,, the shoulders, undo the waist crotch, and cut the bungee hold lines, I still lay stable on my back. Drag me into the boat from there. The tanks act as ballast, at least in my case. No roll-over affect, no worry of my head going under. Now, if you have to swim a long way, you might make a different decision.

 

[irishsquid]

Perhaps I misstated. A properly balanced Nomad XT is very, very stable. Flip me on my back, and I maintain face up buoyancy. Unclip the chest,, the shoulders, undo the waist crotch, and cut the bungee hold lines, I still lay stable on my back. Drag me into the boat from there. The tanks act as ballast, at least in my case. No roll-over affect, no worry of my head going under. Now, if you have to swim a long way, you might make a different decision.

Yeah, a lot of different considerations. If I'm on my back I will remain that way and stable. If vertical and motionless then I go face down. It doesn't take much effort to get on my back and I think it wouldn't take much to get me thay way if I was incapacitated. Now if I was negative with a wing failure, incapacitated, then again, cut me loose.
Good thread!

 

[Dive-aholic]

Possibly a REC standardization for OW is in order to help with the Rescue issues.
Just tossing these ideas out there!
Now that PADI is on the scene I am sure that they are working on it even now.
I am not trying to pick a fight but just saying!

What's the point? None of the recreational BCDs are standardized. They have different clips on the shoulder straps. Some have cumberbunds, others don't. Some have chest straps, others don't. Standardizing SM rigs isn't going to make a difference. Learn your buddy's rig before getting in the water. That's the only thing that will help. But even if you don't, the steps are the same. If all else fails, cut it off.

Would it be more practical to just focus on getting the tanks off, at least initially? I can't think of any reason to try getting me out of my Razor in the initial stages of a rescue, and if you needed to, a couple of swipes with the Eazy Cut on my shoulder strap would do the trick.

Good luck. It's easier to get my entire rig off than just my tanks. In addition to being connected to my rig with 2 bolt snaps each and the bungees, they are also connected to my dry suit and LP hose by inflator hoses. One 2nd stage is on a necklace around my neck, the other could be clipped to a d-ring.

I have always taught rescue courses either with backmounted doubles incorporated into them or sidemount. When I was first teaching rescue, I would stage a "mega" rescue in which I was in a set of doubles and my students had no real exposure to a diver in doubles. They managed to get me out of the rig. I've since staged the "mega" rescue in sidemount without giving them previous exposure to the rig and had a good rescue performed. My last rescue class my students were both in sidemount and had exposure to their own rigs (both Nomads), but had to rescue me in my Armadillo. They did just fine.

The techniques are the same. The steps are the same. They were able to get me out of my gear without any issues.

 

[DA Aquamaster]

Larry, I think you may have taken the wrong message from Jax's post. It's not inflating and deflating that was an issue for her. It was the location of the releases. This is interesting because most releases are located in the same place on all BCs. The issue I have found when I teach Rescue in sidemount is when people secure their inflator hose (coming off the bottom as was originally done with the Armadillo) to the chest strap. You undo the shoulder straps, but this will still require you to either cut the chest strap or pull the arm through the loop it forms. Same goes for bungees. They either need to be cut or the arms need to be pulled through. Simply undoing the clips on the shoulder straps (for those of you that have clips) will not be enough to allow the rig to fall away.

Rob, I wasn't referring to Jax, but rather to Spatman's posts number 8 and 20 ( and in general to a couple in between) where the ability to inflate, dump and control the ascent are the issues being discussed.

But you make excellent points about the later evolutions getting the diver out of his or her gear and out of the water. Clipping the inflator hose above the QD on the harness would add one more item that would have to be unclipped or cut away, regardless of whether it's on the shoulder strap or on the chest strap - but in most cases it' secured in a bungee loop so it's not a major obstacle.

You bring up an excellent point about the bungees for anything other than a 'dillo style behind the arm loop bungee. But again it's two bolt snaps or two cuts of the bungee to release them.

However my thoughts are that if you just unclip the tanks and remove them, how much need is there to immediately remove the harness? (Assuming a warm water dive with no additional weight?). I'd rather deviate from the normal protocol and get the diver out and on the deck faster to do effective CPR than to mess around removing 5 pounds of harness - and the harness gives you more options to get the diver on deck.

 

[sidemountman]

....... where the ability to inflate, dump and control the ascent are the issues being discussed.

......

The problem is real. There are some configurations that do not easily allow the rise in open water.
In surface is not a big problem, just review some procedures.

 

[Dive-aholic]

Rob, I wasn't referring to Jax, but rather to Spatman's posts number 8 and 20 ( and in general to a couple in between) where the ability to inflate, dump and control the ascent are the issues being discussed.

But you make excellent points about the later evolutions getting the diver out of his or her gear and out of the water. Clipping the inflator hose above the QD on the harness would add one more item that would have to be unclipped or cut away, regardless of whether it's on the shoulder strap or on the chest strap - but in most cases it' secured in a bungee loop so it's not a major obstacle.

You bring up an excellent point about the bungees for anything other than a 'dillo style behind the arm loop bungee. But again it's two bolt snaps or two cuts of the bungee to release them.

However my thoughts are that if you just unclip the tanks and remove them, how much need is there to immediately remove the harness? (Assuming a warm water dive with no additional weight?). I'd rather deviate from the normal protocol and get the diver out and on the deck faster to do effective CPR than to mess around removing 5 pounds of harness - and the harness gives you more options to get the diver on deck.

I agree. The harness may not need to be removed. But I've found in class that the harness can be removed just as fast as the tanks. So at that point it becomes a matter of preference.