Sea Shepherd condemned by International Whaling Commission.

[aquaman_06]

Originally Posted by Kim
Actually - the Japanese are probably among the best in the world at maintaining marine resources
________________________________________________

Kim,

The fact that you may actually believe that is scary. Japan's fish markets are the most active and over abundant in the world. They eat darn near anything with gills or that lives underwater. wake up!

 

[Aquatic Eagle]

With all due respect I am quoting an article in wikipedia if you find any problems with the article go ahead and fix it, make sure you cite sources. But for now I think ill trust the article.

Secondly I wanna make sure I get where you are coming from...Lets use an anology that your average American may be able to understand.

Lets say there a bunch of teens in a parking lot eating some food they got at the local McDonalds. Teens being what they are start throwing the trash on the floor. Just then some Passerby who is sick of seeing trash decides to then shout at the teens to stop. Who being teens laugh ignore him and actually go into their cars to find more trash to throw around.

As a result the man decides to get out of his car with a baseball bat and utterly destroy the kids car. removes the door, pops the hood, smash the engine, destroyes the tires, and overall makes the car unusable.

Is this ok? obviously not, its up to the City and the Police to stop these teens, not this man.

However this is very similar to what your heroes are doing, and you think its ok. "just because they give them warning" that is the most retarded excuse I have ever heard. And as the wikipedia article points out, they have no commission with the international bodies that control the waters they are currently in.

I agree, it's up to the police to stop those teens and the police would stop those teens. This is not a good analogy to use because in your analogy, there are actual authorities that the man could call and the problem would be dealt with by the police. In the case of the Sea Shepherds, they are constantly calling on the governments to take action and it seems to fall on deaf ears. Seeing that nobody else is going to do anything, then they decide to communicate with the people responsible for the act. If attempts at communication are ignored, then they take action. If the governing bodies were using their authority to fix these problems, Sea Shepherds wouldn't be doing what they do.

 

[Kim]

Japan's fish markets are the most active and over abundant in the world. They eat darn near anything with gills or that lives underwater. wake up!

Exactly. Which makes it all the more amazing that their fishing boats still have plenty to catch!

Why do you think that they can do that?

Because they manage their resource so it doesn't become exhausted - unlike the West.

You really don't have a clue do you? If you over-fish you can destroy stocks - like cod and tuna in the N.Atlantic, and problems like the herring in the North Sea. That doesn't happen here. They do deals with the Chinese and the koreans, and while they sometimes fight a bit about it, there's still plenty of fish out there.

 

[Geoff_H]

The fact that you may actually believe that is scary. Japan's fish markets are the most active and over abundant in the world. They eat darn near anything with gills or that lives underwater. wake up!

[/I]

You are confusing eating something with hunting it to extinction. Americans eat a lot of beef but cows are not endangered.

As for fish markets - you are mistaken. Check out a Hong Kong wet market (the one in Causeway Bay is a good example) and you'll see an abundance of overfished species, and many caught with destructive techniques like sodium cyanide.

The Japanese markets are tame in comparison, and you simply don't see the same problems as you do in China and Hong Kong. Even the biggest fish market in Japan (and the world) - Tsujiki doesn't have endangered or overfished species for sale, nor the "luxury" live fish like Napolean wrasse.

Did you ever try to visit any fish markets before making such a bold claim?

 

[Geoff_H]

In the case of the Sea Shepherds, they are constantly calling on the governments to take action and it seems to fall on deaf ears. Seeing that nobody else is going to do anything, then they decide to communicate with the people responsible for the act. If attempts at communication are ignored, then they take action. If the governing bodies were using their authority to fix these problems, Sea Shepherds wouldn't be doing what they do.

OK here is an analogy you might understand.

Lets say we have a group called the Veggie Warriors. They believe that cutting down Amazonian rainforest to graze cattle to feed McDonalds burgers to fat Americans is morally wrong and rephrensible.

Many people around the world think this is a problem, and agree with the Veggie Warriors.

However the American corporations are not breaking any laws, and no government wants to intervene to stop them, despite the well documented problems caused by deforestation.

Are the Veggie Warriors justified in attacking logging trucks, harrassing loggers and trying to prevent them working? Can they burn the trucks, vilify the staff and throw acid at them? Even though the loggers are doing nothing illegal, no government wants to intervene and many people around the world believe in the Veggie Warriors cause?

 

[Kim]

I agree, it's up to the police to stop those teens and the police would stop those teens. This is not a good analogy to use because in your analogy, there are actual authorities that the man could call and the problem would be dealt with by the police. In the case of the Sea Shepherds, they are constantly calling on the governments to take action and it seems to fall on deaf ears. Seeing that nobody else is going to do anything, then they decide to communicate with the people responsible for the act. If attempts at communication are ignored, then they take action. If the governing bodies were using their authority to fix these problems, Sea Shepherds wouldn't be doing what they do.

I have a feeling that you're trying to do the right thing but some of your perceptions seem a little naive. (no insult intended)

I wonder how you'll feel when Sea Shepherd causes someones death. Personally I think that's just a question of time - and please remember....you'll be partly responsible due to the support you give them.

Governments DO take action. Taking the law into your own hands is pure vigilantism....and wrong. That's what civilization is all about - the rule of law.

 

[aquaman_06]

One thing you have forgotten Geoff_H is that whaling is illegal.

This comparison might work better. Say a rare species of bobcat exists in PA. The animal is hunted and scientists and professionals from the state of PA say that the cat is endangered so it is then put on the endangered species list or given a threatened status and placed under protection of law. Though the local Japanese population likes to eat the cat's meat in a Cat and Rice dish they serve in their restaurant. So they are sneaking through the woods killing the endangered cat even though its illegal to do so and trying to say they are killing the animals for research.

Sadly the PA fish and wildlife service does not have the funds or manpower/equipment to police and enforce the law that declares the bobcat protected. Although, there is a conservation group that goes around throwing stink bombs at the bobcat hunters and slashes their tires and smashes up the vehicles they use to hunt. With no other option and on vote through the town council (much like the voting processes on island nations that request sea shepards help) the PA fish and wildlife commission asks the conservation group to enforce the law protecting the bobcat making sure no one is hurt or killed. They do so and the Japanese people can no longer easily kill these cats without the groups interference.

 

[Rainer]

One thing you have forgotten Geoff_H is that whaling is illegal.

This comparison might work better. Say a rare species of bobcat exists in PA. The animal is hunted and scientists and professionals from the state of PA say that the cat is endangered so it is then put on the endangered species list or given a threatened status and placed under protection of law. Though the local Japanese population likes to eat the cat's meat in a Cat and Rice dish they serve in their restaurant. So they are sneaking through the woods killing the endangered cat even though its illegal to do so and trying to say they are killing the animals for research.

Sadly the PA fish and wildlife service does not have the funds or manpower/equipment to police and enforce the law that declares the bobcat protected. Although, there is a conservation group that goes around throwing stink bombs at the bobcat hunters and slashes their tires and smashes up the vehicles they use to hunt. With no other option and on vote through the town council (much like the voting processes on island nations that request sea shepards help) the PA fish and wildlife commission asks the conservation group to enforce the law protecting the bobcat making sure no one is hurt or killed. They do so and the Japanese people can no longer easily kill these cats without the groups interference.

Please cite the international law that governs whaling nations as to their illegal practices.

 

[Kim]

One thing you have forgotten Geoff_H is that whaling is illegal.

Oh dear...

...it isn't.

This is such a popular misconception that it proves the old Harry Nilsson adage..."You see what ya wanna see, and you hear what you wanna hear.."

The Japanese do not act illegally. On the other hand....Sea Shepherd does.

 

[Kim]

Please cite the international law that governs whaling nations as to their illegal practices.

He can't....

....doesn't exist.

He's up Deep Creek without a paddle.....