Scuba diver dies after being found floating at Kurnell, NSW, Australia

[buddhasummer]

I don't know how they evaluate,either but every class that I've DM'd, which isn't many,but is with different instructors,some private,some with shops,they all do the tours this way. Instructor in front and me sweeping up the rear. Some instructors swim backwards but most don't.

DMing, this too has always been my experience.

 

[diverrex]

I've been reading and interpreting the information given as four separated divers and a dive gone bad. One of them experienced a reasonably predictable problem that killed her. What if it were one of the others that experienced some acute problem? I don't see this as three perfect buddies and a muppet like everyone else does. The truth is usally best found by starting from somewhere near the middle, usually leaves one much less ground to cover.

I have said everything that I wish to say in this thread and I'm not looking to get myself banned. With this, I will take my personal biases and leave.

It's been stated often in other threads that sometimes a buddy group of three or two teams of two buddies is sometimes not as safe as just a two person buddy team when the group all start diving loosley with each other. I know I have been on dives in such situations where I may make it clear the strict buddy assignments and state that if our buddy team gets separated we will not search for the other team but will continue our dive. In those instances we all dive in strict buddy configuration. Other times I'll admit diving in two buddy team pairs where it seems like we even switch buddies underwater without any formal ackowledgment of that and are diving much looser as a group. Not saying it is right just not that unusual in a group of 4 experienced buddies.

Also not saying it's right but it's not unusual after surfacing for buddy protocal to diminish on either the surface swim or if descending shallow to get back to the boat or shore. In this particular case it seems like 3 divers surfaced near each other with Quero a distance away. Once Quero declined to rejoin them the three descended roughly together. It's possible had it been a buddy team of only two that even if Quero declined coming nearer her buddy that that buddy would have then swam over to Quero before the redescent.

One of the big lessons of this incident is that the dive isn't over till everyone is back on the boat or shore. This isn't the first death that has happened after divers have surfaced and the dive was "over".

 

[broadreach]

One of the big lessons of this incident is that the dive isn't over till everyone is back on the boat or shore. This isn't the first death that has happened after divers have surfaced and the dive was "over".

To me this is the biggest take away from this accident. I think that it is very natural and common for divers (myself included) to significantly lower their guard at that stage of the dive, thinking that it is basically over. This is particularly the case where surface conditions are benign and depth is very shallow as was the case here.

It reminds me of the often quoted stats about high percentage of car crashes taking place near the driver's home.

 

[tracydr]

I've been on shore dives where the most difficult and dangerous part of the dive is getting out of the water.

 

[Diver0001]

DMing, this too has always been my experience.

It's not the only thing I do differently than other instructors but I much prefer for the DM to lead the dive so I can put my attention on other things that I think matter more...

In fact Tracy's whole anti-PADI line is something I don't see happening around me much. I guess we don't hang in similar circles.

R..

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

I don't know how they evaluate,either but every class that I've DM'd, which isn't many,but is with different instructors,some private,some with shops,they all do the tours this way. Instructor in front and me sweeping up the rear. Some instructors swim backwards but most don't.

Unless they're using mirrors or something, it's doubtful there's any evaluating going on then ... I've yet to meet a human with eyes in the back of their head, and you can't evaluate what you don't see ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[buddhasummer]

Unless they're using mirrors or something, it's doubtful there's any evaluating going on then ... I've yet to meet a human with eyes in the back of their head, and you can't evaluate what you don't see ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

Agree, but nonetheless every course I've ever assisted on I've been the last to descend, followed at the back and been the last to ascend. Like Tracydr this had also been with various instructors. Not bashing PADI just stating a fact from my experience. I always assumed my role was more to keep an eye on the group. Not being an instructor I never gave the point you make any thought, but yes thinking about it seems odd.

This whole sad situation had certainly made me think very long and hard about the way I dive and how my group as a whole dives. Upon reflection I realise I/we need to make some changes. This weekend is our last wet dive of the season together so will discuss things with my group. It will be a sad dive under the circumstances but a wholly necessary one. I just wish the catalyst was a different one.

 

[beaverdivers]

Stand by for a few minutes and I'll get responses to these questions.

Quero was last seen at approx 80 minutes into the dive at a depth of ~ 2.5 meters. She had moved shallower (closer to shore?) than where they ascended. Distance from the shore when they surfaced for bearings was ~50-60m

Approximately 3 minutes after that, buddies surfaced in ~1.5 meters of water. There was no sign of Quero and a search commenced.

Viz during the dive was ~15m. Decreased near the shore to ~5m

No info regarding her camera/pics or the other questions at this time.

Thank You & Clownfishsydney & Denis Sydney & all other posts that have given us details on this terrible incident.

Reading this thread, different songs have popped in my mind - from "Puff the Magic Dragon" by Peter, Paul & Mary

to "Roll Me Up & Smoke Me When I Die" by Willie Nelson. However, I am sure there are more appropriate songs to immoratalize Quero.

 

[Hawkwood]

Agree, but nonetheless every course I've ever assisted on I've been the last to descend, followed at the back and been the last to ascend. Like Tracydr this had also been with various instructors. Not bashing PADI just stating a fact from my experience. I always assumed my role was more to keep an eye on the group. Not being an instructor I never gave the point you make any thought, but yes thinking about it seems odd.

This whole sad situation had certainly made me think very long and hard about the way I dive and how my group as a whole dives. Upon reflection I realise I/we need to make some changes. This weekend is our last wet dive of the season together so will discuss things with my group. It will be a sad dive under the circumstances but a wholly necessary one. I just wish the catalyst was a different one.

You can lead dives 2, 3, and 4. Next time talk to the Instructor and you take the lead. He follows behind, around, etc. and can evaluate the students that way.

 

[GRH]

First, my sincerest condolences to Quero’s family, dive group, personal friends and extended Scubaboard friends.

I am having trouble understanding how a diver, if the assumed reports are accurate, with their BCD full of air could be found on the bottom and if I remember after skimming this thread, be difficult to bring up once found. I want to learn from this since I am in similar gear and scenarios on a regular basis, with the regular and local dive spot variable the significant difference.

If I surface with a group near shore in shallow water and we agree to descend rather than surface swim to get to the shore and my head is only going to be 4 feet from the surface if I stand up, I certainly feel I could swim to the surface without any air in my drysuit or BC. Did the dive buddy also have a camera? If ending a dive and slowly swimming to shore in an area you might find the subject you are looking to shoot, I can imagine my buddy awareness would be lower than normal. Some reflection is apparently needed on my part.

The following is just additional context and I don’t mean to hijack the thread. I just want to make sure I think through how I have planned similar dives in the past at how I can improve those plans in the future.

I am a relatively new diver with most of my ~ 70 dives in the cool green water of Puget Sound. I dive with a dry suit and carry a full frame DSLR housing equipped with a pair of strobes. I sense I may be overweight with 34 pounds and HP steel tanks now that I have gained experience. I imagine I wear more thermal protection due to lower water temperatures but the reported weight of 26 pounds doesn’t sound that high.

When near the end of a dive in shallow water I sense a need to vent my drysuit and BC as much as I can in order to maintain neutral buoyancy. I can’t observe the bubble in my BC so I can’t be certain how much is vented but staying down, while not difficult by any means, is more of a challenge than surfacing once I get above 20 feet.

If my quick research is accurate, Leafy Sea dragons are most commonly found in water 4 to 15 meters deep. In Puget Sound we have Pacific Spiny Lumpsucker’s and while smaller than Leafy Sea Dragons, are found at similar depths, many times in seaweed or kelp beds. For this reason I tend to tolerate a little extra weight in order to stay stable near the bottom while taking pictures. I also find the head down, legs at 90 degree orientation allows air to accumulate in my feet at times, resulting in a frustrating loss of trim just as I line up my shot.

When I find the elusive subject, I do tend to get very focused, pardon the pun, realize time can pass resulting in a possibility routine checks of depth, air, buddy, etc. are delayed. I don't think I miss the appropriate checks and if I do, fortunately have a regular dive buddy who doesn’t carry a camera and our plan and communication accounts for this. If I am diving with another photographer who might simultaneously become engaged with a subject to photograph, I adjust and I still feel prepared to deal with most any situation at that depth other than entanglement or medical catastrophe. There is still much I don't know about what I don't know.